I never heard of annointed ones all writing to the gb! The brother who first studied with me was not partaking back then but about ten years later began to. He has nothing to do with the GB, nor did an elderly sister I knew years ago who partook.
Any JW, please help- I need just one thing!
I've known two members of 'the anointed' One was asked directly if he communicated with Bethel. The indirect answer given was something about harmony. The direct answer was no.
This is such a great thread and really made me think. Why did I not think like this early in my life?
I loved your point here moshe
(I was surprised to find out around 1973 from an elderly anointed JW who was born before 1900 and came in as an original Bible Student, that he had nothing to do with the new light, was never consulted about new light and had never even been in a special meeting for the anointed. I should have smelled a rat when he told me that. I mean like, they have meetings for pioneers- why not special meetings for the anointed assemblies?)
I love your reasoning.
The reality for JWs, is that the F&DS story falls into the category of folklore and it has been repeated so much in the publications that JWs have come to accept it as , truth, without requiring any proof.
Not questioning anything is a essential to anyone who want to become or remain a JW. The whole bit about Christ returning, viewing all the religious organization and selecting them because they were faithful and descreet requires a tremendous leap of faith. Even a casual examination of what they were teaching back then and who was in charge would make you realize that Christ would only have chose them if he spent the whole selection process boozing it up with Rutherford.
(something went terribly wrong with my cut and paste here)
Well, so far, no JW has provided the name of a F&DS member. If no name is forthcoming in a week, I will assume that none can be obtained.
I came to the conclusion a few years ago, that the legal department does provide enough "between the lines" information in the publications for a discerning JW to figure out that the WT dogmas are man-made. Not providing any names of the F&DS is a tacit admission that there are no real people with that title directing the WT Publishing company. All a JW has to do is ask for tangible proof- of course they wil be asked to leave the KH club, as it is only for true believers of the WT paradise Earth fairy tale.
I've PMd you Moshe (twice, sorry, just thought of a PS, lol) - hope that's ok :)
OK- check you mailbox
I like this approach Moshe. The next time I speak to any JWs I'm going to ask them give me the names of a few of the FDS. Then when they can't I'll ask them how they know they exists.
There were two very old so called annointed Jdubs at the first hall I attended. They were born around 1900 and been in since the early 1920s. They had no input or direct contact with the rule makers in Brooklyn.
Moshe, I'm still confused by your reasoning in the following interchange:
I thought the members of the Governing Body are considered to be part of the Faithful and Discreet Slave?
To which you responded:
Well if they are, then they are self-directed bosses and that is not how it is supposed to work- in theory.
I would think a JW would simply say they believe GB are not self-directed as you say. Rather, they believe the GB are directed by Jesus. There was a WT article a few months back entitled "Your Leader is One, the Christ," that said following the GB is the same as following Christ because the GB are directed by Christ. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I would think if you ask a JW for names of some members of the FDS class, they could just give you the names of some GB members and say these men are part of the "faithful and discreet slave," and their "master" is Jesus, so they are not self-directed. What am I missing here?
Also, when I asked the CO about all the other people in JW-land who claim to be anointed, and why aren't they part of the formulation of doctrine and decision-making, etc., he said that even in the 1st century, not all anointed Christians were called by Jehovah to have the duty of teaching. He gave the example of Phillip, whom Jehovah gave the duty of caring for widows and orphans. His point was that the various members of the FDS have different roles in administering food at the proper time, and only a few of them, being the GB, have been called by Jehovah to the specific role of "taking the lead" in teaching and supervising the entire organization.
Not that I personally believe any of it, but I was just thinking that a JW should have no difficulty in answering your question. Where do you see any logical flaw in the way I explained my understanding of the JW FDS idea? Couldn't they just satisfy your request for at least one name by naming one of those weirdos like Gerrit Losch or David Splane and be done with the matter?
Couldn't they just satisfy your request for at least one name by naming one of those weirdos like Gerrit Losch or David Splane and be done with the matter?
Of course that is what a JW would try to do- however they would be going beyond what the WT says, as those men have never claimed (in 1st person) to be one of the F&DS. They let the WT imply they are part of the F&DS, but the WT has never attached ANY personal name of a modern day member of the GB to the title of F&DS, since the creation of that body in the 1970's. Example- announcing a speaker at WT convention: Our next speaker, is Brother Kumquat, one of the governing body and one of the F&DS. Have you ever heard something like that?
Consider the the Obama birth certificate that was just released. While most people are satisfied with it as proving that Obama was born in the USA and is a US Citizen, others say it proves he isn't a Natural born citizen, only a "native born citizen" , because his father was a citizen of Kenya and as such is ineligible to be president according to the Constitution. The interesting thing here is President Obama has never said publiclly, "I am a Natural Born citizen", ( to my knowledge-correct me if I am wrong) but he lets others make that claim for him. The problem is no Federal court has defined what natural born means- yet. The defintion of who is a F&DS has changed over the years in the WT, too- as it suits there purpose.
The GB refuse to publicly accept the title of one of the F&DS and accept the corressponding responsibilty for claiming to have a direct channel to Jehovah. They refuse to explain how the GB could be the F&DS today and explain who was directing the WT back in the days of Knorr, Rutherford and Russell before the GB existed. The JWs refuse to make that phone call to Bethel and ask to speak to one of the F&DS who are directing the writing of the WT.