The JW's dependence on WT literature.

by Knowsnothing 93 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • godrulz

    Paul's statement was before the closing of the canon. He also said 2 Tim. 3:16. The Church (are you Catholic?) does defend the closed canon now, something Paul did not have for the NT when he said I Tim. Peter considered Paul's writings to be Scripture and inspired (2 Peter 3:16). The Church does defend and proclaim the source of truth, God's Word. No church is infallible (papacy, WT, LDS error) and no church tradition is on par with Scripture.

    What is your faith background and what are you getting at?

  • MrFreeze

    What would the JWs do if you said you would study but only if you exclusively used the Bible.

  • Knowsnothing
    What would the JWs do if you said you would study but only if you exclusively used the Bible.

    I have heard of some intelligent, prepared individuals that give studies with the Bible only. However, I suppose they must walk their study through all the necessary doctrine, so that they may be able to answer the million questions posed at baptism.

    And obviously, they must accept the organisation.

    The Kingdom Ministry of November 1990, pg.1 says (translated from Spanish), "They (bible study) must recognize that their identifying with Jehovah's organisation is necessary for their salvation. That's why, as soon as a bible study is established, we must begin to direct the person to the organisation."

  • godrulz

    Take away their literature and most JWs could not play Bible hop scotch. I can use the Bible and talk circles around them (I have to go find someone who knows the answers). When they use their literature, they can talk circles around the uninformed public.

  • Isidore

    Godrulz, I was a JW for about 25 years and I am entering the Catholic Church next Easter Vigil. The question was to ask you what church was Paul referring to?

    In regards to 2 Timothy 3:16, that verse says that Scripture is beneficial, not sufficent. The bible never claims that it itself is the sole rule of faith. If it were, it would be self interpreting, which it certainly cannot be, since we have about 40,000 denominations in the Christian world today all claiming to have the truth and "we follow only the bible". The bible alone, or, Sola Scriptura, is an invention that came along during the Protestant Revolution and was unknown in the Christian world for 1500 years. The WTBS is the logical conclusion of this doctrine, for not only did they claim the bible alone (which you and I both know they don't do, which is what the original poster is getting at), but they then changed Sacred Scripture to defend their doctrine.

    If find it intersting that you think that no church is on "par w/ scripture", since it was the Catholic Church that determined what made up the "biblia". Christ founded a Church (Matt. 16), which in turn gave birth to tradition, and that tradition then produced the bible. If God guided the Church in determining what was to make up the canon, it would naturally follow that that same Church would be the infallible interpreter. Christ promised he would guide the Church into all truth in John 16:12-15 and promised perpetuity in Matthew 16:18 and Matthew 28:20.

    Can anyone read the bible? Of course. But can everyone correctly interpret what it means? The bible itself shows that one needs the living faith community that produced it to understand it (Acts 8:26-31).

    May the Peace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with you always

  • WontLeave

    One of my favorite Watchtower quotes about how their word is superior to God's word:

    The world is full of Bibles, which Book contains the commandments of God. Why, then, do the people not know which way to go? Because they do not also have the teaching or law of the mother, which is light. Jehovah God has provided his holy written Word for all mankind and it contains all the information that is needed for men in taking a course leading to life. But God has not arranged for that Word to speak independently or to shine forth life-giving truths by itself. His Word says: “Light is sown for the righteous.” (Ps. 97:11) It is through his organization that God provides this light that the proverb says is the teaching or law of the mother. If we are to walk in the light of truth we must recognize not only Jehovah God as our Father but his organization as our mother. - w5/1/1957 p.274

    I include this with some other juicy tidbits in my paper, "Do Christians Have Human Leaders?"

  • godrulz

    There are interesting parallels between WT and RC. Isidore: I trust that you have a love relationship with the Lord Jesus Christ and are not just a nominal, ritualistic, religious Catholic. Paul was not referring to the Roman Catholic Church (came much later in church history), but the universal, invisible Body of Christ (believers) and local church expressions of this reality. RC has to many extra/contrabiblical teachings, but I appreciate there defense of a sound doctrine of God/Christology. I also share common moral values (relating to abortion, homosexuality, etc., but have deep concerns about priesthood, child abuse, etc.).

  • cofty

    Trembling and bewildered, the women went out and fled from the tomb. They said nothing to anyone, because they were afraid. - Mark16:8

    If you could stop posturing for a minute could you confirm whether you accept that Mark 16:8 is the last verse we now have that was part of the original gospel and do you beieve that was the end when it was first written?

  • Cali Guy
    Cali Guy

    I like your thoughts KNOWSNOTHING. I saw a very interesting post just the other day where a JW was arguing with a very intelligent non JW on facebook. The argument went on for ages, but one comment that really stuck out for me was, when the non JW made the point that he had read the bible thoroughly. The JW came back at him by saying, that he (I'm not quoting as I don't feel like reading it again) couldn't understand what he was reading based on interpretation. As if the only interpretation of the bible could come from a small room in Brooklyn. To be honest, 21 years as a born in JW, the idea of other interpretation never entered my mind. Talk about some successful mind control!

  • WTWizard

    How often do they use the littera-trash as a substitute for their conscience? Never mind the Bible--they can't even make a basic decision without looking up the Washtowel littera-trash. Do you want to accept a piece of music? Never mind listening to it and deciding if it's fit--you first have to consult the Washtowel index. Is that job for you? You must research it through the Washtowel index. Should you move--to another country, another city, or simply next door? Make sure you look at your Washtowel index and do the research through that first (as well as "where the need is greater"--meaning you should move to Bangladesh instead of Chile.

    They claim that they could, if necessary, use just the Bible. Yet they will not practice doing that for the day they might have to. Already there have been scattered situations where they could preach, but they had to use a Catholic Bible to do so. What if they had to do that today? And, in countries with well developed Internet systems like the United States, Japan, China, Canada, or England? I doubt they would do more than fall flat on their faces.

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