Is this really smoking gun of Obama's Kenyan birth?

by What-A-Coincidence 165 Replies latest social current

  • Farkel


    :Most likely out of security reasons , so people don't copy it and then fill in a bogus name.

    Using that reasoning, NO documents should ever be released by the Government for the same reason.

    :I think the government has looked into this enough and it really is a non-issue.

    What gives you reason to have so much faith in the government, Winston Smith?


  • SixofNine

    Exposed: White Supremacists Heavily Involved in 'Birther' Movement


    By now, you know the story of the so-called "Birther Movement" -- conspiracy theorists who bullheadedly insist without a shred of proof that Obama is a Kenyan-born foreigner who is barred by the Constitution from even running for president, let alone being the nation's CEO and commander-in-chief of the armed forces.

    Never mind the fact that Obama was born on August 4, 1961 -- two years after Hawaii became America's 50th state -- in Honolulu's Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital and that the document exists to prove it. Obama's birth certificate was issued by the Hawaii Department of Health, which confirmed last week that it has the document -- copies of which have been circulating on the Internet for months -- on file.

    Never mind the fact that both of Honolulu's major newspapers, the Advertiser and the Star-Bulletin, published announcements about the president's birth to "Mr. & Mrs. Barack H. Obama 6085 Kalanianaole Hwy." in Honolulu, in their August 13 and August 14, 1961 editions, respectively.

    Never mind the fact that a Honolulu resident, Eleanor Nordyke, gave birth to twin girls in the same hospital the day after Obama was born -- and whose daughters attended the same Honolulu school Obama attended -- and likely knew the boy who would grow up to become America's first African-American president.

    Never mind the fact that certified copies of the president's birth certificate can be ordered through the Hawaii Department of Health's Online Vital Records Ordering System, albeit on a strictly limited basis in accordance with the state's privacy law.

    Never mind the fact that the original Obama birth certificate itself was viewed, verified as authentic, photographed and posted online last November by the nonpartisan Web site,, which declared that the document "meets all of the requirements from the State Department for proving U.S. citizenship. Claims that the document lacks a raised seal or a signature are false."


    The far-right-wing posted what it said were photographs purporting to show a certified copy of a birth certficate for Barack Hueesin Obama II on August 4, 1961 at the Central Coast Provincial Hospital in Mombasa, Kenya.

    The photos were released by California attorney Orly Taitz, who has filed a number of lawsuits demanding proof of Obama's eligibility to serve as president -- only to see the suits dismissed as being without merit.

    An examination of the photos reveal several inconsistencies in the alleged Kenyan birth certificate. They do not show the signatures of either the president's white, Kansas-born mother, Ann Dunham or of his black, Kenyan-born father, Barack Obama, Sr. Nor do they show any signatures by the registrar or by the attending physicians. Kenya was under British rule in 1961. Under British law, birth certificates are not legally valid without such signatures.

    Other discrepancies in the alleged Kenyan birth certificate include listing Obama's mother under his father's surname -- when, in fact, Dunham legally kept her maiden name throughout her marriage. And it lists Dunham's age as 16, when, in fact, she was 18 when she gave birth to the future president.

    The lower-left-hand corner of the alleged document refers to the "Republic of Kenya." But Kenya did not gain its independence from Britain until 1963 -- when the young Barack was two years old.

    Most importantly, Dunham never set foot on Kenyan soil -- In fact, the president's mother did not leave the United States until 1967, when she moved to Indonesia to live with her second husband, Lolo Seotoro (She divorced the senior Obama in 1964 after she learned that he was married to another woman in Kenya).

    And contrary to the claims of the "Birthers," Dunham never renounced her U.S. citizenship, returning to the States -- with 11-year-old Barack -- in 1972.


    So why, despite so much clear evidence that the president was indeed born in Hawaii two years after statehood and is therefore a native-born U.S. citizen, are these conspiracy theorists continuing to insist that Obama was not born in the U.S., but rather in his father's native Kenya?

    Conspiracy theorists are notorious for stubbornly clinging to their beliefs, no matter how much or how solid evidence exists to disprove their theories. And the "Birther Movement" is no exception.

