Has anyone here ever been able to have a whole set of thoughts "behind" what they are saying or doing at the moment? I could be talking to someone and not be distracted from what we are saying, but have a whole other thought in the back of my mind. This second mind of mine can process info at a faster rate than my actually trying to think of it myself. Sometimes if Im lucky I connect with God at this level. Using pure thought instead of thinking words in my head. Kinda like telepathy but with God. This is how I try to pray.
Still Feeling Lost...What to Do Next?
Frigginconfused - Yes, if I read you right. Sort of like understanding something without having the words to express it - even to yourself?
TEC. Yup you got it. So what does everyone think of this way of connecting with God?
I think it is lovely, FrigginConfused. I highly recommend meditation, to enhance what you are experiencing. It is learning to quiet the "chattering" side of the mind, while the creative side gets a chance to look around. It is a marvelous thing, indeed.
By the way, what I believe you are describing is what many call "the witness". I have attempted to describe it, here:
Hi Daring - one thing is that so many of us have been where you are - lost......and to put you at rest it is not necessarily a bad place to be...sure you may be out of your comfort zone, but again that is okay.
After leaving the org and being in a place of authority there, you need to just step back, take a breath and just be. You have gone through a huge shift and need to find your feet, no use running and then falling down a cliff.
Some on here have found new faiths, or not. I personally did go to a church - for a couple of months just to experience it and see what it was about, so that when I speak - it's from experience and not heresay. Personally it was pretty similar to jdubs, you've got to believe their doctrine - granted they may not be as strict as the JWs. For me, I don't need to listen to a fleshly man stand up and tell me what to believe, it didnt work when I was in the faith and it wasn't going to work going to another church. Who then do I turn too.... God & me. Only I know what I need, only I know how fast I can go in learning things, only I can find my path. My take on God is somewhat different to what I used to believe and is not main stream at all, but I do believe there is a higher power.
If you want to pray, just speak to yourself if need be, about what you need, what you'd like to sort out (be it spiritual stuff or not), almost like making a mental list - what you'd like to check off - it's a good way to start talking to God.
"... I see no reason to allow their disdain of other churches put one off finding out. The beauty of this new life is freedom...to explore want you want and to think...."
You've got to be kidding me! I don't know how long you were yourself actively associated with Jehovah's Witnesses (I understand from what you wrote that your wife continues to be an active Witness), but from whom did you learn that Jehovah's Witnesses have disdain for the people of other churches or other religions for that matter? That's just not true at all! Jehovah's Witnesses all have to believe themselves to be numbered among God's people today, else what would be the point of being a Christian associated with a particular religious group if you really do not believe this group to have God's blessing resting upon it? Your worship would just be in vain if it should turn out that God is blessing another group, and you're not a part of that group, would it not?
I cannot imagine a Catholic, a Seventh-Day Adventist, a Lutheran, a Methodist, a Baptist, on and on, confessing that he or she knows that the worship that are giving to their Trinitarian god is in vain, that they know that they are aware that the folks in that group over there are the true worshippers of God, but they like the people in their church and that they would rather perish with them than to be saved from God's wrath along with the true worshippers in that other church when God brings judgment upon the world. Can you imagine that anyone that is a member of a particular church thinks that what he or she does and has been doing every Sunday for at least 50 out of 52 weeks for some 20, 30 years is all in vain? My question would be, What are you smoking? Your thinking is way off! Your perspective on what is it we feel for the people that attend these "other churches" is "wack," as kids not in the truth are wont to say.
Jehovah's Witnesses do not believe themselves to be holier or special. If that's what you felt, then that would be your thought and projecting that perspective on me and on other Jehovah's Witnesses is a delusion on your part, for such a perspective is just foolish talk. It's true that we could develop a little self-righteous attitude and say about the people to whom we preach that are Baptists or Catholics or Muslims or Buddhists, "They're not going to listen. They're just Baptists. They're just Lutherans. They're just Catholics." "There are only Muslims and Seventh-Day Adventists here in this territory, and none of them are really worth our wasting time preaching to them about God's new system of things because they won't listen to the message." "Only Jehovah's Witnesses are worth Jehovah's giving such a glorious opportunity, only Jehovah's Witnesses are worth Jehovah's giving to us the prospect of living forever in God's new order."
Wow! Talk about being self-righteous and having a holier-than-thou attitude! If this is what you thought when you were actively with us, then you took the wrong perspective on matters. Tell me: Is it not true that we all of us need to rely upon God's undeserved kindness for mercy? Are we not all of us sinners that need to avail ourselves of the ransom provision that God had made that provides atonement for our sins? (Matthew 20:28)
Our works as preachers of the Kingdom message -- that is, assuming that we are not in denial as to the message of the Bible, believing instead some other message is what we ought to be preaching -- merely fulfill a command; they don't save us. We should know and remember this. But am I saying that when we read at 2 Peter 3:9 that Jehovah God wants "all to attain to repentance," that we should take away from this the understanding that God doesn't mean Baptists, Catholics, Lutheran and Muslims? Am I saying that when we read at 1 John 2:2 that Jesus "is a propitiatory sacrifice for ... the whole world's [sins]," that we should understand that no Seventh-Day Adventists, no Buddhists, no Baha'is need make application to God for salvation through the one that propitiates for all of our sins? Of course not! If this were the case, then for what reason in the world would Jehovah have us out there preaching to these folks? Tell me: What exactly do you think the phrases "former Catholic," or "former Methodist, or "former <anything>" mean when you hear one of our brothers or sisters describe themselves in this way?
