by minimus 38 Replies latest jw friends
BTW, when a child behaves in a "bad" way, is he a "bad" person? His behavior is bad so that must make him a bad person, right?
If a druggie decided to rob a bank, yet realized afterwards how much he screwed up his life, is he a bad person because of his behavior? Was he only a bad person when he carried out the robbery? Can you know FOR SURE whether this person is "bad" or not?????
I think the way a person behaves is partly their inherited personality and partly the way they were raised. You have the "A" personality and "B" and maybe variations of those in each group. IMHO, It's got nothing to do with what religion one has embraced. However, the way people act once they have become JWs, enhances their already inherited and programmed behavior.
If a druggie decided to rob a bank, yet realized afterwards how much he screwed up his life, is he a bad person because of his behavior? Was he only a bad person when he carried out the robbery? Can you know FOR SURE whether this person is "bad" or not???
Exactly--there are lots of circumstances in the past which brought this druggie to the point of robbing a bank.
Getting back to JW behavior, I couldn't even call a JW who is in a position of authority bad, except for those who know they are deceptive and full of malice. That is pure evil. The ones who are controlling---who knows? I worked for an acupuncturist once, and she was controlling and she knew it. She would change for a few days, and then go right back to her controlling self. I say she couldn't help herself; there was more to her life than what I saw.
Under,
There are two kinds of people: those that lie and those that don't.
The majority of Witnessess WILL lie as a pledge of loyalty. If they find an error....something they know to be totally false and they bring it to the attention of Elders The Elders will counsel to "not rush ahead" and, then, the person submits and continues to preach a falsehood as the truth. They lie.
That is the reason I say "JWs are liers." The person I am talking to will point out that being in error and believing it true is different than a lier. True. But, as I stated, above, this is NOT the case with the majority of JWs.
They will lie.
The small majority that will not will, in time, will be DFd or DAd. It is predective.
As a Christian, I consider the org of the WT total evil: darkness, slime, vomit: there is not one speck of salt or gleam of light in the entire bucket of slop. This is not hatred or contempt. It is a rational, objective assessment.
That is what makes those exiting so special: they are Seekers of Love, Truth, and Light. They deserve every consideration and encouragement. I love these folks. I love those in the Org, also. However, as agents of the JWs, we are in the perpetual warfare between Light/Dark. I will resist their insanity and aggression till such time as they lay down arms. It is where we are....
It is two fold: a hug with one arm for those exiting. The other arm sword wielding.
Wish it were all different.......
My take,
V
But a JW believes that it isn't really a lie if you're not "entitled" to know.
Thanks Gary for your reply.
You said,
They did it with knowledge, free will, and malice. Anyone who protects the Witnesses by using high control tactics and who advocates against me, my family, or my friends is my enemy. I hold them responsible for their own behaviors and I advocate to their detriment.
If the people who did that leave the Witnesses, they remain my enemy. The fact that they were Witnesses is at most a perihelial consideration.
Let me ask a question...if someone who in the past mis-treated you or your family came up to you today and said, "Gary, I feel I need to apologize to you. I treated you badly because I felt I was doing the right thing as a Witness. I now know better and I'm ashamed at some of the things I said and did back then. I hope you can understand, even if we don't become friends".
The reason I ask this is because, many, if not most of us, on this board are that person. We were Witnesses. We lived the JW lifestyle. We did things that we wished we hadn't. We did things and said things in error. We may have not done it to you, but we may have done similar things to others.
If I was the brother who belly pushed you and your son away from the candy machine at the convention and I came up to you today and said I did that and I was wrong, would I still be your ememy?
where is he?
I'm so glad I can now finally treat others as I would like to be treated, not how I was told to treat them by the WT! I can be nice to whomever I want!
YAY!
Isn't it GREAT to be "allowed" to DO this???
I don't have to worry any more about a neighbor popping in for a chat and feeling obligated to "witness" to her to make sure I don't go overboard in developing a friendship....or I don't have to think twice about helping somebody out if and when I CA, because they are NOT another JW, etc, etc. The list is endless on the wide openings and opportunities that come to mind when interacting with PEOPLE of ALL (or no) religions! Being a JW is SO unnecessarily (and biblically) limiting.
hugs,
Annie
Hi Minimus, you wrote:
"I think your reasoning lacks balance."
Lol, Minimus, my reasoning is your reasoning inverted and sent back to you. What is it about your reasoning that you now see lacks balance? :-) Why are you having a problem with equal application of your own principle?
Hi Undercover, You wrote:
Let me ask a question...if someone who in the past mis-treated you or your family came up to you today and said, "Gary, I feel I need to apologize to you. I treated you badly because I felt I was doing the right thing as a Witness. I now know better and I'm ashamed at some of the things I said and did back then. I hope you can understand, even if we don't become friends".
What's your question?
Then you wrote:
If I was the brother who belly pushed you and your son away from the candy machine at the convention and I came up to you today and said I did that and I was wrong, would I still be your ememy?
If you came up to me and told me you were wrong, that'd be stupid. I already know you were wrong . . . but you won. I quit using the machine at the Witness assembly and I never used another machine at a Witness convention. You can't be my enemy because I don't know you. Dewayne Matz is my enemy because he knew me and he knew what happened and he was responsible for it. The vending machine incident was a pebble in the Witness desert, it's an experience like someone slamming a door.
Well Gary, most everyone else here has my inverted reasoning too. Do ya think maybe it's you?
Check my other thread that you inspired!
