COMMENTS YOU WILL NOT HEAR AT THE WT STUDY 09-07-08 (HOUSE TO HOUSE MINISTR

by Mary 74 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  dark angle

  Thanks Mary for the effort!! Primary points been seriously considered!! Job well done!!

  From the Philippines
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  fokyc

  First class coverage, many thanks Mary, this will be of great help

  as I am having to sit through this Study tomorrow morning in a KH in the UK

  I shall be in Oxfordshire incognito, I hope!

  fokyc
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  moomanchu

  Great commentary thanks.

  I'd love to tell a jaydub "why don't you go back to the bottomless pit from where you came from and serve your king Abaddon. "

  Rev 9: 2 And he opened the bottomless pit, and smoke arose out of the pit like the smoke of a great furnace. So the sun and the air were darkened because of the smoke of the pit. 3 Then out of the smoke locusts came upon the earth.

  11 And they had as king over them the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in Hebrew is Abaddon, but in Greek he has the name Apollyon.
  

  This sums up the Jaydubs preaching work

  Mathew 23: 13 "Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You shut the kingdom of heaven in men's faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will you let those enter who are trying to. 15 "Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when he becomes one, you make him twice as much a son of hell as you are.
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  The Oracle

  Wow...just read this now.

  Fantastic job Mary.

  Thanks for all your hard work on this.

  The Oracle
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  thebigdebate

  I just read this and I told my wife that I want to go to meeting tomorrow. She asked me if I am nuts, I said no. I just want to give a few of these answers.

  The only problem is that I have a beard now (because I have not been to a meeting in about 1 year) and they cant call on me because of my beard.

  I guess that I might just skip it tomorrow and watch football with my kids.

  thebigdebate
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  Robert222

  Thank you Mary, excellent review.

  It does seem like they are trying to justify their daily, weekly, monthly, mandatory preaching work. Nothing in scriptures supports this.

  And with the changing times, all churches seem to adjust to new technology and new ways of reaching people except the JWs. They could care less about you learning about God, but with keeping this cycle going so that the rich, lazy people back at Society headquarters can continue their life of ease amassing great fortunes in real estate.

  And what really is their "good news" and what happened to 1914??
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  HB

  Having never been a JW, I read through this post (as I do other posts) with wide eyes and my mouth (probably rather unattractively) open in amazement and incredulity. I find learning about this religion very interesting but it's hard to comprehend how so many people are duped by the WTS .

  One little word in the Watchtower propaganda struck me:

  Two neatly dressed individuals approach a house and endeavor to share with the householder a brief message from the Bible concerning God's Kingdom. If he shows interest in the message, they may present Bible-based literature and offer a free home Bible study. [My underlining]

  Not sure why they would use the word "free"? Do they regularly promote the lack of cost for a study or was it just slipped in here as an almost subliminal marketing ploy?

  The way I read it was......"just think how generous we are and what an amazing opportunity householders would be turning down if they say no; we could charge people a large sum of money for this Bible study but we are so charitable that as a special privilege, they can have it FREE!. They really are lucky people".
  (Oh sorry just realised they would not use the term 'lucky', not sure if 'fortunate' is ok instead?)

  I sometimes wonder if people would still be interested if they had to pay to study with the WTS? Sometimes putting a price on something makes it seem more desirable.... conversely the perception is that if something is free it can't be much good. Just imagine if the WTS did charge and used tacky commercial advertising in newspapers to promote the religion.....

  "AMAZING OFFER! FREE TRAINING OPPORTUNITY. Do you want to make new friends and learn the secrets of happiness? Do you want to live forever? To find out more call 0800 1234 (lines open 24 hours). Our friendly staff will arrange for one of our highly trained study conductors to call in person at a time to suit you. For this month only, the normal fee of £30.00 for your first session will be waived providing you sign up for a full course of personal study! And what's more, if you call before 31st September you will get a 10% discount off the cost of 6 months worth of trainings. Two incredible offers too good to miss. So what are you waiting for, don't delay call now, your life depends on it!"

  I'm sure it won't happen like that, but actually it would probably be more effective than door to door in attracting gullible people, the sort who are quite happy to send £50 in the post for a silver-plated four leaf clover or crystal talisman that will bring good luck.
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  DanTheMan

  I sometimes wonder if people would still be interested if they had to pay to study with the WTS?

