After reading many topics.. I'm confused. Is this a JW forum or an ANTI-JW?

by MichaelM 105 Replies latest jw friends

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  AK - Jeff

  Just because a group is hated by some does mean that they are right - you may find that they try to say that any persecution PROVES they are the true religion - which is very poor reasoning.

  I was largely convinced of God's backing based on this premise for years. But the premise is faulty. Look around. I can find people in my block who hate, and would persecute, Muslims, Mexican's, Jews, and the Amish. The grandest 'persecution' in modern day record must be Hitler's decimation of the Jews in the 40's - killing a reported 6 million of these people.

  Jehovah's Witnesses can point to nothing close to that type of persecution in it's history. Admittedly, some don't like Jw's. Some Jw's have been killed by governments, or individuals who hate them. BUT THE IDENTICAL STATEMENT COULD BE MADE BY ALMOST ANY RELIGIOUS, POLITICAL, OR ETHNIC GROUP ON THE PLANET.

  Further, the Jw's bring some of it upon themselves. They go door to door telling people in so many words that they [Jw's] have the 'truth', and that any others [including the householder] who dares not accept such 'truth' is condemned to die forever at the hands of a wrathful God for daring to be part of 'false religion' [any that is not Jw]. Frankly, that bit of evangilism might just piss a few people off, and create a friendly environ for 'persecution'. Additionally - when you go and tell your family that you are going to join Jw's - if your family believes them to be a cult, and opposes such action because they love you, it will be interpreted by your instructor as 'persecution', and 'proof' that the devil is trying to stop you from serving God. Honestly, wouldn't your family do the same should you elect to become a monk, or a Muslim, or an athiest?

  Jeff
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  done4good

  be very careful of the hatred of JWs here and other similar sites... a quick search of posts will reveal this. Also be careful of some JWs tendency to blindly accept teachings. But that doesnt mean it isnt the truth.

  This is known as a red herring argument. The poster here attempts to confuse "hatred of jws", with disagreement with the organization of jws. Ex-jws don't hate jws. If we did, we would not feel obligated to tell both jws and those considering to be jws of the dishonesty and dangers of the organization.

  j
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  LeslieV

  First we are all glad that you are here with us. As has already been stated, if indeed this is the truth you should be able to stand up to any critic, or criticism of your beliefs.

  I also was raised a JW, the only member of my family to have walked away. In doing so I lost all my family and friends, and have raised my three children alone. Is this love? Please really investigate before you make a concrete decision that you want to be a JW.

  Leslie
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  Pubsinger

  Of course if an ex-jw DID hate jws (in reality it would more likely be the WT organisation) that wouldn't mean that everything the ex-jw said was wrong.

  The two things are unconnected. Hate/dislike of WT/JWs and ex-JWs spreading false information about WT.

  It's this sort of flawed reasoning that MichaelM needs to look for.

  And he'll soon see that very little comes from this board.

  We deal mostly in facts.
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  undercover

  Welcome Michael.

  I want to reply to something that you said in your second post:

  Well first he told me to avoid Internet stuff, but we sit back sometimes and view websites together and he usually has answers to every anti-JW topic and whatnot. He has said to just go to the Watchtower but I want a forum I can chat with other JW's.. I'm a social person but its hard to get out sometimes on a tight schedule.

  You have to ask yourself why your study conductor told you to avoid "Internet stuff". You obviously wanted to use the Internet to research some of the thing you're learning but your study conductor told you to "just go to the Watchtower". If the Witnesses have the "truth" then what is there to be afraid of in looking at additional research? Any additional research would not be able to refute anything that they have proclaimed as "truth". But yet the leadership doesn't want members or potential members to look at anything outside of their own information for answers. Ask yourself why.

  You say you're a social person and you would ike to find a forum to associate with other Witnesses. Well, I'm afraid that is going to be hard to do. The friends are "encouraged" or "counseled" to not associate on the Internet. Forums started by JWs have usually ended up being closed after the forum owners were disciplined by elders. Those that have stayed on line have done so at the risk of being ostracized by most other Witnesses who obey the counsel of "avoiding the dangers of the Internet". Again, you have to ask youself, why does the leadership want to limit who you associate with and how. Witnesses will claim that it is for your protection. While one must be careful about who they associate with, whether on-line or in real life, why can't you as an adult be able to make that decision for yourself? Why must a standard that most people would consider as intrusive be instituted?

  To be sure, most Witnesses are good people who want to worship God as best as they know how. You can be recommended for seeing their good qualities, but those good qualities alone does not mean that they have found the one and only true way to worship God.

  Before you committ to this religion, or any religion, you owe it to yourself, and your family as they will be impacted by your decision if you choose to be baptized as a Witness, to research the history of the religion, the current and past teachings, the "rules" that you'll be expected to live by and how all of this will impact your life. If after you do all that and you choose to want to be a Witness, good luck to you. If, however, you see that maybe it's not what you thought it could be or even should be, then do not be afraid to stand up for what you think. Be prepared however for your study conductor, who you may consider a friend right now, to no longer want to be associated with you if you choose to not join their religion.

