If theres no God why the earth, the brain the universe? (Atheist and Agnostics)

by cyberjesus 69 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  cyberjesus

  Hmm Also we know of the circumstances necessary to reproduce life in the "universe" our our planet, but we dont know of other circumstances of other type of life and their requirements outside "our universe of knowledge"

  And if the Universe is that old there might have been life in other planets already and might have even gone extint millions of years ago. And here we are worrying about if should celebrate birthdays or not :-)

  How do you cope with the fact that we are so insignificant and that our life is really a sigh of air? Weird to me.
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  OnTheWayOut

  I am not talking on the whole universe but only our Galaxy. We would have already discovered there was life in other planets by now, wouldnt we? Thanks for the links

  I think you confuse our solar system with our galaxy. Our solar system, the planets and all that revolves around a single star (the sun) probably doesn't have life, but it might have, it might, it might in the future. Life as we know it exists in a narrow band of distance from the sun because that's the ideal temperature that water is in a liquid form. Life as we know it needs that water. Venus or Mars could also be considered possible places for life.

  The galaxy is the Milky Way with billions of stars. The very next star over is very very very very far away. I might be a bit behind on what science has accomplished, but I am pretty sure that the most advanced telescopes have still not actually seen planets and their contents in any other part of the galaxy except our own solar system. I think they have only seen shadows that indicate where planets are at. There may be things on planets all over the galaxy and we haven't discovered them yet. There are probably planets within the narrow band where water would be present in a liquid form orbiting several of those stars.

  There are different theories about whether life is common or rare. Much of what we have seen on Earth indicates that the existence of water makes life common. But even if it's rare to get the right conditions, a tiny fraction of those billions of stars own systems might contain a planet with life. We cannot know because it's still so far far away. It's possible that none of them is advanced enough to make a trip to Earth or that they simply haven't gotten around to us because they are busy elsewhere. If life is very rare, there still might be more life in some other galaxy. Those are so far away that it would take an incredibly advanced "people" to bridge that gap, and they would need a reason to do so.
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  AwSnap

  marked for later
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  maninthemiddle

  For me, design or purpose is a figment of man's imagination.

  This is the same imagination that allows us to see faces is clouds and paintings and toast.

  We are all going to ge suprised when the aliens that seeded us here return to harvest us.

  Just saying, there are many more than two possabilites.
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  AllTimeJeff

  Cyberjesus

  To me, the key question you continue to ask is, why?

  Title of your thread: If theres no God why the earth, the brain the universe? (Atheist and Agnostics)

  In your opening salvo, you stated: "I personally do not believe in the Bible as Gods word, nor I am sure of the existance of a monotheist God. I have no clue at this point. But then again I am a new Agnostic. However I struggle with the fact that all of the wonderfull and very precise factors existing in our world might be a product of random events. To me, design or purpose is apparent."

  I think it is excellent of you to solicit other people's views as you stretch to find your own conclusions. Because in the end, in my opinion, they have to be your own conclusions, and you have to be at peace with that.

  "Why" is such a strong question to ask. It demands an answer, even if an answer isn't available, we'll try. Sometimes though, "why" cannot be answered. Even to assume in the theological world that an answer does exist is at best a guess, sometimes based on superstitious religion, other times based on strong personal intuition.

  While you ask us on this board for some new perspectives, ultimately, you must be at peace at some point with what speaks best to you.

  For me, there is no evidence of god in the traditional sense as taught in religions. But there are emotional reasons to believe in a higher power. I am of the opinion that most people do have a spiritual side.

  I also believe deep down, that when we/you/I ask "why", we are really asking "What am I here for? What is my purpose in life? Why am I here?"

  Being a former JW, having been lied to and tricked, I understand that we want to get it "right" if its possible. Ironically, the whole appeal of being a JW is that there is one ultimate truth. "Hey, I am right!" There is no better feeling. Thats the candy of being a JW. You can be the lowest of the low, but at least you will be among those who survive Armageddon.

  So to be at peace with the possibility that there is no one right universal truth (as is evidenced by the 7 billion people all over the planet, with disparate belief systems and ideas about god) leaves 2 other options. (maybe more, just my opinion.)

  1. There is no truth's at all, and we can be upset about that, or
  2. There only needs to be your truth, and it needs the approval of no one but yourself.

  For me, I am a deist most days. I allow that a higher power, perhaps an extra terrestrial intelligence exists. It doesn't matter though. If god exists, or a higher power exists, and they somehow want my attention, they (probably) know where I live. I don't know why I have to do all the heavy lifting for these supposedly "higher" powers anyway.

