"However, I've seen people turn in receipts for $5!"-- I wish my jw would turn in receipts for gas usage during fs!!!!!
The Congregation just paid flowers and other expensive for the PO COBE who died two weeks ago?
Kingdom Halls are being asked to take on debt to build Circuit Overseer's Retirement homes! It does not seem right to pay for flowers, I don't recall ever seeing this take place either. Was he part of the "in crowd", who lead a brilliantly exemplary life? The Society is creating more bitterness, by having the elders beg for money for "Traveling Brother's Rest home Kingdom Hall Homes.
The Traveling Brothers deserve the same retiremment plan they insisted the life-time pioneers brothers and sisters to accept. Why burden the congregation any further, I would rather have helped missonaries who served in a foriegn field, not little princes whose meals, expenses, cars, lodging and cash was assured. Let them return to Bethel, have Bethel use their funds to pay for their own middle managers!
Apotheosis, I agree with you, usually those who have money or are in the "in crowd" are favored over those not "in" or don't have money. Dealing with this economic downturn is hard enough for most people, they
should not be asked to support the retirement of anyone else but themselves.
I've seen flowers purchased for many funerals, elderly single sisters as well as elders.
LITS, "I"m sorry they were so inconsiderant of you and your husband. I don't blame you for being bitter. As talesin said "let it out and vent!!!"
@ carla - LOL - they view fs as a "personal ministry" not as a part of the operation of the kh so no chance on reimbursement locally. However, I have seen some publishers record their mileage used in fs and then claim it as a charitable contribution. I believe the IRS allows that or at least the folks that I know have done it have never been audited. As a taxpayer, that really ticks me off. If you want to waste your time driving around bothering other people, fine but don't ask the government to pay for it!
I think the congregation paying for flowers is pretty common.
I've never heard of them paying for a dinner though. However, if the brother was "prominent" then it doesn't surprise me.
I think some people are getting confused with CoBE and CO. The CoBE is the old presiding overseer not the circuit overseer. I think it is actually a nice gesture. Unfortunately as has been said earlier I wonder if it would happen if the deceased was just an ordinary Joe Publisher.
Thanks everyone this brother was very, very prominent, like a little God in the hall.
What upset me was when my parents died I could barley use the hall to have their memorial. At the time my husband too had also been an elder for over 25 years but because my parents were not liked by most of the elders and were viewed as trouble makers the elders were hedging letting me use the hall. My parents were not DF'ed or reproved just very mentally ill. I grew up in the hall and everyone knew my parents were abusive but no one did a thing to help me as a kid. Then I grew up and stupidly embraced the religion, pioneered, went to Bethel married an elder, I did everything that none of the elders kids did and yet I came from one of the worst families around. I truly now think I ticked the elders off by being to much into the "truth." I mean how could my scummy low life parents produce a child who wanted the "truth" and here their kids were throwing the religion in their face.
I never got any flowers given to me for my parents only HELL from the elders. My my parents died in 2003 and 2005 and I almost had a nervous break down from the stress of the elders, I would go to the meetings and sit there crying my eyes out while my husband was being used to conduct the WT or do his other elder's things and NO SAID A word to me expect one elder to tell me I was a horrible daughter to my parents. My husband told me to consider the source about that elder. I thought a lot about suicide during that time.
Than when my husbands mom died in 2009 she lived about 800 miles from us. My husband and one of his sisters are both in the "truth" the other two were raised around the stupid religion. One granddaughter is very into the religion and her husband is an elder. We were all there for my MIL's memorial, my husband and I had to travel the most distance but the others still traveled about 500 miles. NOT ONE PERSON in the hall offered us any help or meals or ANYTHING. I mean here we had to drive the whole day check into a hotel, pay for meals. There were no flowers from the hall, NOTHING!!! I was still going to all the meetings at the time. I looked at my strong in the "truth" sister-in-law and wondered what in the world was going trough her mind at the lack of love the congregation was showing us but she was upset at losing her mom. Her ultra strong in the truth daughter and her husband who I hardly know were really sort of into themselves. My other SIL who was raised around the religion was crying her eyes out and some stupid elder came up to her and told her you know you would not need to be crying like you are if you joined us. My none JW SIL was pissed off to no end at this elder saying that to her. She told me just recently about this as she thought I was still in the religion. She was shocked and happy that I have left it and has told me she just could never buy into what she was taught as a kid. I wish I had been that bright, but anywho I was not sadly enough.
