Major flaw in the Society's 1914-Gentile Times doctrine

by peacedog 24 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • peacedog

    The Oracle:

    I thought I would check it out to see if the JWs could point to some kind of ramp up in involvement or ferocity of attacks during that month of October in 1914, and thus in typical spin doctor fashion rationalize the October date for the end of the Gentile Times and the subsequent ouster of Satan from the heavens as accurate and pivitol.

    Good idea. If there had been something around Oct 1 for them to latch onto, they probably would have done just that.

  • possible-san

    Hi, peacedog.

    Once we establish that the Society LIES, which we have done, then doctrine no longer matters. As a LIAR ORGANIZATION, they cannot be "God's Organization", regardless of what doctrines they do or do not teach.

    Exactly! (standing ovation and thunderous applause)
    Your explanation is completely right/correct.

    I think that you can persuade him/her (an active JW), if he/she has "good faith."
    Serious JW dislikes a lie/dishonest most, IMO.

    That said, however, the fact that Rutherford went so far as to change the end date of the Gentile Times shows how important it is to Watchtower doctrine that the First World War lines up with the end of the Gentile Times. This should not be overlooked.

    Yeah, absolutely.

    But, well, in my opinion, each JW does not necessarily attach importance to 1914. (I think)
    Possibly, ordinary JWs do not think that 1914 is important, IMO.
    Rather, the Organization (GB) does so, IMO.
    It is because that year (1914) is what corroborates their"authority."

    And furthermore, even the GB has said like this. (Although this is a lie)

    *** w94 5/1 p. 15 par. 7 Kingdom Proclaimers Active in All the Earth ***
    As the Gentile Times neared their end, newspapers were used to publish Bible sermons delivered by Brother Russell. Their primary emphasis was not on the year 1914 but, rather, on the purpose of God and the surety of its fulfillment.

    I think that it is more persuasive for active JWs, when you say "they told a lie" rather than you say, "that (the Gentile Times) is important", IMO.


  • processor

    I once had conversation with the WTS about this question. Primarily, my question was: Why do they claim that the "seven times" started at the death of governor Gedaliah and NOT at the death of the last King, Zedekiah. They say that there was no King on Jehovah's throne for "seven times", so this period should have started at the death of the last King. Gedaliah was only a governor, and there have been other governors in Jerusalem since them.

    I added the question about the World War. In August, it started. In October, Jesus began ruling as heavenly King, and SOME TIME AFTER THAT, he cast out Satan from heaven, and AFTER THAT, Satan caused World War I. This does not work out. I claimed that King Zedekiah was killed in July, so it would perfectly fit the start of World War I to count the "seven times" from Zedekiah's death.

    The reply that I got was very disappointing. Basically they claimed that the "seven times" must have started at Gedaliah's death because it was always written like that in the Watchtower, even in very old issues. Their main argument was that Jerusalem's devastation started after Gedaliah's death.

    I wrote them that their explanation did not satisfy me. In their reply they told me that they cannot say anything else regarding that topic, and they sent me an article about a sister who waited for decades until some doctrine was changed.

  • cantleave

    ....they told me that they cannot say anything else regarding that topic, and they sent me an article about a sister who waited for decades until some doctrine was changed......

    Well there's a surprise! I wonder if the person who wrote taht reply is still active? Surely you can't write such crap and still believe it all.

  • Sanctifire

    Hello one and all JWs and exJWs,

    Well, I am well and truly EX at 81 and 50 years 'in the truth', while very Jehovah oriented since my removal in 2008.

    On the basis of Ezekiel 21:25-27 there was to be a considerable chronological space between
    Israel's last king Zedekiah and the one whose legal right it is: Jesus.

    That space ended at Pentecost 33 when the Christ resumed the kingdom over those out of redeemed Israel-in-the-flesh
    who had put faith in their redemption.

    That, however, did not define the end of the Gentile times, which were to continue until 1914 when the heavenly Christ
    became more intimately involved with preparing this multi-ethnic, multi-gender little flock of Israel in the flesh (Galatians 3:28-29)
    for the ultimate establishment of the heavenly kingdom of the 1000 years.

    They will be called shortly when the Christ sends his angels to collect them from death and those remaining on earth Matthew 24:29-31.
    That kingdom nor any other was born in 1914, because its establishment is yet ahead AFTER the great tribulation upon unfaithful Isreal that began with the Roman onslaught and continuing even now until the 1000 year kingdom's birth.

    All else is religious conjecture, where con is the operative word here.

    So all the arguments about the WW1 and End of the Gentile Times mismatch is in vain simply there was never meant to be an exact one in the first place anyway, since the kingdom was yet more than 100 years into the future. This also connects to the vanity of the burden of witnessing to make millions of disciples, since only a 144000 were to be garnered from out of all the nations to become the kingdom, not all the nations and certainly not 8 million or so.

    Bye, Dieter - You can always have a bit of a brain-engaged browse here:

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