JW's came to the door

by pr0ner 50 Replies latest jw friends

  • djeggnog
    djeggnog

    @Aussie Oz wrote:

    Oh crap, i just cant put into words what your post did to me.

    @djeggnog wrote:

    You might want to drink something sweet if [something] I said in my post turned out to be somewhat bitter in your mouth, and then come back and tell me exactly what my post did to you. Say what you feel. (I can take it.)

    @Aussie Oz wrote:

    Ok. you made me write a big reply and then delete it because i felt it was a waste of time, and would be totally lost on you, as is proved by the responses from you to other posts.

    Well, maybe it's good that you didn't bother to post that "big reply."

    You think your words were bitter to me? You self righteous little shit I wont be reading your dribble anymore... you are perhaps the most ignorant person i have come [across] so far on here.

    Bitter, no. The truth is that I really didn't know what to make of your "Oh crap, i just cant put into words what your post did to me" statement. It was so open to interpretation, so I thought perhaps you wanted to help me see the light as you have managed to see the light (or some such nonsense like this). I also thought something I said might have triggered a memory in your mind that you didn't quite know hot to "put [your thoughts] into words." I thought it possible that you had become flabbergasted over the audacity of me to have said to @sabastious, @wasblind, @3Mozzies or @Steve2. (Then, again, maybe not anything I said to @sabastious, but to the other three posters whose posts came before yours.) What I said was if [something] I said in my post turned out to be somewhat bitter in your mouth....

    Your "Oh crap, i just cant put into words what your post did to me" remark could have meant anything, but what I did say was meant to move the discussion along and I don't care that you are now indignant over what I actually did say. I cannot control what you might think after reading what things I write here, nor do I care what mental process you use to determine whether you like something said by someone or don't like something said by someone.

    Now I know that you don't know me at all, so I cannot take your"angst" seriously, but since you apparently wanted to draw attention to yourself in this thread, at my expense, you've succeeded; you now have my attention as well as the attention of all of your friends here. Apparently you want to be a clown, so go ahead, attach the red nose and be that clown, and maybe I'll buy a ticket, but here's the point I would make but for your threatening to not read any more of my "dribble":

    When Jehovah's Witnesses visit folks at their homes, they do so for the same reason that Jesus and his apostles visited people: Because people are walking in the unprofitableness of their minds, in spiritual darkness, some of them in spiritual bondage to false religion, and they have never really heard the good news about Jesus Christ. Jehovah's Witnesses truly believe that if given an opportunity to do so, that some of the people that we visit at their homes would, upon hearing the good news of God's kingdom, make the same choice that we made to conform their lives in such a way that they and those that listen to them (including their own families) might realize the same hope as we in harmony with God's will, and thus form the nucleus of the new earth under the millennial reign of God's kingdom with the prospect of living forever.

    It is because of the Bible and our faith in God's promises contained in it that Jehovah's Witnesses are making our faith manifest to all, not just in our ministry, but in how we have chosen to live our lives. Jehovah's Witnesses know that there is absolutely nothing that we can personally do to earn everlasting life, but we have been persuaded that God will grant us with it as a reward for our faithfulness toward Him in our doing the work that His son has given us to do, sharing what things we have learned with others and warning folks as to what's on the horizon.

    It does bother me that many of the people here (like @pr0ner) would make sport of jeering Jehovah's Witnesses that have done absolutely nothing to any of you, except to come to your door to share the very same message contained in the Bible, the same message that Jesus and his apostles taught, that many of you have already heard, but rejected, which, mind you, is certainly your right to do.

    Telling these Witnesses that you've heard the Kingdom message and that it is a waste of their time sharing with you their message when you have no interest whatsoever in it would be the right thing to do, not to lead on any of these Witnesses as your "victims" so that you might sow the seeds of contempt that you feel about Jehovah's Witnesses generally, and the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses specifically, in your hatred for anything at all having to do with the WTS.

    So because my God is Jehovah, and you have chosen to worship the god of this system of things, why the bitterness toward me when you don't know me and I've done nothing to you? Again, I didn't say I believed you thought my words were bitter to you, did I? What I said was "if [something] I said in my post turned out to be somewhat bitter in your mouth [that you should] come back and tell me exactly what my post did to you." Of course, I could be lying, but I suspect that you could very easily go back a few posts and review mine to see whether or not I'm lying to you.

    THATS what your post did to me.

    I don't care.

    now go and post how Oz is a horrid nasty person who derides people and is sensitive or something.

    Now, now. You're not a horrid nasty person, but it is true that in what you said to me in your post that you treated me contemptuously, but your jeering of me pales in comparison with what I anticipate will be a grueling test of my faith before Jesus puts down this rabid system of things. I'm ok with that.

    bugger off.