My non JW SIL said it was what she had expected with how the hall treated us. I mean no one even offered us a cup of coffee, we just went to the memorial heard a stupid sales pitch and that was it. The speaker did come and shake my husbands and my hand and when he realized that we were the ones my MIL talked about being at Bethel he started to really name drop as it appeared that he too had been at Bethel for one year in the mid 70's. He was very proud that he had worked with Philip Brumley before Philip became a big shot lawyer for Bethel. I was thinking to myself at the time, 'this is so stupid here we are here for my MIL's memorial and you are brown nosing us thinking we have an in at Bethel as he did not know my husband had just been deleted for the whole pedophile thing.
Anyway I digress bottom line after all we have done in our lives and how we were treated it just makes me so very bitter that the hall just bought flowers and food for this 'GOD' of theirs.
Yes I now know we could have turned in the receipts to get paid for the flowers we were demanded to buy for the assemblies but at the time I was a young new bride and I knew nothing of how things worked. I was 24 years and like I said coming form a hated family in the religion, my husband had just been given the assignment of buying the flowers right we were first married, he received a letter in the mail telling him he needed to do buy them and nothing else. There was nothing telling us to turn in the receipts. No one ever asked us for any receipts. All I got was grief and put downs because I did not buy more expensive flowers. I will never forget the assembly where I had been lucky fortunate to find flowers on sale at a huge discount. They needed water and they looked or so I thought really good, that was all expect for one poor plaint. Well on Sunday morning this plant decided it had had enough of his torture of being at the assembly and really started to wilt. It had looked good when we left the night before. As soon as I walked into the door this elder came up to me, NOT MY HEAD, my elder husband but to ME and produced to yell at me telling me that the plaint looked like someone had stepped on it and it was horrible of me to have such a plant there. I just really wanted to sit down and cry. At that point I really could do nothing but water it and hope it would perk up. I told my husband how mean the elder had been to me and my husband who in all fairness to him was loaded down with way to much other stuff to do, told me he found it hard to believe the elder was so rude as he had never seen this elder act that way to anyone. I hated myself so much that day.
So, now they are asking for money to build retirement homes for COs???
This hypocritical religion can go to hell.
I am glad I am no longer active in this religion because I cannot tolerate any of this garbage. I could not sit there and listen to this shit.
LITS, I hate all things JW, but not with your passion. Along with that hate, I try try try to balance it with some reasonableness. But it can be hard to do that.
Your second post on this thread helps immensely with why you would be upset at this. I do know of congregations that would foot the bill for flowers and even possibly assist with the dinner for a JW that needed such help. Your experiences with the congregations being difficult about even using the KH for elderly members is sad. And I have heard mixed stories about people not helping in such situations, so I am not surprised at some of what you say.
As far as the COBE's flowers and a bit more, it would be normal in a church to do that for the preacher/pastor/reverend. So I wouldn't be too upset that they did this. It probably sours you that they did this to make "him" look more prominent than the likes of people like your parents, but that is the norm in all the churches- special treatment for those closer to the top of management. It is also sad that his family didn't need help with the dinner, but got it anyway, while lowly publishers and inactive elderly ones would never be extended such a courtesy.
So I turn such bitterness toward the organization. They are supposed to be better than "Christendom" but they are not. They should have treated your parents' death with more respect and bought some flowers, but their cult training wouldn't let them. They are not supposed to treat elders and C.O.'s better, but they do.
You already discussed the receipts for the SAD flowers. Your husband, I am positive, knows he could have turned in receipts. He didn't tell you that because of your passion about such things and because you are more concerned about balancing the checkbook than he is. He knew you would have insisted on turning in receipts and he didn't want to- he wanted to make up for his and your spiritual shortcomings by buying the flowers for God's organization. That's cult training again. Place guilt on the members and they will either do your bidding or try to make up for it with cash.