  My bottom line is, whatever works for me is great for me, and if something else works for you, and it doesn't hurt anyone else, have at it. Learn of the possibilities, but don't be surprised when you learn of other possibilities that actually work for different people. If you honor other possibilites, I think that is one of the most spiritual things a human can do. Perhaps it will lead you to the personal answers you seek.

  Good luck! :)
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  Simon

  Let me ask you ... when it snows, who organizes all the snowflakes so that they blanket the earth and everything on it perfectly?

  Really ... is someone in charge of them? Do they organize it between themselves or is it just a natural process that produces something perfect and ordered?
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  OnTheWayOut

  Confucious said "If we don't know life, how can we know death?"

  We don't have all the answers. But we want to have them. It is impossible. The desire to know is to want to know about life after death and what started it all and how it will all end. That is just not in the cards for us at this time. I don't believe we will ever devise time travel. If we did, then perhaps we could go to the beginning of the universe and to the end. Until then, we really won't know.

  While there is reason and evidence for many things, people are apt to say that such evidence is flawed or misinterpreted. Faith overrides reason or reason excludes the improbable.

  One man insists that the human brain could not have evolved from the lower life forms. Another man shows how it could have happened. One man insists that miracles have happened, another gives plausible explanations for why people believe in such miracles.

  I now accept the eastern thought that the middle path is alright for me. I may not believe in God, but I don't exclude the possibility, especially in the minds of others. The universe is re-created every moment (and each second contains scores of moments). Our thoughts are as much a part of reality as our senses tell us of reality. Colors and smells and tastes and sights are only what our limited senses interpret our surroundings as. I contend that a universe created a moment ago is different for each individual and valid for each individual. That doesn't mean I believe in such things as Jehovah or the Flying Spaghetti Monster, but that is my reality. Then again, in my "New-universe-every-moment" reality, we could never travel backward or forward in time because those past and future universes had their moment. So we would never know for sure.

  "If we don't know life, how can we know death (or afterlife)?"
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  WTWizard

  Why only one planet has life? Because the other planets are so far away that it is currently impossible to tell with certainty that they also contain life.
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  What-A-Coincidence

  I'm a FREE thinker ... I believe whats convenient whenver I want..sometimes I'm an athiest sometimes i'm a believer ... There is no need to be a believer or not so help me god
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  Nathan Natas

  Hi, Cyberjesus. You seem sincere in your quest for understanding, which is commendable.

  Last night I watched a show on PBS NOVA titled "What Darwin Didn't Know." It discussed molecular biology (DNA, etc) and how our understanding of how DNA works has been increasing. The show was produced to coincide with the 200th birthday of Charles Darwin and the 150th anniversary of the publication of his book, The Origin of the Species.

  Darwin was an interesting person. Since his childhood, he loved nature. He didn't like school. His father was an educated man of some accomplishment, so he decided that Charles should become a doctor, and shipped him off to a boarding school that taught medicine. Although Charles was very keen on nature, he was squeamish, and when watching an operation being performed on a young boy (this was BEFORE anesthesia) he ran from the room horrified by the goriness of the situation. He decided to pursue a THEOLOGICAL education. When the expedition of the Beagle was being put together, Darwin applied for a position as naturalist. The captain liked him and felt he would be good company on the five-year trip around South America, so he permitted Darwin to join the crew. During the expedition, Darwin collected fossils of Giant Sloths, Glyptodonts, and other examples of now-extinct giant mammals. But it wasn't until the Beagle got all the way around South America to the Galapagos Islands that Darwin began the collection that would really get him thinking. He collected dozens of specimens of birds indigenous to the Galapagos. When he got back home and he began organizing his collection he realized that all these birds were finches, yet they had showed a wide variety of differences of appearance.

  I'll let you watch the TV show to get the ending, but one thought occurred to me early on in the show: in the 150 years since Darwin wrote "Origin," continuing scientific discovery has not made the biblical account of creation more believable, but LESS believable. Real TRUTH is congruent with REALITY. Real TRUTH is borne out by the accumulation of facts. As our understanding of the mechanisms of molecular biology increase, there is more and more understanding of the mechanisms by which evolution accomplishes what theologians have mocked as "impossible." "Where did fish get legs from?" Molecular biology can now explain that.

  Want to be a GOOD APOSTATE? The MOST "apostate" thing you can do is get an education and think for yourself.

  Thousands, even hundreds of years ago, when someone asked, "where did all this come from?" The old men of the tribe would make up stories to explain things they didn't understand. As children always do, we believed what our parents told us was true. The fact is, though, that our parents and their parents, and their parents, were just repeating stories they had heard around the campfire at night.

  The truth is less magical and much more wonderful than they could ever imagine.