  Good luck on your spiritual journey.
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  fullofdoubtnow

  Hi Michael, and welcome. Like many other posters, I encourage you to think long and hard before making any commitment to the watchtower.

  be very careful of the hatred of JWs here and other similar sites... a quick search of posts will reveal this.

  Actually, we don't hate jws here. We do hate the teachings a nd the damage following them have done to us and many others. Individual jws are just people following the in our view misguided teachings that many of us once followed

  . Also be careful of some JWs tendency to blindly accept teachings. But that doesnt mean it isnt the truth.

  However, the convenient doctrinal flip flops, which seem to happen when a prophecy is about to fail, indicate that it is a man-made rather than bible-based religion. The hypocrisy surrounding the watchtower's 10-year association with the United Nations, who they claimed to despise throughout that period (1992-2001), and their withdrawal from NGO status within weeks of the link being exposed, indicates that the watchtower leadership is less than truthful with the majority of it's members. Very few jws knew that the watchtower were affiliated to the UN as an NGO until the story appeared in a newspaper. You can read about the watchtower's doctrinal flip flops, UN involvement, and much more, on this link

  http://www.quotes-watchtower.co.uk/home.html

  I think you may find some of the information there very interesting
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  delilah

  Once you committ there is no turning back without severe consequences.

  I'm interested in knowing how your family feels about you studying with the witnesses? If you become a witness, will your family be upset? It will cause division, and hurt feelings, in your family, are you willing to have that happen?

  You've had a lot of good, and wise counsel here, and I really hope you look at both sides, before committing. Once you commit, should you change your mind, you will be shunned. THAT, is not a nice feeling, let me tell you.

  Please do your research, and then decide. You seem like a reasonable young man, with a good head on your shoulders.

  Oh, and WELCOME, Michael M. I wonder if you were "guided" here for a reason?!
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  drew sagan

  MichaelM hasn't made a post since early in page 2 and yet he continues to get more and more advice. Funny to see how these kind of threads take on a mind of their own.
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  undercover

  MichaelM hasn't made a post since early in page 2 and yet he continues to get more and more advice. Funny to see how these kind of threads take on a mind of their own.

  I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm hoping that even though Michael isn't posting that he is lurking and reading.

  He may have realized that this is an "anti-JW" site and is avoiding posting, but I'd be willing to bet that sooner or later, he'll pop back on to read some more, even if he never posts again.

  And if that is the case, Michael, why would you feel the need to avoid posting on a site like this? Why would it be dangerous for you to admit that you came here to get another perspective on the Witnesses? Who are you trying to please? God or the Witnesses?
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  Good Girl or Bad Girl?

  MichaelM: I am a current JW. Former elder (congregation overseer). Former Regular Pioneer (full time minister). Raised as a JW most of my life. The only reason I am still in this religion is because if I leave, pressure will be put on my mom, who is also a JW, to shun me. Close JW friends will be pressured to shun me. Mom wont of course, she is rebellious. My closest friends would still sneak around to be my friend...because if they dont shun me, then THEY get shunned by THEIR JW friends.

  I have to laugh at this comment made my SnakesintheTower. Because he hasn't left yet (which he himself just admitted) he can only speculate that this is what his mom and his friends would do: rebel and sneak around to avoid shunning him. Sorry if this sounds cruel, but wouldn't we all want to believe that our friends love us too much, that our parents will still be in our lives, that we are their children and they wouldn't treat us this way? Right. SnakesintheTower, walk away from the WT and stop lying to your friends and family. AND THEN tell me what they did. THE WATCHTOWER ALWAYS WINS. Unless your mom leaves the religion too, she will shun you. Mark my words.

  I guess I'm feeling a little bitter today. If MichaelM wants to believe one publication from the Jehovah's Witnesses over the who-knows-how-many posters here who used to be JW's and for some "trivial" reason walked away from everything they knew, then I guess that's his choice. I so hope he doesn't take the plunge, because after baptism the JW's will own his soul (and according to their teaching, soul equals your life, MichaelM). If he is converting, then most likey his family is not JW's. Meaning after he realizes it's all a bunch of lies and BS all wrapped up in a pretty little package designed to make the WatchTower Real Estate and Publishing Company richer and richer at the expense of its stupid vulnerable followers, then he will still have his friends and family to go back to, if they forgive him for abandoning them to become a Jehovah Witness in the first place.

  Yeah, I typed Jehovah Witness on purpose. It used to piss the hell out of me when people would say that instead of Jehovah's Witness.

  I guess I gotta get off the f*cking internet now. I just sound angry and bitter. Well, I am. Dappling in the JW faith is just about the worst thing you can do. They will take everything they can from you, MichaelM. EVERYTHING.