Is our message one of gloom and doom, or one that involves the declaration of denunciations? Or, is the Christian message a life-saving one that Jehovah's Witnesses are declaring to anyone that will listen to us, if not today, then maybe tomorrow or next week or next month or next year? We do the work and at the same time we demonstrate what love God has for them to send us to help them to learn what they must do to survive God's war of Armageddon that is coming just as surely as night follows day, and when we are doing God's work we demonstrate our love for the people that live in our respective communities, the love that we have for our neighbors. None of us is worth saving, but we are persuaded that God intends to save those of us that are both "sighing and groaning over all the detestable things" that have taken place and are taking place on the earth today, as we mark them for salvation. (Ezekiel 9:4)
As to the freedom you were going on about here, you have always possessed the ability to explore what things you wanted to do, to explore doing all of those things about which you have always thought you wanted to do. Did you want not to attend meetings at the Kingdom Hall? Did you want to be one of those watching Super Bowl <fill in the Roman numeral> Sunday live and not on videotape or DVR after the Big Game has been played? Did you always want to watch the latest "R" movie when it opened, rather than having to wait a month or so until it was released on DVD? Did you always want to smoke marijuana or do cocaine with your friends in the world?
Did you always want to go on a junket to Las Vegas to exclaim "Seven!" or "Hard Eight!" before throwing the dice at a crap table or tell the dealer to "Hit it!" when you have been dealt "11" or to "double down" on "11" with a hefty bet on the line? Did you always want to "hook up" with your co-worker at the job, the one that wants just to have a good time with you because you are one of the few "good, mature and stable" married men that she knows? Maybe you are someone that relishes such compliments; I don't know.
There's absolutely nothing but your dedication to Jehovah that was preventing you from exercising all of the freedom that there exists in the world, and laying aside the vow that you made to your God, even for just one night, you have always had the liberty to do, even if you knew that neither Jehovah nor your wife would not have really appreciated this exercise of your freedom.
At 1 John 5:3, we read, "For this is what the love of God means, that we observe his commandments; and yet his commandments are not burdensome."
So you are familiar with this verse, so what's the standard here? The standard for Christians is obedience and so anyone that claims to love God would have to be someone that is obeying Him (why?), because to claim to love God and not obey His standards would mean that one in actuality didn't love God. But note that it says there, "and yet his commandments are not burdensome."
Now you might have said this: "I think it's a burden. I'd like to serve Jehovah God and become one of His worshippers, but He's too strict. I like all of His promises, but look what I'd have to give up? Look what things I couldn't do? That's the very reason I'm not serving Him now, or why it is I'm not serving God fully and acceptably." Some of these things that you'd have to "give up" were mentioned, but the fact is that when it comes to doing things that are right, there's no restriction at all on your doing that which is right. For example, if you want to be a loving person, Jehovah God lets you be as loving as you want to be and you are free to do all that is humanly possible to be loving toward others.
If you want to be a merciful person, you are free to demonstrate as much mercy as you wish. Maybe your thing is generosity, so you want to be a generous person, but Jehovah God lets you be as generous as you can be, for when it comes to doing what things are good and right, there's no limit; there's no restriction on this.
But when does Jehovah God place a limit? When someone wants to do something hateful that can only please the Devil. When someone wants to do something evil, then naturally God is going to make a law and prohibit one from doing those kinds of things. Like when a man wants to sleep with someone's wife or with someone's husband -- and, yes, this last desire on the part of some of the brothers and sisters occurs often than you might realize -- shouldn't God limit such indecent behavior? I mean, we know from reading 1 Thessalonians 4:3-8 that your "vessel" meaning your body belongs to God. As one of God's dedicated servants, even if you should become disfellowshipped, you disowned yourself, and it's just that God knows you, but you are God's property. So God does impose a limit on the exercise of our Christian freedom.
Your wife is a dedicated servant, too, so why wouldn't you expect a loving God to give you advice that would protect you and she from the many diseases that flow from oral sex and anal sex. With oral sex, there's chlamydia, chronic Hepatitis B, cytomegalovirus, genital herpes, genital warts, Hepatitis B, Herpes simplex, HIV/AIDS, pelvic inflammatory disease, pubic lice, sexually transmitted diseases and scabies. With anal sex comes all of the above, including amoebiasis, cryptosporidiosis, E. coli infections, giardiasis, gonorrhea, granuloma inguinale, Hepatitis A, Hepatitis C, human papilloma virus (HPV), Kaposi's sarcoma-associated herpesvirus (HHV-8), lymphogranuloma venereum, syphilis, trichomoniasis, salmonellosis, shigella and tuberculosis. (Yes, folks engaging in certain sexual activity are already infected with TB, so they unwittingly infect their sexual partner with TB.)