  I think the Scientologists have cornered that market. :)
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  whereami

  I was at the study tonite. I wanted to puke. Great job Mary, Blondie should be proud.
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  Billy the Ex-Bethelite

  Great Job Mary !! That's some great research on the d2d crap.

  I believe para. 1 needs to be corrected as follows:

  Two neatly dressed individualssheep approach a house and endeavor to share with the householdersome goat a brief message from the Bible Watch Tower Corporation concerning God's Kingdom. If heit shows interest in the message, they may present BibleWatch-Tower-Corporation-based literature and offer a free home BiblePaperback Book study.

  The subheading "A Modern-Day Locust Army" seems to apply only to the "anointed"... good for them. As Blondie would point out... that is so Old Testament and no mention of Jesus.

  The subheading "Marking People for Survival" with the interpretation of Ezekiel 9 is very problematic:

  10. The importance of the house-to-house ministry can be seen from a vision given to the prophet Ezekiel. In that vision, Ezekiel sees six men with weapons in their hands as well as a seventh man clothed in linen with a secretary's inkhorn at his side. The seventh man is told to "pass through the midst of the city" and "put a mark on the foreheads of the men that are sighing and groaning over all the detestable things that are being done in the midst of it." Following that marking work, the six men with the slaughtering weapons are commanded to execute all those who do not have the mark.-Read Ezekiel 9: 1-6.
  

  11. We understand that in the fulfillment of this prophecy, the man "clothed in linen" represents the remnant of spirit-anointed Christians. By means of the preaching and disciple-making work, the anointed class puts a symbolic mark on those who become part of Christ's "other sheep." (John 10:16) What is the mark? It is the evidence, as if displayed on their uncovered foreheads, that such sheep are dedicated, baptized disciples of Jesus Christ and that they have put on the Christlike new personality. (Eph. 4:20-24) These sheeplike ones become one flock with anointed Christians and assist them in their vital work of marking still others.-Rev. 22:17.

  12. Ezekiel's vision highlights one reason why our ongoing search for people who are "sighing and groaning" is so urgent. It involves lives. Soon, Jehovah's heavenly executional forces, represented by the six men with weapons, will destroy those who do not have the symbolic mark. Concerning that coming judgment, the apostle Paul wrote that the Lord Jesus, accompanied by "his powerful angels," will bring "vengeance upon those who do not know God and those who do not obey the good news about our Lord Jesus." (2 Thess. 1:7, 8) Notice that people will be judged on the basis of their response to the good news. Hence, the proclamation of God's message must continue unabated right to the end. (Rev. 14:6, 7) This places a heavy responsibility on all of Jehovah's dedicated servants.-Read Ezekiel 3: 17-19.

  The first problem that stands out is "seven men". How could "we understand" that one of those "men" is the "spirit-anointed Christians", but the other six are "Jehovah's heavenly executional forces"?

  (Ezekiel 9:2) 2 And, look! there were six men coming from the direction of the upper gate that faces to the north, each one with his weapon for smashing in his hand; and there was one man in among them clothed with linen, with a secretary’s inkhorn at his hips, and they proceeded to come in and stand beside the copper altar.

  Why would they have all been called "men", when one of them, "one man in among them", represents the bunch of "spirit-anointed Christians" humans, and the other six (evidently indicating divinely, wicked, and satanic incompleteness) "men" are "powerful angels" that Paul refers to. That is inconsistent identification of the key players. I guess the anointed have come down from heaven to Brooklyn surrounded by angels.

  Another problem is location. Funny, the article fails to mention that Ezekiel's marking vision takes place in JERUSALEM !!!!!

  (Ezekiel 9:4) 4 And Jehovah went on to say to him: "Pass through the midst of the city, through the midst of Jerusalem, and you must put a mark on the foreheads of the men that are sighing and groaning over all the detestable things that are being done in the midst of it."

  I checked the Insight under "Jerusalem" and found much about it's representation of Hojovah's government, official city, symbolism of the future Kingdom under... oh, what's his name. Also, there were references to Jerusalem being disapproved because of unfaithful Jewish aprostrates. I didn't see anything hinting that Jerusalem ever represented the entire world of mankind. Am I overlooking anything Conductor Mary? I don't recall any references to the city of Jerusalem being used to represent everyone from Atlanta to Zanzibar. Why would Ezekiel only have said Jerusalem if he meant the entire world of mankind?

