Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 4-20-08 WT Study (Presence)

by blondie 35 Replies latest jw friends

  • Justitia Themis
    Justitia Themis

    If your so happy with the new understanding "scholar," shouldn't you be out in service or engaging in other approriate theocratic activities? Why instead are you arrogantly refusing to follow the admonition of those whom you term celebrated Biblical scholars NOT to visit apostate website?

  • blondie

    Hi NewYork44AM

    For example, how can Jesus "come" after he is already present for almost 100 years?

    If jws do think enough to have questions, they soon learn not to ask them.

    Hey bob,

    Then why did the Apostles ask Jesus all those questions if they understood?

    Actually, the WTS teaches that the apostles did not have complete understanding until after the holy spirit was poured at Pentecost 33 CE.

    Also the WTS likes to quit mentioning past "predictions" that did not turn out. That way eventually it will only be in out of print publications. I think they would like to eliminate things in the WT-CD but too many people are still alive that remember. Eventually with attrition and deaths, the people left will not have been jws when that material was believed and discussed. They have done that with the 7,000 year long creation day and 1975.

    Hello, watson

    Is Loesh doing the WT writing now? It just has an arrogant tone that makes me think of him.

    I really don't think that any of the GB are doing any actual writing, most non-anointed "Nethinim" or "Given Ones" who have hung around enough. The WT study articles tend to be more of a group project and cut and paste from past WT articles.

    Well, scholar, I am surprised that you find it necessary to come here and critique Leolaia's comments. As to mine, I think I provided the tools, several Bible translations and access to Greek lexicons so any reader could make their own investigation.

    Just remember, that the real point of identification of a true Christian is love not doctrine. My 50 years involvement with the WTS and the 3 family generations back to 1920, and having lived in several countries and attended several congregations, has given me a good overview of how the WTS has not lived up to this requirement.

    Hey there, HB

    As to dates and times, I believe the WTS was burned bad in 1975 with a subsequent decrease for 3 years. They have officially defused some private projections in 1995 but they have a way of making "soon" seem like tomorrow.

    Thanks, aligot. But I happen to know that they have access to all their past writings in detail and have had computer abilities long before the rank and file did. They have "fact" checkers galore. I think the WTS has a convenient memory loss knowing that most jws would never check their history.

    Hi Jeffro, be assured that the WTS is not alone in its "insight." Fortunately for them they have the convenient manipulation tactic of changing it and saying it is a "clarification" or "adjustment" forgetting to mention how their previous teaching, if countered or disagreed with, would have been grounds for kicking out a member.

    Hey, HS

    The WTS has long held to a dichotonous view of this word, applying it as they see fit when it suits their particular theology and ignoring its usage when it does not.

    Yes, the WTS is very selective and counts on bad jw memories.

    Hello, Bluesbrother

    If Jesus said "This generation" then he was speaking of the people of roughly the same age group ,whatever their beliefs would be. If he had meant to refer to the congregation, he would have said so, and not used the word translated as generation.

    The WTS can always change their just made me wonder where they were getting their "insight" from.


    Most of us just knew that when they offered a complicated explanation, they must be right to be so detailed.

    Yes, the lowly rank and file can't be expected to understand complicated things...which is why for so many years, people were denied access to the Bible by the Catholic Church.

    Hey, R&R,

    Thanks for emphasizing the "finagle words." I found/find it good to check each article carefully for those...places for "adjustment" down the road.

    Hi Justitia,

    Of course, scholar thinks he is impervious to any contamination by being here and can disobey the counsel of the elders with impunity.

    Love, Blondie

  • NewYork44M
    For example, how can Jesus "come" after he is already present for almost 100 years?

    If jws do think enough to have questions, they soon learn not to ask them.

    You are correct, Blondie. However, asking these types of questions has the positive effect of dis-engaging from the wt. Which, is probably the experience of most people here.

    When I decided to objectively look at scriptures to justify what I believed in as a jw, I soon found out there was no justification for much of anything.

  • OnTheWayOut

    Blondie, I don't have the energy to start my own thread on my conversation
    with Mrs. OTWO. Let me just approach you on this and gather your wisdom
    (and that of any others who care to comment).

