I want to know whether 607 is valid or not.

by XPeterX 157 Replies latest jw friends

  • changeling
    changeling

    I found this in my "Word" documents. It's a chart someone posted on JWD a few years ago. I checked the source material. It all checks out and it just happens to be WT material.

    539 =Fall of Babylon (history and society both agree=insight book volume one under Babylon)

    + 17 =Nabonidus years of reign (society agree=insight book volume two under Nabonidus)

    556 =Labashi-Marduk reigned 9 months (society agree=01/01/65 watchtower)

    + 4 =Neriglissar years of reign (society agree=01/01/65 watchtower)

    560

    + 2 =Evil Merodach years of reign (society agree=01/01/65 watchtower)

    562

    + 43 =Nebuchadnezzar years of reign (society agree=insight book volume two under Nebuchadnezzar)

    605

    + 21 =Nabopolassar years of reign (society agree=02/02/69 watchtower)

    626

    According to the math Nebuchadnezzar began rule in 605 and reigned 43 years till 562.

    Now we know Nebuchadnezzar took over Jerusalem in his 18/19 year.

    So take 605 and subtract 18/19 years and you get 586/587

  • garyneal
    garyneal

    Peter,

    It appears you chose to believe the clergy rather than the experts. You're free to do that. People have been doing it for centuries. That's how the churches stay in business...and business is booming!

    I concur with OMG. You have just joined the ranks of those individuals who get offended around Christmas time when business establishments say HAPPY HOLIDAYS as opposed to Merry CHRISTmas simply because they feel that Satan is working hard to remove Christ from CHRISTmas.

    Not only does the CHURCH exploit this form of their persecution complex, so does the Republican party when it suits their agenda.

    Your church will be happy to have company people like you. I'm sure your persecution complex is running high right now.

    Have a nice life.

  • changeling
    changeling

    He's a young man, garyneal, and leaving the WT and accepting that everything you've been taught was false is tough. The fact that he's even here, on this forum, tells me he will one day wake up and smell the coffee. :)

  • garyneal
    garyneal
    He's a young man, garyneal, and leaving the WT and accepting that everything you've been taught was false is tough.

    I understand, having your faith cast into doubt like that is tough to deal with. Been there...

    Peter,

    Whatever you do, just remember to keep testing and proving all things. Truth stands up to scrutiny.

  • sd-7
    sd-7

    It does seem pointless to add to what has already been said here. But I thought it worthwhile to add some points, purely from the Bible itself. Jeremiah wrote that only about 4,000+ people were actually taken as captives. I'm pretty sure Jerusalem had more than 4,000 people living there. That alone tells you that Jerusalem was not quite as utterly desolated as the WTS makes it appear--thus also indicating that the utter destruction of the city and rendering it a total wasteland was unnecessary for Jeremiah's prophecies to be fulfilled.

    Consider also that Jeremiah foretells in chapter 25 that "all THESE NATIONS", plural, "must serve the king of Babylon seventy years." This prophecy had to do with far more than just Jerusalem. The Society takes this verse out of its context and forces its own ideas onto it, when any individual who is capable of basic reading comprehension would never have drawn the conclusion that this prophecy was about Jerusalem alone. There were several nations involved, and in order for it to fit all of them comprehensively--plus the fact that Jehovah would punish Babylon right after these seventy years were over--we'd have to find a date where Babylon reasonably holds control over the areas Jeremiah prophesied against.

    I posted on that jehovahs-judgment.co.uk issue before--this understanding requires us to believe Daniel travelled backwards in time a year--to a time when even by JW logic he wasn't even IN Babylon yet to interpret Nebuchadnezzar's dream. (By JW logic, Daniel was taken to Babylon in the third year of Jehoiakim's vassalage to Nebuchadnezzar, yet Daniel is interpreting Nebuchadnezzar's dream in the SECOND year. Quite impossible unless we recognize that it was actually just plain Jehoiakim's fourth year of reign, which was the first year of Nebuchadnezzar, when Daniel was taken captive [Jeremiah 25:1].) Anytime we have to master time travel to understand the Bible, you know something's fishy.

    Present any evidence from the Watchtower--specific source--to change Jerusalem's destruction from 606 to 607. Just prove that alone, and demonstrate that the Society respects the facts. If you can't even find a scholarly source that names 606 as the date, how can you find MORE evidence to move this date, which is absent from historical sources, one year backwards? This, I'd like to see.

  • Heaven
    Heaven

    Changeling... that's a great timeline list. Not too involved and with confirmation from the WTS themselves. I've noticed they're not good at doing math. Their whole 'we're preaching to all the inhabited Earth' doesn't work when you do the math. Kinda like the impossibility of Santa Claus accomplishing his supposed work. Mathematically impossible.

    What struck me odd when I checked into it, was the simple fact that Nebbie wasn't in power in 607 so how could this King take down Jeruselum when he hadn't even come to power yet?

    < ---- I do a lot of this when dealing with this cult.

  • Titus
    Titus

    I said that I will not participate in this discussion, but I would like to ask a question:

    SD7, Jeremiah also says:

    ...and all the kingdoms of the earth that are on the surface of the ground...

    Do you take it literally?

    If you do, then it is OK to say that what you said:

    Consider also that Jeremiah foretells in chapter 25 that "all THESE NATIONS", plural, "must serve the king of Babylon seventy years." This prophecy had to do with far more than just Jerusalem. The Society takes this verse out of its context and forces its own ideas onto it, when any individual who is capable of basic reading comprehension would never have drawn the conclusion that this prophecy was about Jerusalem alone. There were several nations involved, and in order for it to fit all of them comprehensively--plus the fact that Jehovah would punish Babylon right after these seventy years were over--we'd have to find a date where Babylon reasonably holds control over the areas Jeremiah prophesied against.
  • sd-7
    sd-7

    Well, Jeremiah hadn't heard of the Americas, and I'm sure he didn't include China or Australia or even most of Africa, so obviously he wasn't talking about all the nations of earth. However, again, Jeremiah makes his own meaning as clear as day as to who "these nations" are when he is instructed in Jeremiah 25 to deliver this message to SPECIFIC NATIONS surrounding Jerusalem, who will receive punishment through Babylon's conquering them.

    So what you're suggesting is comparing apples and oranges, frankly.

  • Titus
    Titus

    OMGJ.

    OK. I am giving up!

  • garyneal
    garyneal

    The bottom line here is that the whole reason we are even having this debate is because some religious leaders of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society decided that they needed something other than the pyramids to support their belief that Christ Jesus began ruling invisibly in 1914.

    It is pointless for most Christians as their faith in Christ is not shaken either way. But to a Jehovah's Witness, if 607 B.C.E. is wrong, that is VERY significant. The most telling aspect of this debate is that only the Watchtower Society staunchly defends this date, why?

    Understanding their motivation is key to why the society and all witnesses who swallow this teaching try so hard to defend it. For those who can't defend it, they try to pretend that it does not matter and that the Society is still the true religion. However, by going this route, they have no basis to prove that the Society's authority to interpret scripture is any more valid than the Catholics. Either way, they lose and they know it.

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