  Also, there is no reference in Ezekiel to any door-to-door preaching. It doesn't even mention speaking, just reading hearts of those "sighing and groaning" and putting a mark on their head. I don't believe the "anointed" can read hearts... they know they can't either.

  "What is the mark?... the evidence..."? Well, I'm surprised they didn't just say that "the mark" is sharing in the preaching work every Saturday morning. I guess that would be too obvious. So, they say... "It is the evidence, as if displayed on their uncovered foreheads, that such sheep are dedicated, baptized disciples of Jesus Christ and that they have put on the Christlike new personality." But, how is being dedicated and baptized displayed on their foreheads? Really, how visible is the "baptismal marking" even? Can you walk down the street and spot them because they're still in their "modest" bathing suits and dripping baptismal water? Have they all really put on the "Christlike now personality" after they are dunked? Nope. So, I guess it's an "invisible mark"... you know, just like Jesus "invisible presence since 1914 or whenever".

  And since one who gets baptized is always baptized, does that mean that one once "marked" is always "marked"? No mention of the mark getting erased.

  Okay, one more problem, then I'll move on...

  These sheeplike ones become one flock with anointed Christians and assist them in their vital work of marking still others.

  Funny how Ezekiel had made no mention of "anointed" or "other sheep", but the writers managed to cram that mess in. And now they insist that those who were marked, get up, and start to "assist" the anointed in marking others. Sorry, Ezekiel didn't say that. They ignore the context and instead use a few verses jumbled with some others to produce their typical steaming pile of propaganda.

  Para. 14 quoting Malachi 1:11 struck me as, well...

  ....In the prophecy recorded at Malachi 1:11, Jehovah declares: "From the sun's rising even to its setting my name will be great among the nations, and ... a presentation will be made to my name, even a clean gift; because my name will be great among the nations." In fulfillment of this prophecy, Jehovah's dedicated servants are....

  Sad how Hojovah is such a procrastinator and boaster. Yeah, and one of these Olympics I'm gonna win more gold medal than Phelps. All of this stuff from thousands of years ago that Hojovah keeps saying he's going to do, but never quite gets around to. Not only did their choice of that scripture make God look lazy, the next paragraph makes him look murderous.

  As noted already, there is no connection between the genocide at Jericho and JW door-to-door preaching. The Hebrews didn't preach salvation for the repentant Jehichoans, the Hebrews carried out a holocaust killing and destroying as mandated by their god. (Except for the hooker and her homeys who were spared.) At this point, the Israelites had already entered the promised land and were eating crops and the manna had ceased. Are the JWs today in their promised land? Of course they're not in "the Kingdom" but they have the "spiritual paradise (tm)" right? Um, read on in Joshua and you see how Hojovah got pis$ed and started letting innocent Hebrew soldiers die because Achan had secretly stolen and hidden some stuff... so Hojovah was punishing everyone for not correcting what they couldn't possibly have known anything about. Yeah, that would be a great "spiritual paradise", huh?

  That Hojovah, he can be quite the moody Bronze Age god.

  Of course they put in the disclaimer: "It is possible that there will be a similar expansion of our preaching activity." Sounds like they're hedging their bets on that one. Good luck trying to get 7x more d2d work out of the dubs. Funny, the meetings are getting less urgent now. More speculation concludes that article, with one other oddity. Para. 16 closes referencing...

  (Ezekiel 38:23) 23 And I shall certainly magnify myself and sanctify myself and make myself known before the eyes of many nations; and they will have to know that I am Jehovah.’

  So, after this article about how the sheeples have to get out there and preach door-to-door, they quote Hojovah saying that HE HIMSELF is doing all the heavy lifting. Yeah, right. One of the most disappointing things in all the time I've been a publisher is how there is clearly no divine intervention to help with the preaching, the congregation, or in our own personal lives and problems. You would think that he could at least keep all the little kids quiet during the meeting, but evidently even pacifying children to sit quietly is completely beyond his godly abilities.

  I predict that over half in attendance will have forgotten the subject of this lessen by the second verse of the closing song. I predict that no more than the usual will show up for the meetings for field service after this lesson despite this "motivation" by the FDS.

  Oh yeah, and the "artwork" on page 4, presumably Paul and Timothy, looks totally creepy. Creepy, I tell you.

  Thanks again Mary !

  B the X