Global Warming Is Irreversible, Study Says

by Alpaca 67 Replies latest social current

  • besty
    besty

    Deputy Dog - you should have noted with your link that the scientists listed only have to disagree with a single one of many mainstream conclusions, do not have to be a climate scientist, do not have to be currently employed in that role and only have to have one peer-reviewed paper published in any natural science to be included on the list....of course you can form a long list with those criteria

    For the purpose of this list a "scientist" is an individual who has published at least one peer-reviewed article during their lifetime in the broadly-construed area of natural sciences, though not necessarily in recent years nor in a field relevant to climate.

    Assesment of the consensus is not best served by this type of list.

  • Deputy Dog
    Deputy Dog

    besty

    Way to go. Next you'll be calling them names.

  • ninja
    ninja

    thank f*ck global warming is here.......I'm freezing.....p.s....I think climate change is pish......I call it ..."weather"

  • Homerovah the Almighty
    Homerovah the Almighty

    It is known for along time that the earth's atmosphere self cleanses itself naturally, so wouldn't

    an effort on are part beneficial to help mother nature for all concerned ?

    I've read that scientific study and I find it weak and based off subjective theory.

    Personally I think going green is a smart and forward looking agenda that

    all mega nations like China and India should be forced into enacting,

    those countries are said to grow leaps and bounds and their populations are at a billion a piece.

  • Alpaca
    Alpaca

    Is there room for doubt about global warming or global climate change?

    Absolutely! In science, it is often not possible to declare something to be true or proven. That is how science works. Scientific "proof" of something usually exists on a continuum between "true" and "false." Hypotheses are advanced, they are tested, and as they are refined theories based on them are formulated. As hypotheses and theories are tested the evidence pushes them toward one end of the continuum of the other--i.e., either tending toward true or false.

    It is no different with the climate change issue. Credible scientists have come down along the whole continuum. The fact is that most of them believe that humans are the cause for much of the change we are presently experiencing. It could turn out that the climate change advocates are wrong or their theories may be verified. Only time will tell. The problem is that if they are proven right the stakes are very high.

    Anytime someone gets dogmatic about an issue like this (either becoming a rabid advocate or a blind naysayer) they have thrown the scientific method out the window, and that gets us nowhere.

  • SixofNine
    SixofNine

    Supposedly the earth was about to enter a new ice age before the industrial revolution changed that. Maybe the two will balance each other out.

    wtf? ohh, sorry kids, we shit all over your future, but we were gambling on an ice age coming, it was due any time (and we do mean any time).

    I know that's not what you meant David, but you generally have a lot more respect for science than your comment would indicate (because your comment does not reflect the thinking of climate scientist at all).

  • Deputy Dog
    Deputy Dog

    If we can't do anything to reverse it, what makes you think that we can cause it?

  • Alpaca
    Alpaca

    Is that supposed to be a logical argument?

    If you break Humpty-Dumpty and you can't put him back together, does that mean that you were incapable of breaking him?

  • SixofNine
    SixofNine
    If we can't do anything to reverse it, what makes you think that we can cause it?

    If you're too goddamn stupid to discuss global climate, why are you commenting on this thread?

    We can cause it, because adding ghg's to the atmosphere warm the earth. And we are doing just that in quantities and at a rate that the earth has never seen.

    If you've got some clever reason why doing that will NOT warm the earth, let's hear it. Otherwise, stfu. So far no one has come up with any reason why adding ghg's to the atmosphere won't warm the earth (and certainly not for lack of trying to find a loophole). Hence we have the rock solid theory of anthropogenic global warming.

    Also, just because some effects of global warming are "irreversable", does not mean that A) those effects can't be mitigated, and B) it is especially STUPID to suggest that because some effects of global warming are irreversable, we should just go ahead and make them worse.

    Seriously, you effing Darwin Award winning bitches need to just go ahead and kill yourselves.

  • Kudra
    Kudra

    Two things:

    1. Temperature fluctuations can be precisely reconstructed using the main climate forcing mechanisms.

    These are: external (solar input) and internal (volcanoes). This is aside from any anthropogenic (human) "meddling" in the form of aerosol or greenhouse gas emissions.

    Since we have had meterological observations we can compare what the climatologists have reconstructed (temperature with high accuracy and precision and precipitation with less accuracy and precision) with the actual temperature measurements and observations.

    From ~ AD 1600 (beginning of observational record) until the inception of the industrial period, the predicted (reconstructed) temperatures are precisely what is predicted/reconstructed by the model using the natural climate forcings of solar input and volcanic activity. However, since the industrial period, the temperature record can not be modeled using solar and volcanic forcing. Only by factoring in the re-radiative influence of greenhouse gases- carbon dioxide and methane, but others as well- can the temperature be accurately reconstructed.

    The interannual variability (up and down wiggles of temperature like, 1998 being hot and 2005 being colder, etc) is the same in *frequency*, but the *magnitude* is too low if you do not factor in greenhouse gases. It is like the same temperature curve is shifted up a "notch" from what it would be with out anthropogenic warming.

    This is why it is rediculous to say that, oh- since this year is colder than 1998, then "global warming" is not happening. You need to look at what the trend would be *with* ghg factored in and what it would be *without* anthropogenic forcings.

    And the tired argument that earth goes through natural cycles... Yes, it does, we know the magnitude of the greenhouse gases for these cycles for the last 800,000 years. Than is almost a *million* years. There is a maximum and a minimum that correspond to glacial maxima and minima. We are currently orderrs of magnitude out of that range. and teh levels have increased at a rate (rates are important in biology and climatology) that is entirely unprecedented- which is undisputed. Now, can the Earth survive that corresponding temperature increase? I don't know. We will find out. But the fact that GHGs are higherr than they have been in almost 1 million years, and that warming can be attributed to them is undisputable.

    Which brings me to point two.

    2. The "consensus issue". For my PhD I am getting a minor in Global Change (it has always been called global change, not global warming, as the effects of an altered climate include increased temperatures but also changing precipitation and atmospheric circulation etc -the media just like "Global Warming", it sounds scary) and we wanted to find a climate change contrarian to come in to talk to our class. The *only* one we could find - that is on "the list" (of scientists that disagree with global change ideas) was a professor in the Atmospheric Sciences department- we were excited!! cool!

    So, come to find, he was put on the list because.... he disagreed with the magnitude of the change predicted for *precipitation* (that's rainfall) in the southwestern US. What ?? didn't he disagree with climate change???

    no.... He, like the rest of the climatology and paleoclimatology community understands the physical mechanisms behind the increase in temperatures attributed to recent rises in carbon dioxide. The findings are robust and have been repeatedly tested and he understands that. He just had a problem with the findings of the IPCC (Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change) on the timing of rainfall...

    Important lesson for those who look at that list, don't ya think? Many are scientists from fields faaaaar from climatology and those that are in the field, like Dr Castro, don't disagree with the fact that the Earrth is warrming due to anthropogenic reasons- the compilerrs of the list *cherry-picked* (like the WTBTS, guys) statements that put them at odds withthe IPCC...

    -K

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