    I asked my wife: "Didn't you cover a completely different meaning for "this generation"
    at the WT study this weekend?"

    Mrs. OTWO: What have you been reading?

    OTWO: I read your WT magazine about a month ago (true). I though you were
    studying it this weekend. It's what I was talking with [my best friend- JW] awhile
    back (true).

    Mrs. OTWO: How do you mean a 'completely different meaning for "this generation"' ?

    OTWO: In 1995, they changed the generation to no longer mean the people alive in 1914.
    It meant people alive in the last days to see the sign being fulfilled. What do they say it
    means now?

    Mrs. OTWO: (Remembering stuff from the box on page 25) The word "generation" can refer
    to people of different ages whose lives overlap during a specific time period. But the exact
    length of that time cannot be certain.

    OTWO: I read the article. Do you know what they said is the generation? It was the main
    point of the article. You go out and preach to people to examine their religion for themselves
    hoping they will see flaws and want to become JW's. Did you examine what was taught in
    the WT study? Did you even understand it?

    Mrs. OTWO: I will have to look at it again. I am not sure what the answer is.

    OTWO: I will help you some. In 1995, the Governing Body said "this generation" was the
    wicked generation of people all living in the time when they could observe the sign being
    fulfilled. They already had removed the speculations on determining a specific length of that
    time. Now they link the generation to something completely different, but still say that a
    specific length is not determined. The key to examining your own faith and making sure
    you agree with it would be to at least try to understand what that thing they are linking the
    generation to is. (I hated to be so harsh, but she knows what my problem was with the
    1995 change and she shuts down her ability to examine it.)

    Mrs. OTWO: So what is that thing?

    (I feel cornered. I want her to look for herself, but I feel that she won't. Also, even if she
    gets more information on her own or from other dubs, she won't discuss this subject again
    with me. I must go as far as I dare now or never. So I tell her the answer.)

    OTWO: The generation is now the anointed. There will be anointed on earth until the end
    arrives. That is the new doctrine.

    Mrs.OTWO: Well, the light is getting brighter as the day draws near. This is more

    (It isn't going to work. She will not process this. She starts shutting down.)

    OTWO: (Last ditch statement to keep it alive) If the light is getting brighter, what was the
    purpose of the change in 1995, less than 13 years ago?

    Mrs. OTWO: What are you asking?

    OTWO: Why would Jehovah cause a change to the main doctrine, just to totally reverse
    the understanding 13 years later. In 1995, it was the wicked generation, now it's the anointed.
    What purpose does the 1995 light reveal or cause? Why couldn't Jehovah, if that's indeed
    who reveals it, just have revealed an accurate truth like they say they have now. If the light
    gets brighter, then it should add clarity to the previous understanding, not change it.

    Mrs. OTWO: A valid question. I don't know. I don't want to discuss it.

    She fully shuts down and immerses herself in her secular work. So Blondie (and any others),
    can I go further with this at a later time? Have I gone far enough already that I should let it go?

  • blondie

    I can say this, I have seen a trend in dealing with information that requires a big change in your life pattern. When I was involved more in Al-Anon, and 12th stepped (intervened) with an alcoholic relative, I saw this same resistance. I see it in the groups I'm involved with in child abuse; people just don't want to see the facts, especially if they aren't pretty or it means a difficult change or adjustment.

    jws live in lalaland, they turn over their responsibility for knowing what they believe to the elders or other so-called mature people in the WTS. It's not like anyone door to door is going to as them or they will see the question on the written oral review.

    Ignorance is bliss is another appropriate saying.

    Steve Hassan's book talks about this phenomenon of how people shut down when confronted with uncomfortable information. He does give some suggestions how to approach this when the person is more receptive and how to back off for another time when they get uncomfortable.

    I do know that this can take some time and in the end it is that individual's responsibility to do the hard work. It took me 10 years to process the "facts" and make the move away from the WTS.


  • jgnat
    scholar: If you cannot stand the heat then get out of the kitchen.

    To which I would add, "If you don't play nicely in the sandbox, you are gone." Watch your language.

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