Has money taken over...

by emptywords 42 Replies latest jw experiences

  • neverendingjourney
    neverendingjourney

    The way the accounts are set up during the assemblies is a racket, pure and simple. I remember when our assembly hall was being built they constantly made solicitations for money. They would give you a piece of paper and ask how much you could contribute per week for it in order to make "appropriate calculations." The poor brothers in our hall had to stretch their budges for years in order to pay for it. Many brothers spent just about every Saturday working on the construction of it for a few years until it was completed. After it was built, they thought that it'd be a lot cheaper to have our assemblies now because we didn't have to rent a place. When we started having our assemblies there it was a shock to see that the expenses were still several thousand dollars. We couldn't believe it. Of course, the shipment of cash to the society was all kept a secret.

    What bothers me so much isn't really the fact that they sent money to the society. From everything I've heard, it amounted to four or five dollars per attendee. The problem is the dishonest way they go about doing it. They misrepresent the truth in order to keep an appearance of being different from "worldly" religions that pass around a collection plate. When I discovered what they were doing, I finally realized why they didn’t want us going to a restaurant during lunch. It keeps more money in your pocket that way, money you can fill the contribution boxes with. They even use pretty young girls to lure men to boxes. Assholes!

  • TJ - iAmCleared2Land
    TJ - iAmCleared2Land
    I do remember that every month after they built the new kingdub hall I attended that they spent a million or so dollars for they would get down right harassing about paying the mortgage on it . Where's the money? where's the money ? we need money , we need money

    That's part (a very small part--there is oh, so much more) of why I quit the org... as an elder I got tired of being asked to give those talks. I knew how it was for the friends (tight on $$$).

    Here's the rub: the hall was BUILT with donations you'd already made (to the KH Building Fund). NOW you have to pay it back, with interest. How's that right? You are paying payments and interest on money you already donated!!

  • Metamorphosis
    Metamorphosis

    During that meeting, the convention chairman reads all the donations and expenses, and PROPOSES to the meeting that "we send to the Society a donation in the amount of $xx,000" from the funds donated. Note: the amount proposed is ALWAYS more than what has already been received, putting us "in the red". The vote is put to the elders in the meeting to YAY or NAY the contribution amount. (Let's see a show of hands: how many of you, WHEN YOU WERE A WITNESS, if you'd been an elder, would have stood up and said "HELL NO!"... of course, the motion passes).

    That $$-to-NY-donation amount is rarely itemized to the crowd, so you'll just hear "expenses incurred so far this convention have totalled $yy,000, leaving us with a deficit of $zz,000. We're confident of your continued support and thank you in advance for your heartfelt contributions."

    very very interesting. i was never an elder so wasn't privy to that arrangment as well. so not only did they not count some money already donated in the contributions but listed an expense that wasn't necessarily needed as incurred....tricky tricky.

  • TJ - iAmCleared2Land
    TJ - iAmCleared2Land
    They would give you a piece of paper and ask how much you could contribute per week for it in order to make "appropriate calculations."

    Doing that is SPECIFICALLY directed by the Society. I was the lead on our KH's remodel project. In getting approval for the loan from the Society, the application letter specifically directed us to hand out pieces of paper at the SM, during a local needs part, and ask the friends to write down what they could contribute monthly towards the project, above and beyond what they contribute normally to the WWW, SKBF, and donations for local expenses like utilities. The sum of the numbers given was to be reported as a line item on the loan application form, and the form then took a percentage off the top as a "fudge" factor, realizing that not all would give what they said they would.

  • neverendingjourney
    neverendingjourney

    It's ridiculous, isn't it? I mean, if they had passed around a plate for the brothers to drop those pieces of paper in, well, that would have been antiscriptural. But having a brother go by each row to pick them up is perfectly okay. What a crock!

  • LongHairGal
    LongHairGal

    Has it ever...

    When I came in years ago they bragged how they never passed around collection plates like the "churches". I was a little impressed because they didn't pass around a plate. But, as time went on and the 80s and 90s came they were asking for more and more money from the platform. So, I reasoned this was their way around it. But, the last straw was when they started asking for money for the COs, etc. I said to myself: these people say they don't have a paid clergy? Well, what is this??? Only an idiot can say they are not different from other religions in this regard.

