IF? Lets keep it at that.
1975
What If The Bible Had Never Existed???
by ziddina 82 Replies latest jw friends
-
-
FlyingHighNow
As if the Bible is the only book or thing that has been a cause of man's inhumanity to man.
-
ziddina
Crap, I just realized that I got my invasions scrambled...
Vlad Tepes stopped the Ottoman empire from invading further into the central southern areas of Europe - the Slavic areas...
The Mongols were stopped in Poland...
Two different invading forces...
One might postulate that the Ottoman empire also might not have arisen if the bible had never existed and the Koran - being loosely associated with biblical mythology - also didn't come to be written...
I suspect that many major invasions and conquests would still have happened. The Romans probably would have made it up to the British Isles anyway, because they were there before Christianity arose.
But the face of the world would be very different today, nonetheless....
There never would have been any Crusades.... No witch burnings... No 'heretic' burnings... Many of the sub-cultures that were wiped out by Christianity might have flourished and have affected world history in ways we can't even begin to imagine...
Henry the Eighth wouldn't have had to 'break away' from the - whoops... Well, England wouldn't have had 'common faith' with Europe, anyway, so the marriage between an English prince and a Spanish princess might not have taken place...
-
tec
Do you realize how much power you have given the bible, Zid? More power than it actually has, I think. Probably more power even than the people who believe in it.
People would still have committed war. Atrocity. Crusades of a sort. Genocide. ETC. They just wouldn't have done it while claiming the bible backed them in what they would have found another reason to do anyway.
The bible hasn't even been in existence for two thousand years.
I know that you equate the bible with the beginning of the God and Father of Christ, the God of Abraham. The God of Moses. But we who believe in the God and Father of Christ don't believe He came into existence with the creation of the bible. Only that this was when people started writing things down with some of the understanding they were receiving. But He sure didn't communicate with any of them via the bible.
Peace,
Tammy
-
FlyingHighNow
They'd have found other reasons to burn people.
-
ziddina
Flying High Now, I'll address your question in another thread, but it's not going to happen soon... If you'd do some research on your own, you'd probably find what I've already found; that most small tribal groups had their own individual "deities" - and someone else already posted an answer along these lines, on this thread...
As the separate little tribal groups merged, their little regional "deities" were absorbed into larger religious systems that accomodated all the 'new' goddesses/gods into one loosely-consolidated 'belief' system - look at ancient Egypt's religious evolution for proof of that.
As for absolute mono-theism; I've not found ANY indications from any modern, reputable archaeologists or paleo-archaeologists that ancient man was "mono"-theistic... In most tribal religions, there may have been one dominant god, as Zeus was for the Greeks and Jupiter was for the Romans, but there are usually several demi-gods and goddesses running around, too. Smaller deities who make sure the hearth fire never goes out, the wine doesn't sour and the bread rises properly, just to name a few... [Examples: Hestia, Dionysus, the Corn King...]
Note the emphasis on the terms modern archaeologists and modern paleo-archaeologists...
Just as you wouldn't even dream of going to a doctor who still practices medicine the way it was done in the Victorian era [and I've used this illustration before, but some people just don't get it...], I would never consider taking the words of an early archaeologist over current findings... That's almost 'flat earth' thinking...
Interestingly, the evolution of religion seems to have gone in the opposite direction of most other forms of evolution - while ancient organisms generally became more complex and human technology has gone from simple to complex, religion has simplified from many deities to a very few deities...
Might be an indication that religion is slowly sliding towards extinction...
-
Satanus
Among the romans, especially the soldiers, mithraism was popular. Christianity displaced this. Among arabs, there were tribal religions. In persia (iran), zerostrianism was popular and powerful. Islam displaced this one. Mithraism and zerostrianism were related. If these two had been left in place, likely the cultures of rome and the middle east would have grown closer together. Likely, there would have been less division between eastern and western, culturally.
S
-
ziddina
Thanks, Satanus! Interesting observation; I was wondering about Mithraism myself. If I remember correctly, though, Mithraism was more secretive than the bible-based religions; that might have hindered its advancement somewhat.
Tec wrote:
"Do you realize how much power you have given the bible, Zid? More power than it actually has, I think. Probably more power even than the people who believe in it. ..."
Oh, come on now...
People have started 'holy' wars over this collection of Bronze-Age Middle-Eastern mythologies... Have burned people to death over the bible... Have crushed and destroyed native peoples over the bible... Have demolished ancient civilizations over it - remember the Aztecs and the Incas, to name but two?? Have burned and destroyed valuable ancient artifacts over it - remember what the Spanish priests did to all those Aztec and Incan books that explained their scientific advancements, their medicines, their religions??
That's giving that book WAAAAAAAAYYY more power than I've given it.....
Zid the She-Devil...
-
tec
You think the book has that much power - think it is responsible for all that carnage. I don't think its responsible for all those things. I think people are responsible. So these things would have happened, in different ways and with different groups of people, anyway. Because of what is IN people, that causes them to act in such ways.
The book has only been around for a couple thousand years (it doesn't even say to do these things - especially if we look at Christ, who says the opposite). But there were wars, atrocities, murders, slavery, destruction of property and lives and artifacts... all long before the bible ever came to be. Before the Jewish Holy Book ever came to be for that matter as well.
We're just capable of greater mass destruction as we advance technologically.
Tammy
-
sizemik
You think the book has that much power - think it is responsible for all that carnage. I don't think its responsible for all those things. I think people are responsible. So these things would have happened, in different ways and with different groups of people, anyway. Because of what is IN people, that causes them to act in such ways.
That's about the most sensible thing to appear on this thread.
The bible is as much a product of human society as human society is a product of the bible . . . little would be different without it.