AMAZING

Amnesian: Your post is long, sprinkled with twisting quotes, misrepresetnations, and a self-deluded series of getting yourself off of the hook, while shifting the blame to others, and you make some good points on which I can agree. I will make a new post to you in a couple of days when I have some time to wade through what you have written. Merry Christmas. - Amazing

Francois

Very well done. Well done indeed.

I would like to make an announcement. In all my years as a JW, I never, ever, not once, brought someone, anyone into the Troof! Most of my field reports were pure fabrication.

I was mainly in it, frankly, because the girls were easy. Easy? Hell, they were EAGER! Poor repressed little darlings that they were.

Gimmie that kinda good ol' fashioned religion ANY day.

Francois

hillary_step

Francois,

I would like to make an announcement. In all my years as a JW, I never, ever, not once, brought someone, anyone into the Troof! Most of my field reports were pure fabrication. I was mainly in it, frankly, because the girls were easy. Easy? Hell, they were EAGER! Poor repressed little darlings that they were.

lol - So as a JW you were a dirty, deceitful, selfish liar.

I hope that you have changed! - HS

D wiltshire

AMNESIAN,

You make much sense.
While not agreeing with everything you wrote(you wrote so much!), for the most part you have hit the nail on the head.
I think we need to be less judgemental of what people do when learning the "Truth is not the Truth", and try our best to walk a mile in their shoes before we critisize and abuse.

If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?

SixofNine

I'm a distrustful bastard, and I think you're full of shit when you say you aren't writing from anger. As if it mattered. I enjoyed your angry rant, and think it well reasoned and logical.

It was a bit hard to know when you were differentiating between A) elders who know the truth, and yet play along for P's, and B) elders who believe the org has the 'truth', and work for that truth along with the attendant P's.

Either way, they're culpable. They don't see the P's 'cause they don't want to see the P's. Once they see the P's, IMO they have two options: reject or rationalize. On the off chance that any elder is reading, I say this; your head should not be stuck so deeply where it is that you cannot see the P's.

I also agree with Hillary's comments about your post, which is unfortunate because he is soon going to ask me to start carrying my own torture stake.

I hate elders (hate is a strong word, I know, but not strong enough), but we were all in that pit together (as you acknowledged somewhat). I think the way we were trapped by ancient Hebrew superstition is underplayed in these discussions. Which, btw, is exactly where the male/female tension in said discussions comes from.

I figure it's like this:

The elder leaves the publishers house musing, "hmm, I should have gotten to this situation sooner, I may have been a little tough on him/her, but heck, I can't solve everyones problems, and if they would just get with the program, I wouldn't even have to step in. If the congregation didn't need me so much, I would just step down."

The publisher, after the elder leaves, goes in the bathroom, turns on the fan so the rest of the family can't hear him/her crying, and pleads to God thru tears of anguish "I'm sorry...so sorry, I'm so far gone you don't even send shepherds for me till something like this happens....AAAIIIGGGHHH Jehovah!!!, was this elder visit a sign to try harder, to 'get with the program', Jehovah? He didn't really even listen to my real problem, Jehovah....do I even know my real problem Jehovah?....do I just need to "get with the program, Jehovah??? please please please please please hear my prayer. *sob**shirt is soaked*

God, as per usual, is completely silent.

Ps. to those who would applaud this bit of brilliance for it's being pixeled by a woman, I think you do yourself no good.

Tina

bttt

Vive Bene
Spesso L'amore
Di Risata Molto!!!

blondie

bttt

teejay

Amnesian?

Gottt dayum, Woman!! I sure wish you had more time to post here. Taking out Amazing's quotes, this has to be one of the finest dissertations relative to power/elders/misuse & abuse of womankind within the Organization that I've ever seen anywhere. A very fine effacement of many popular (and ERRONEOUS) ideas about elders.

Mind if I repeat just one thing you said? Don't mind? K...

You see, if every good and conscientious man who decided to remain an elder did so only until he pulled off his one big covert operation that will likely reap huge benefits for lots more JWs worldwide than merely a couple of troubled teen-agers and one elderly and ill sister or two in his own congregation, I’d be in their cheering section. You and I both know that is not only rarely the case, it is virtually never the case, which is why “Silentlambs” and “Lee Elder” are receiving well-deserved backslaps.

These type men do more to raise questions in the minds of sincere JWs than any man does who sits on some JC in some remote congregation of 55 publishers in French Lick, Indiana “compassionately” voting to publicly reprove instead of df Brother Filtertip Marlborough. This French Lick man who remains an elder with the weak justification that he is helping others is trying to have his cake and eat it, too. He gets to continue enjoying the perks of being an elder and yet be thought of by the vulnerable and needy sheep as “the good elder” all the while accomplishing nothing nobler than perpetuating the myth that the WTS is God’s organization, with just a few rotten apples that Jehovah is using just to test our faithfulness---“Behold, Jehovah has provided us a ‘good’ shepherd until He comes to rescue us from the Pharisees. In this way we’re helped to stay among God’s people while we wait upon him. Jehovah is good, come quickly Lord Jesus!”

Following that up with: <insert audio file: “projectile vomitous emitus.wav”> was a nice touch that made me grin real big. May I use that? "Projectile vomitous emitus." HA! Ya gotta luv it!!

Very fine post, Sis. Long as hell (I've never read one this long) but definitely a keeper. Thanks.

Peace,
tj

p.s. I think you *are* angry, my dear Sister, but I think you are entirely justified. There is a time and place to have and display that very human emotion, and doing so in the controlled, logical, humorous, sarcastic and intelligent way you did here sets a very fine example that I will try to copy always. It is painfully obvious that YOU know what you're talking about. I bow my head to your eloquence and honesty.

patio34

I haven't read all of the responses because it's so polemic. The condescending attitude present of accusing women of anger if they have a a strong opinion is not what i'll entertain in my mind.

Oddly, even after Amnesian's excellent reasoning in a strong way, there are still some insultingly arguing that she IS angry.

That is bizarre. Even some on this board do think that, why do they think it's acceptable to continue to argue it? Ah! It's a red herring.

I mostly agree with Amnesian. There seems to be throwback attitudes not only from the WTS, but also the Bible mythology and fables themselves. After all, where does the WTS get its 'inspiration'?

It would seem appropos for some to check their motivation and attitudes.

Pat

P.S. Addendum: now I've read it all. However, I didn't read Amazing's original argumentation. But will if i have time. Both are excellent reasoning posters, however, for now, .......the winner is..... Amnesian!!

Plus, I think only one continued to impute anger as motive.

TweetieBird

Amnesian, remind me to never piss you off. I will always want you on my team.

Seriously, you brought out some excellent points. Unless you are a women in the borg, I don't think you can fully understand what it's like.

I did think you pounced on Amazing a little too hard, but I'm sure he can take it. You do however, seem to paint all elders with the same paintbrush and I'm not sure I agree with that. There have been a few good elders along the way that were clueless about how the organization was really run. However, your description of elders describes the ones I've had dealings with over the years. I consider myself an independent female with a brain and I think that intimidates them. In virtually every congregation I've been in I have noticed that women like me are treated differently than the sweet, humble, mute sisters.

I enjoyed you post.

"By doubting we come at truth" -Cicero

AMAZING - Exposing Elders (re: Expose Ave...

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