    But this particular conspiracy-theory movement is more sinister than most. The 'Skeeter Bites Report has uncovered a wealth of evidence that the "Birther Movement" against the president is inextricably tied to white supremacists and other far-right extremists -- and is profoundly marked by an absolute refusal among its practitioners to accept Obama as president because he is black, or because of an equally-false belief that he is a Muslim.

    The person who planted the seeds for the "Birther Movement" is Andy Martin, a perennial fringe candidate for public office who is also credited with first spreading false rumors of the president being a Muslim with ties to Islamic extremists. Martin -- a frequent guest on Sean Hannity's Fox News Channel program -- was exposed as a notoriously anti-Jewish bigot.

    In a campaign fundraising letter he issued during an unsuccessful run for a Connecticut congressional seat in 1986, Martin -- then known as Anthony R. Martin-Trigona -- pledged to "exterminate Jew Power in America," claimed that "Jew babies are fed with subsidized American taxpayer money" and that Jews were "schooled in blood-sucking and money-grubbing from birth." Martin's anti-Semitic diatribe was obtained and posted by

    Martin subsequently moved to Florida and sought the Republican nomination for a state Senate seat a decade later. After learning of Martin's prior anti-Semitic fundraising pitch, GOP officials withdrew their support for him. The 62-year-old Martin now lives in Chicago, the president's adopted hometown.

    Martin started his anti-Obama smear campaign in 2004 after Obama, then a U.S. Senate candidate, delivered the keynote address that electrified the delegates at the Democratic National Convention in Boston and put the future president on the national political radar screen.

    In several guest appearances on the "Hannity" show, Martin accused Obama -- without offering any proof -- of being "in training for radical overthrow of the government," based on his relationship with former 1960s radical William Ayres.

    According to, Martin was wanted in New York and Florida on outstanding arrest warrants as of last October. The New York warrant, out of Ulster County, resulted from harassment charges related to a child custody battle. The Florida warrant, from Palm Beach County, was filed in connection with a criminal contempt conviction.


    The belief that Obama is a foreigner has spread like wildfire among white- supremacist circles and Web sites, including Stormfront, the largest and best-known self-styled "white nationalist" site on the Web; the Council of Conservative Citizens, listed by the Southern Poverty Law Center as "the largest white nationalist group in America," a reincarnation of the old White Citizens Councils that were formed to resist desegregation in the 1950s and 1960s; and, a virulently anti-immigrant site.

    That white-supremacist groups are heavily involved in the "Birther Movement" against the president should come as no surprise, given the massive coronary they collectively suffered last November when Obama was elected. According to the Anti-Defamation League (ADL), which monitors and exposes extremist activity and rhetoric, anger among white supremacists and other right-wing extremists in response to Obama's victory "resulted in an avalanche of vitriolic postings on racist Web sites" -- at one point, causing Stormfront's server to crash.


    Questions remain unanswered about James von Brunn, the 89-year-old white supremacist gunman who shot and killed a black security officer inside the U.S. Holocaust Museum in Washington in June. Investigators found a notebook in von Brunn's car that listed up to nine other target areas in the nation's capital -- including the White House.

    According to Abraham Foxman, national director of the ADL, von Brunn not only believed that Obama was not born in the U.S. and ineligible to be president, but "he also believed that Hitler didn't kill enough Jews. He had a history of anti-Semitic, hateful views."

    Von Brunn is also the founder of a white-supremacist Web site, HolyWesternEmpire,org, which is laced with anti-Semitic quotations.

    The site was taken offline after von Brunn's arrest, but according to former Fox News host Alan Colmes, von Brunn published on his Web site in 2002 a book that detailed anti-Semitic conspiracy theories, with chapters such as "The Holocaust Hoax" and "The Negro." The book was mostly anti-Semitic but also attacked all nonwhite ethnicities.

    "We are witnessing today on the world stage a tragedy of enormous proportions: the calculated destruction of the White Race," Colmes quoted von Brunn as having written. He threatened to take action against nonwhites, writing, "We will offer a plan to remove the cancer from our cultural organism."

  • snowbird

    Thank you, 2/3.

    We - instinctively, viscerally - know what it's all about.


  • JeffT

    There are plenty of real issues to get worked up about, this isn't one of them.

