by desib77 55 Replies latest jw friends
You, desib77, mentioned in the initial Post for this Topic "It started out that she was interested in my past and my current questions / viewpoints and we were just going to visit."
So why don't you pretend we're your friend in the coffee shop and we're discussing your current questions / viewpoints and we can just visit, like you wanted. How about that?
Spike:
Okay, if you're sure you really want that.
Let's start with my biggest question / concern. Suffering. I can't imagine that a God that loves his creation would allow the horrible things to go on that do. I heard on the news about a guy that got arrested for having sex with his 4 year old relative. I cannot imagine how he could allow that to happen. And why? According to the Bible we inherited sin from Adam and Eve. Because they, when given free will, did not "pass" a test given by a God who, if he is almighty, should never have needed the test in the first place, then humans are tortured with pain and suffering? It just doesn't seem right to me. And why would he have not scrapped the whole creation thing, realizing that their choice to go against him was a flaw? The same with the Devil. An all-knowing God would have known that he would turn against him.
Honestly, nothing makes sense to me. This is just the beginning of my questions. I would give anything for just one answer that sounds logical....
Thanks for offering to discuss, though....:)
I feel like I need some sort of belief system and don't really have a direction that I "want" it to go.
You really do need to educate yourself as to how cults work, deseb77, because people that are thinking like that are prime targets for all cult recruiters.
Start here to get a general idea of how they work.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnNSe5XYp6E
Chris
Blacksheep:
First of all that is creepy and I really didn't need to see an implied gory shooting. I am well aware of what cults are like. Having left one I see clearly how they work.
Secondly, maybe I shouldn't have used the term "belief system". I don't think there is anything wrong with wanting some sort of answer to my questions and to know what I believe and what I don't.
I can't see how a God that obviously made a flaw in his creation for them to choose incorrectly when tested would allow that creation to continue in a flawed state with added "inperfection". Why not scrap the whole thing? If God is most high and almighty then he would have known that his creation would not stay true to him when tempted. And to allow life as humans to continue in a punished state where people have pain and suffering is absolutely unloving and unjust.
This is a question many people also have.
In order to get past it what I do is think about the alternatives and motives.
If God wanted to create people who would do exactly what he said all the time then he could have created robots.
Problem is that the robots would not be doing anything because they wanted to.
There would be no such thing as ........... want.
If God had created people like this then there would be no allowance for, kindness, mercy, or even love.
People (robots) would simply do things because the had to.
In this situation there would be NO LOVE.
So what God has actually done is made a creation which allows the opportunity for LOVE to actually exist.
He has created LOVE.
I think you need to ask yourself the question whether you would prefer to be a flawless robot or a creation capable of LOVE.
When I look at the accounts in Genesis I see the remarkable possibilities.
God could have created flawless robots.
or the alternative:
Created people with the ability to love if they so choose.
I think he made the right decision.
abe
But isn't that what he thought he was doing? Creating "flawless" people........ "perfect" people. If not, then how could they have been given inperfection? And God does want people that will do what he wants them to, why else would he "punish" for not doing his will?
Love is a wonderful thing and I am very thankful that I have been made with the capability to love but I don't believe that it was a choice between creation that can love and creation that obeys God. You have to think that this is the almighty God. Why a choice? Why not humans that can love and yet worship him the way he so obviously wants to be worshipped?
desib77: Why not humans that can love and yet worship him the way he so obviously wants to be worshipped?
Spike Tassel: That's the choice you now have, if you'd be willing to love and worship him that way.
I'm saying that he didn't allow it to be so simple. By him allowing pain and suffering of others I don't know that I can accept that. He didn't have to punish the entire human race. It was a choice and until I understand why that choice was made, I can't just be accepting.
Each one must make the choice to love and worship him on his own terms. Just as I do, so you can too. After all, if we draw close to God, then He draws close to us. It's happening to me; it can happen to you, too.
Spike:
Thank you for your thoughts on all this..... You seem to have peace of mind and I hope to someday as well......
