I have just read something which actually mensions theocratic warfare tactics with court cases...they really are evil aren't they the WTBTS..?
"THEY" are here right now. I don't want them to come around again, ever!!
You have to keep cool. You start with the ultimatums, you persecute her,you decide to break up, could all backfire on you. You can come off as paranoid, or they can twist it to make it seem you never loved her and you're using the religion as a cop out. The tougher you are the more you will drive her to them.Read up on mind control and how to counter it. Combatting Cult Mind Control by Steve Hassan and Freeminds.org has a short ebook using the principles from this book ton help people with Watchtower. Please play it cool. Persecution makes them stronger.
I'll send you a PM
On another thread about the blood issue I suggested Googling Jonestown as an example of how otherwise decent people can be manipulated to believe in the need to sacrifice their lives as well as their children. The visual is powerful........ the story is unreal. If you don't know about this incident you AND your wife should. These were not JWS however but the same result is happening in hospital rooms and behind closed doors on a daily basis.
Jesus weeps (old Irish saying).
P.S. For you JW lurkers on this forum please check this out.
I know others have mentioned it, but I will add to one point. I know it’s difficult right now, but you need to do your very best to try to keep cool, and really watch what you say. Any verbal attacks leveled at the group only reinforce your wife’s beliefs that the Jehovah’s Witnesses have the truth.
Jehovah’s Witnesses teach new recruits that any opposition from family is evidence that Satan is trying to break their faith. This especially applies to unbelieving spouses such as yourself. I think the wise thing to do is not try to make the custody of your son an issue right now. The chances of your son ever needing a blood transfusion are statistically very slim. However, if it were to come up, many judges are very sympathetic to people like you. The media is on your side as well.
Don’t take any actions or say things that will make your wife believe that she is being “persecuted”. Jehovah’s Witnesses will only use that as ammunition against you, and then will say “but, look at how loving all of us are to you”.
You can in a kind way let her know that you have strong concerns and see teachings of theirs that are false. If you can do this in a kind, gentle way – demonstrating concern; you just might get her to listen to you a little bit.
You have a PM, (upper right hand corner where envelop shows),, example of their "theocractic warfare."
TRAILERFITTER- I agree with what Jeremy C says. Very good points. Yet I'd stay firm on the blood transfusion issue regarding your son as you being the main contact and power of attorney. You may not be able to control your adult wife - but you deserve and have the legal right to say what medical procedures are done on your son. Good luck to you. We at the board are here for you friend
Virtually everything already stated here is accurate or brings out some very good points, dear TF (peace to you!). You cannot fight the WTBTS "fire" with your own "fire" - won't work; rather, it will only play into their hands and add fuel. Any negativity you exhibit they've already warned your wife about (or will, just as soon as those women tell them what you said). They've been doing this a whole lot longer than you... and are experts at it. Novices don't break up families like these folks can and do. They have methods and procedures even some of us may not be aware of.
Your best defense? SPEND TIME WITH YOUR SON. Get to know him... and let him get to know YOU. That way, all the things they say about you (and they're going to say things about you... to your wife... and to him, if they get the chance - as will your wife)... HE will know are not true. NOT because you tell him they aren't... but because he knows YOU. TALK with him. About everything... EXCEPT your wife (his mother)... her beliefs... and the WTBTS. Do NOT go there! Always, ALWAYS... speak of his mother with kindness and love. I am not saying to fake it, but I am saying to RESPECT that that is his mother. Do NOT be the cause of [the] division! Do NOT try to get him to turn against his mother! Because that can be "damaging" to HIM and, as some pointed out, backfire!).
Speak about her as you would want someone to speak of YOUR mother. When he asks about her faith, simply tell him that you don't agree... and why. Don't make it personal ("Well, those people are kooks!"). He will not necessarily see that (and if he does, it should be something HE gets, not something someone makes him see).
Find out what HE likes... what HE'S interested... and be interested in it, too, for HIM. Make HIM your first and foremost concern. SHOW him that you love HIM.
And do NOT argue with his mother... about this or ANY matter... in front of him or where he can see it. Indeed, if you can, NEVER let him see your anger at her (or the WTBTS), but rather, your tolerance.
Only you can disspell the things the WTBTS and its members say about non-JWs... by YOUR conduct. If you do ANY of the things they say you will (and, again, they are going to say things)... then you are creating just as much doubt and confusion in your dear son's head as they are. Be the OPPOSITE of what they say apostates, atheists, non-JWs, "the world", etc. is like. And he will see... and know... for HIMSELF.
If it does come down to custody, please... please... do NOT "fight" over your son. Ask him what HE wants (beyond his parents staying together, which may not be possible)... and help HIM fight FOR that. Even if it means he appears to want her "more." Folks really have to realize that in these kinds of situations it is NOT about you, your marriage, your spouse, your relationship with your spouse, the WTBTS, or anything else... except the child(ren). It is about the child(ren)... and ONLY the child(ren). NOTHING else matters... when there is a difference of opinion as to how to raise the child(ren). Losing sight of this... and seeking one's own selfish gain... including custody... can severely damage, if not "kill" a child altogether... emotionally, psychologically and sometimes, ultimately physically.
I hope this helps. May JAH bless and, again, peace to you!
A slave of Christ,
I suggest -- and have elsewhere suggested under similar circumstances -- that the proper response for you, trailerfitter, is to go apeshit. Be an ass, be impolite, mock, denegrate, fight mean (obviously, nothing physical, as I feel bound to point out). You can't, after all, change what people think, you can only increase the costs for things people do. So, rains the costs.
Mine is clearly a minority viewpoint here. But there it is.
They absolutely will go behind your back and tell your wife to lie to you, they did with my jw. Protect your child. If you are truly considering getting out and bringing your child with you learn all you can, document what you need to and maybe check out this site http://www.jehovahswitnessesexperts.com/ or google jw's & child custody for more help.
This will not likely blow over and she will get more resolute the more you oppose it. In my house I did not (still don't) allow any wt literature to be out in plain site. Well, he could leave it out but then I will leave out the most wreched jw news stories, all my apostate books, etc.... The home needs to be a neutral place for your marriage and having anything jw out is like having jw -ism thrown in your face 24/7. Same goes for apostate stuff for them I'm sure, a constant reminder of your impending 'doom'. Make an agreement to have the home a sanctuary for your family. Another reason for this is so that the jw does not go into cult mode everytime they see an Awake or wt. They must make an effort to find somewhere away from the family to go 'study'. Do this and the jw will have more moments of their authentic personality than if you don't. Will it be a hellish fight to get this done? quite possibly but it will be worth it in the long run.
Would your wife like it if you invited Wiccan's (pick your evil group they are fearful of) or apostates over? Then she should treat you with equal respect and not have jw's in your house. If she doesn't want you exposing your child to apostate get togethers then she should not be exposing your child to jw's.
Only you can decide what is best for you and your family, sometimes staying gives you more control than leaving. All depends on the situation.
I wish you all the best,
This is probably the best time your wife will have with the Witnesses. After baptism, the love bombing and constant visits will end, and she will be on her own. It's all downhill after baptism, into a life of disappointment and intellectual dishonesty. If you can hang in there for a few years, your wife may lose her enthusiasm for the Watchtower Society.