    But, what I cannot ever forgive them for is their stand against education which has cost many a JW a decent livelihood.

    Even if I had no relatives, I would never leave money to them or any other religion. I would give it to a worldly charity. As far as the government taking it, I wouldn't be thrilled but at least the government has some social programs to help the poor. The JWs have none.

    LHG

  • emptywords
    emptywords

    Thanks for all you're replies, really helps me to see that my suspicions and gut feeling were correct. Another example of the hypocricy is the elder that conducts book study, he is also the the Kingdom Hall overseer, looks after the needs of the Hall. We have are just though paying for the Hall (Which was added to the back of the property and another Hall in the front, it was payed for by brothers and sisters giving them money through taking out mortages on their homes, that money we the other publishers had to pay back, they did enphasize that the society loaned interest free, however they wanted to money paid back quicker so we were told that it was around $100 per head per month for 6mths to get the debt cleared off, we have around 175 in the congro. This same elder is a pioneer, single and is forever helping the older sisters, he is always pushing the do more in the field service, yet these two sisters that he is forever giving lifts to and helping have not been out witnessing for thirty years or so, (not putting them down, just showing the double standards) they both have expensive properties, I am very suspicious of this, also he stands at the back of the hall in line with the door where in full view of the contibution boxes and watches as the folk leave, who puts in and who doesn't, honestly I have seen him do this on numerous occations, it is obvious what he is doing, he is a real society man.

  • LongHairGal
    LongHairGal

    To all posters:

    What I meant to say in my previous post is they are no different from any other religion in wanting money. Their hypocrisy is that they claim they don't pass around a plate. For all of you who were on the inside and saw up close what really goes on, I am horrified and disgusted at what I am reading. I always believed everything was "above board". How naive of me.

    Emptywords:

    You are right to be suspicious about them showing interest in elderly persons who have property and assets. Don't think they don't have their eyes on it. The sad part is how so many deluded older people will leave them their assets.

    LHG

  • TJ - iAmCleared2Land
    TJ - iAmCleared2Land
    You are right to be suspicious about them showing interest in elderly persons who have property and assets. Don't think they don't have their eyes on it. The sad part is how so many deluded older people will leave them their assets.

    For what it's worth, I do not recall, in my time as an elder, every seeing ANY direction from the Society to try to visit/encourage elderly ones to donate their money and property to the Society. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but I read through our entire 'letter' binder when I was first appointed, and didn't see anything like that.

    Now, there are the WT articles on planned giving, which regularly remind ones of how they can donate properties, trusts, jewelry, etc. So I'm not saying that they aren't trying to encourage people to do this, but if there are elders out there visiting people and prompting them to do so, I think it's over-zealous elders more then direction from the WTB&TS.

    If any other former elders know this statement to be wrong, I'd like to hear about it... unless the Society is sending letters directly to the PO only, or the SC only, with directions NOT to share it with the rest of the body (which would be despicable), then any "interest shown in the elderly" with the effort to get them to leave it to the Society isn't coming from Brooklyn, it's coming from local elders.

  • Lady Liberty
    Lady Liberty

    Doing that is SPECIFICALLY directed by the Society. I was the lead on our KH's remodel project. In getting approval for the loan from the Society, the application letter specifically directed us to hand out pieces of paper at the SM, during a local needs part, and ask the friends to write down what they could contribute monthly towards the project, above and beyond what they contribute normally to the WWW, SKBF, and donations for local expenses like utilities. The sum of the numbers given was to be reported as a line item on the loan application form, and the form then took a percentage off the top as a "fudge" factor, realizing that not all would give what they said they would.

    Dear TJ,

    This too happened in our hall when they remodeled. Talk about pressure!!!!!! It was a poor congregation, and really the hall was not in bad shape, they just wanted it to be as nice and updated cosmetically as the other halls in the neighboring congregations. Although the ones there had more money. I remember the friends being very stressed over why it was so necessary for a total remodel. It was really the elders that pushed and pushed, till they finally pushed it through.

    Sincerely,

    Lady Liberty

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