Jehovah is not interested in limiting anyone's freedom, but in not having His servants sin against Him or sin against their marriage mate through their engaging in risky sexual relations that could affect the status of a marriage and any children of their union. He doesn't want fathers advising their teenage sons and daughters to make sure they or their sexual partner uses a condom if they should decide to engage in sexual activity with anyone either. There are no special rules on hygiene that can protect someone from contracting a disease, and what exactly does it mean that the attendant risks of becoming infected by one or more of the aforesaid diseases can be minimized if a parent advise his or her children to maintain committed monogamous sexual relationships with other children, except that there is the realization that one can become infected?
No, this isn't true for adults and this isn't true for children either. Adults are certainly free to explore their freedom by ignoring the risks attendant to their engaging in risky sexual behavior to maybe find out if wife-swapping can actually help the marriage, but would it not be irresponsible for an adult to be teaching their own children this "minimalization" doctrine of careful hygiene and condoms? If these unmarried children are baptized, then a parent would really be advising dedicated servants of God on how they might actually sin against God, would they not?
Also, Jehovah God doesn't give to elders the authority to turn Kingdom Halls into "Confessionials," so that they might become mentally titillated through their brothers or sisters coming to them with a contrite, repentant heart to confess the sordid details of their sin. There are no priests here and we do not take auricular confessions; except for Jesus Christ, no human being has ever been given the authority to grant absolution from one's sins. Anyone reportedly doing these things are not qualified to serve as an elder, but the friends that have fallen into sin may be intimidated from reporting an elder or might think that their making such a report will just be ignored. No report is ignored, but a non-report cannot be placed in a file, can it?
When someone wants to sell somebody's youngster drugs, when they want to sneak in your house and take out that which you have worked many long hours to earn the money to get, well shouldn't there be laws against what is indecent and what harms one's neighbor, laws against making our children drug dependent addicts and laws against stealing? God's commandments are not a burden at all! In fact, if you have a righteous heart and you love what is right, and you want to imitate Jehovah God in being loving, then you have all of the freedom that you can have, but it is only when it comes to what is wrong and what works against one's neighbor, and what is harmful, that Jehovah God places a limit, and rightly so, and those that love Him, they want to become like Him.
We want to imitate God in His unselfishness, in His love, in His mercy, in His generosity, and we can do all of this within what is humanly possible for us to do, for appreciating that God has standards is part of our knowing Him and doesn't at all interfere with our freedom as a free people.
We never want to use the Christian freedom we have 'as a blind for moral badness, but as slaves of God, having love for the whole association of brothers in fear of God, while assigning honor to our Lord and King, Jesus Christ.' (1 Peter 2:16 ,17)
"Jehovah's Witnesses do not believe themselves to be holier or special"
BULL****! When a group openly professes that the only people that will survive Armageddon are ones associated with and in good standing with their organization, and that all those who are not will be murdered by a vengeful Old Testament God, they are saying "Hey, we're special!"
If you can't see that then you are truely blind.
Hey everyone! The new Alice Rachel!
I love the way these apologists know exactly what Jehovah is thinking. Aren't they clever?
I'm wondering how many of you still feeling a burning need to know God and have a relationship with Him.
I won't make my comment entirely about belief, but I was at my weakest point when I gave myself to God to do his will and I wound up in a dangerous mind-control cult. So if he has some kind of "will" for me to do, I won't go through that again. He will have to personally come to me and tell me what I am to do.
I am dealing with the horrible emotions of having faded, done some things that would be considered immoral, stopped praying (not sure I ever prayed right) and generally just feeling lost.....
If you hurt other people, make amends to them. If you don't think you can make amends because you killed them or it's beyond your power or you will go to prison or whatever, then do what you can to make peace about it. Go to the authorities if you killed or raped, return what you stole if that is all it is. It doesn't have to involve rules of some religion. If your "immoral" act were a sexual act between adults or drunkenness or just something that society frowns on or religion frowns on but not illegal, then you need to remember that Christianity says we were made in God's image and that the God of the Old Testament violated his own rules and did some awful stuff.
A God as wonderful as the seriously religious say he is, should understand how you were burned by a dangerous mind-control cult and give you a break when/if judgement day comes for you. If he is as forgiving as all that, he will understand that you stopped praying.
What have some of you done to get back on track? I've been fading for a year and a half. Missing my first DC....
When it got bad for me, I started going to a counselor and still go. I went to ex-JW meetups and contacted many people from this forum on the phone or internet.
I don't want a "relationship" with a being I've not vetted morally.
First this being needs to explain itself and its actions/inactions and convince me of its morality first.