by EdenOne 233 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
Cofty and Viviane and others with your viewpoint why bother engaging eden one and outlaw? It seems like you give credibility to a subject that doesn't merit it. A duplicate in essence of the last one on absentheism.
Because it may help others to see critical thinking in action that may not have been exposed to it yet. Also, I have had people who were die hard theist tell me that I helped them eventually realize the fallacies in their reasoning.
so what have we got from this thread apart from lots of romance and tragedy
lack of evidence leads to lack of knowledge which leads to agnosticism and not to atheism.
Atheism itself stems from lack of belief in God and lack of belief in God's existence.
Both sides, thiests and atheists can turn the question Where is your evidence? around and point it back at the one who ask's it.
so an atheist may say: where is y our evidence that God exists?
a theist can reply: where is your evidence that he does not? (thanks viv)
a theist can take it further when athesits are being insulting and say: don't sweat it we are both believers. Have a nice day.
Indeed atheists who want a more civil debate can use the same tactics and keep repeating. But then again I always leave the door open for enlightenment radicalism --- hmmmm....need to think this through a little more
Azor: Cofty and Viviane and others with your viewpoint why bother engaging eden one and outlaw? It seems like you give credibility to a subject that doesn't merit it.
To begin with, if you don't like this thread, you can chose not to read it. Easy. However, many do and, even if they don't have light bulb moments, at least they can see that this isn't all black and white. It's more complicated and nuanced than hard theists and hard atheists usually claim it is. So, I think a thread like this is useful, even if, as you said, is at times discussing things "out there".
Discussions about words aren't exactly "triffles"; only for those with lazy minds. Definitions matter, especially when one is trying to determine exactly where he/she stands.
This thread started out by making a question: What exactly is "belief"? When an atheist claims he lacks belief, what exactly is that belief that's lacking? Is that lack of belief a belief in itself? That's what we've been discussing. It's not irrelevant.
The tactic of not "discussing with theists because it lends credence to their claims" is advocated by modern atheists. But this question is being made by a non-theist. So basically you suggest that atheists should only debate with other atheists? Isn't that some sort of intellectual masturbation? Or isn't that a sign of lazyness?
Eden
Ruby, thanks for putting it in such a succint way.
Eden
Viviane: You're adorable
awww shucks! Thanks!!
(fallacy of taking out of context)
Eden
eden, this post from an atheist is great and I like it so much i am reposting it
onthewayout said
"Belief" or "believing in" someone or something is just as the opening post said. Also, "faith/faith-in". And it varies a bit from person to person. Having been on the other side of "belief in God," I get that many will continue to have belief. I might debate on the forum, but I really know that people are on their own journey and I won't browbeat those that don't insist on their beliefs being put upon others.But as former JW's, we need to understand the passion of those who are sure they are right. I have occasionally not reminded myself of that and I will try harder.
Certainly, belief in some kind of creator is vastly different than the fire-and-brimstone preaching of hard core Christians or Muslims. Most "believers" are closing the gaps on the god-of-the-gaps and accepting what science offers, but just not letting go of an intelligence behind it all. I admire their optimism.
Back up the first post with Evidence against God..... - Outlaw
define "god" - Cofty
You want me to define God??!!...... LOL!!.. - Outlaw
This is the very definition of obtuse.
Both sides, thiests and atheists can turn the question Where is your evidence? - Ruby
And in response atheists can provide mountains of objective evidence, while those who value faith can provide none.
What is obtuse is insisting in trying to engage a non-theist with a question that should be directed at a theist. You won't get a reply from a non-theist. Why do you insist?
Eden