  • JWoods
    There are plenty of real issues to get worked up about, this isn't one of them.

    I belong to a fairly conservative car board (with a few of the hardcore left present also). Only two of the people there keep bringing this up: believe it or not, it is usually the liberal fringe that like to stir this silly issue up. Conservatives seem to have moved on past it...maybe the left likes the issue because they know it is real tinfoil hat stuff that they can easily refute. Of course, some people still believe that G.W.Bush wired up the buildings prior to 9/1/1 and detonated them by remote control...

  • cameo-d

    This reminds me of Melchizedek....

    there was always a controversy concerning his origins, also.

  • SixofNine
  • Olin Moyles Ghost
    Olin Moyles Ghost

    This "birther" debate is a gift for Democrats and the administration. It makes the right look like a bunch of looney conspiracy theorists. The more airtime that is given to the "birthers" is less airtime that is available to criticize the administration's policies (e.g., health care, tax policy).

  • Farkel

    The article posted is a strawman. First, it posits that the "Birther Movement" was started by right wing supremecists, which is a form of the ad hominem known as "poisoning the well." Even if it were true, that is not the argument.

    Secondly, it posits that Obama couldn't have possibly been born in Kenya, or that his Kenya "birth certificate" is fraudulent. Another strawman. Even if his Kenyan certificate IS fraudulent that doesn't provide he was born in the USA.

    The real argument is simple: all Obama needs to do is to make sure the public is convinced by FACTS that he is constitutionally elligible to be President. All that would take is for him to order the Hawaiian government to release a bona fide birth certificate, something ALL US Citizens are required to do merely to get a passport. Yet he will not do it. Why?

    I have very good friend who is a 3rd generation Hawaiian, although he is white. His wife is Hawaiian and they have been married for 25 years. She was BORN in Hawaii via a mid-wife and about ten years ago they moved from Hawaii to California. She speaks Hawaiian, she looks Hawaiian, she IS Hawaiian, a native as were her ancestors going back eons ago. She and her relatives have had a claim against the Campbell Trust in Hawaii for decades to reclaim their stolen ancestor's lands.

    Last year, their families wanted to meet for a holiday in Mexico and she needed a passport, so she applied for one. She was denied a passport because she couldn't "prove" she was a US citizen because she couldn't produce a valid state-recognized certificate of live birth. She and her husband both went to the US Passport office in San Francisco and pleaded her case, but again she was denied the passport.

    Why? Midwives were commonly used when she was born and "official" birth certificates were not a big deal back then. When she started school in Hawaii at age six they did file the paperwork, but no original "certificate of live birth" was ever filed as the midwife who delivered her had died by then. Relatives who were present at the time have signed sworn affidavits of her birth, but they were rejected wholesale by the United States.

    They never got the passport and of course, could not go to Mexico.

    The document she provided that was not considered a valid birth certificate was the SAME document Obama provided to prove he was eligible to be the President of the United States. The document she needed to get a passport, she didn't have and that is the SAME document Obama has REFUSED to be released. Why not? Does it even exist? We don't know because the very simple solution to this problem is being stonewalled.

    The evidence that she is a native born USA citizen AND a native born Hawaiian is overwhelming and the evidence that Obama is a native born USA citizen is suspect. Yet she can't get a passport and Obama CAN be President of the United States without fully meeting the Constitutional test of a President? She only needed to provide she was merely a US citizen, but Obama needs to prove he was a native-born US Citizen, yet she can't get a passport and he gets to be President?

    I'm not a white supremecist. Nor am I a right-winger. I'm merely a US citizen who wants another US citizen who happens to be President of the United States to follow the Constitution, yet he and his supporters don't seem to think this issue is important.

    I do.

    Let me ask a very important question:

    If it were proven that Barak Hussein Obama was NOT a native-born US citizen as required by the Constitution, would you demand that he be removed as President, or not?


  • SixofNine
    Secondly, it posits that Obama couldn't have possibly been born in Kenya, or that his Kenya "birth certificate" is fraudulent. Another strawman. Even if his Kenyan certificate IS fraudulent that doesn't provide he was born in the USA.

    That's true Farkel. He might have been born on Pleiades.

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