    In case you don't know, I'm in the States, in Los Angeles, California, so "bugger off" doesn't faze me. Now if what you wanted to do was insult me, such that I might want to come through this monitor and "pummel you" (which is as wimpy as saying "bugger off" to an American) or "kick you ass" (which is a less wimpy way to say the same thing), then the very next time you feel like being a show off (or a clown), please don't hesitate to tell me to "piss off" or to "fuck off." I won't really react negatively to your saying any of these things, but your friends here (like @pr0ner and @wasblind) will no doubt laugh and want to "fist bump" you, and even have your baby for deriding yet another Witness. (One thing though: @pr0ner thought it important to tell me today that he is mammary-less so you might want to keep that in mind.)

    @djeggnog wrote:

    So in less than five minutes the householder learns from the Bible that Jehovah is the true God, that Jesus is God's only-begotten son, that God sent Jesus to give his life as a ransom and that the very fact that Isaiah recorded this prophecy concerning Jesus some 730 years before Jesus' birth is proof that God exists.

    @moshe wrote:

    egggnogg, you and the rest of the JW blind ilk have confused opinion for fact here. The householder was told of your opinion, but it is not a proven fact. Jesus has been a no-show for almost 2000 years and every year that goes by, proves that the Jews were right all along- Jesus was not a Messiah.

    So if Jesus existed, then you would agree that God exists, correct? I fear this may be a waste of time, but many people believe that Jesus was the Messiah, for the Bible tells us how people felt about the sayings of John the Baptist at John 10:41, 42: "'As many things as John said about this man [the Messiah, Jesus Christ] were all true.' And many put faith in him there." At John 5:46, Jesus said "that one [Moses] wrote about me," and he told Peter at John 21:22, "If it is my will for him [John] to remain until I come, of what concern is that to you?"

    Jewish historian, Flavius Josephus, 1.1 million Jews perished in 70 AD, but Christians escaped when Jerusalem was first besieged by Roman armies in 66 AD, for when the siege was lifted, they obediently left Jerusalem as Jesus told them to do, four years before the Romans besieged Jerusalem a second time and destroyed it. (Luke 19:43, 44; 21:20-22) According to John 6:14, after seeing the many miracles that Jesus performed, people were saying about him, "This is for a certainty the prophet that was to come into the world," and at John 7:31, "When the Christ arrives, he will not perform more signs than this man has performed, will he?"

    Really there is abundant evidence that Jesus was "the Messiah," or, as the Greek-speaking Jews would refer to him, "the Christ," but you probably won't believe any of it, and if you're not willing to believe what the Bible says, then you're right: It's just my opinion that Jesus was the Messiah, while as far as you are concerned, his existence is "not a proven fact."

    @wasblind:

    Christmas Cheer

    Why should Jehovah's Witnesses run from anyone?

    Because they might actually find the "TRUTH"

    This is just to acknowledge having read your post. Otherwise, no comment.

    @djeggnog

  • wasblind
  • ziddina
    ziddina

    DJ Eggnog doesn't have anything original to say; he's just burning bandwidth...

    Zid

  • djeggnog
    djeggnog

    @blondie:

    I come from a jw family that goes back to the 1920's. Yet, they did not talk much about Beth-Sarim. I had access to the WT history from the 1959 Divine Purpose Book, the 1975 YB, and eventually a few comments in the 1993 Proclaimers book. Most jws are ignorant of their history, even if they were adults in 1993 when the [Proclaimers] book came out and when it was read and discussed over 3 years from 1994 to 1996.

    I, too, come from a JW family, and in another thread, @caliber posted something from the 1939 book, Salvation, about Beth-Sarim, which I recognized right away as being an attack against the WTS as to its possible misuse of the many financial contributions that our benefactors, including Jehovah's Witnesses, had made toward the worldwide preaching work back in 1929, based on the unfounded notion of some that certain Jehovah's Witnesses, especially members of the governing body, like J.F. Rutherford in 1929, were using these financial contributions to buy lavish homes and to support a materialistic lifestyle while the "rank and file" -- this is how certain folks refer to those of us in the local congregations that do not work at the WTS -- are living their lives in virtual squalor! I went on to ask @caliber:

    Are you suggesting something sinister about Beth-Sarim where J.F. Rutherford came to live for some 13 years, where he lived during the winters from 1929 until his death on January 8, 1942, due to his health after having lost one of his lungs following his imprisonment back in 1919 where he developed a severe case of pneumonia. The man had been back in forth between Brooklyn, New York, and San Diego, California, under doctor's care until someone made a direct contribution for the purpose of constructing a house in San Diego for his use. Brother Rutherford’s use. It wasn't as if Beth-Sarim was built at WTS expense, and after Rutherford's death, the property was conveyed to the WTS, who eventually sold the property as made clear in the Watchtower, dated December 15, 1947.

    Specifically, as to the zany idea that Jehovah's Witnesses had about the possibility of using Beth-Sarim to house Abraham, Joseph and David -- whose resurrection Jehovah's Witnesses had at that time anticipated to occur [after] Armageddon -- this notion as to these men being resurrected before the end of this system of things and serving as "princes in all the earth" (in fulfillment of Psalm 45:16) was abandoned as the Watchtower, dated November 1, 1950, states, at which time an adjustment was made that indicated that these pre-Christian men of faith would be resurrected after Armageddon. One must always keep in mind that Jehovah's Witnesses are neither perfect nor infallible, nor are any of the things printed by the WTS as aids to Bible study inspired by God.

    Of course, I have no way of knowing whether or not this is true, @blondie, but I think your having posted that scan of page 400 from that Golden Age dated March 19, 1930 (page 401 is also a part of the deed), may serve to acquaint some of those here that seem to have a penchant for repeating unverified, unresearch rumors (that is to say, rumors that they were just too lazy to research in an attempt to verify what things they read and/or heard others say before repeating such rumors) with fact that they didn't have. Thanks you.

    @djeggnog wrote:

    I'm an "old-timer," and I'll lock horns with anyone, except the deliberately belligerent. I've waiting patiently for the system to end and am especially looking forward to seeing the talks between the Israelis and the Palestinians re a two-state solution go forward, since "whenever it is that they are saying: 'Peace and security!'.... (1 Thessalonians 5:3)

    @pirata wrote:

    The latest Society's Public Talk Outline "Peace - Can it Last" stated that we should not speculate on the meaning of "Peace and Security".

    This statement of yours is false.

    @djeggnog

  • wasblind
    wasblind

    Beth sarim wasn't the only blunder they built

    eggnogg, you didn't mention Beth Shan.

  • teel
    teel

    I'm sorry eggnog, have you heard the expression 'less is more'? Try it in practice...

  • pirata
    pirata

    @djeggnog

    The latest Society's Public Talk Outline "Peace - Can it Last" stated that we should not speculate on the meaning of "Peace and Security".

    This statement of yours is false
    .

    Indeed it was. I had put the name of the wrong outline. My apologies. It is this year's special talk, "Real Peace and Security - When?". There are specific instructions to the speaker not to speculate on the meaning of "Peace and Security"

  • AnnOMaly
    AnnOMaly

    AnnOMaly wrote: Yes s/he did. And the older lady apparently knew that 'joining a religion,' even if it is supposed to be the 'right' one, will not guarantee salvation - hence her hesitation to answer directly.

    djeggnog wrote: That's not true and is utter nonsense where the religion practiced by Jehovah's Witnesses is concerned.

    I thought you'd be savvy enough not to come back with a comment like that! Obviously I was mistaken. According to the Bible, knowing God and the One whom He sent forth guarantees salvation. You could even have said living the Christian life in faith will guarantee salvation. But 'joining a religion' - even if it is supposed to be the 'correct' JW religion - certainly does NOT guarantee salvation!

    AnnOMaly wrote: If you remember, I said she was a very overbearing know-it-all. Therefore, she got people's backs up - including householders' sometimes. It was thrilling to see her taken down a peg or two by someone who knew his stuff. And I've always been one to side with 'the facts' - no matter where they come from. The householder was correct; and the JW, in this instance, was arrogant in her ignorance which was giving a 'bad witness.'

    djeggnog wrote: Yes, I recall what you said, but how in your mind did any of this (about Beth Serim) constitute a "bad witness"?

    Because, as I said, the householder was correct, and the JW, in this instance, was arrogant in her ignorance [and for this reason she] was giving a 'bad witness.' Let me put it another way. She was making the Witnesses look dishonest and/or clueless in the conceited way she was denying the facts. Please say you've got it now?

  • Ding
    Ding

    Djeggnogg,

    Let's see if I've got it right.

    1. Jehovah wants you to wholeheartedly believe everything the Watchtower Society teaches today, even if it means imprisonment or death.

    2. When, in a couple of years, the Watchtower teaches the exact opposite on some issue of what they teach today, Jehovah will want you to wholeheartedly believe everything the Watchtower Society says about it, even if it means imprisonment or death.

    3. When, a couple years after that, the Watchtower changes back to teaching what it says today, Jehovah will want you to wholehearedly believe everything the Watchtower says about it, even if it means imprisonment or death.

    (If you think this would never happen, you might want to reconsider your total lack of interest in the Watchtower's doctrinal history.)

    If I understand your loyalty to the Society correctly, two questions:

    1. On what basis will Jehovah hold you guiltless for communicating with apostates on this website in direct violation of Watchtower directives?

    2. If Jehovah wanted to convey to you that he never gave this kind of authority to the Watchtower Society, what would he have to do to get that through to you?

  • seawolf
    seawolf

    very good brother pr0ner. I'm going to mark you good (your timing was excellent) and move you on to your next debate at the door. I'll be sending a new JW, with the cute one that was there, in one to two weeks.

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