by KW13 44 Replies latest jw friends
Its got to be hard seeing someone you love trapped in a cult and thinking its the TRUTH. I'm hoping, because she refuses to disown you and doesn't give you too hard a time about not being a dumb dub or doing dub things while under her roof, that there is hope for her.
(((((Karl)))))
thank you luna
KW13,
I think its always good to inform them about their religion by exposing them to similarities and what you would like them to know of the WatchTower through other cults.
For example, you want similar?
WWCOG before it reformed, Herbert W. Armstrong, published Plain Truth Magazine, said it was the gospel as hasn't been preached since a siege on Jerusalem in 69 A.D. (first century Christianity restored!) didn't celebrate Christmas or Easter, look up his false prophecies, maybe you can open a dialogue of what would biblically constitute a false prophet and then if she were to identify his prophecies as false, how then could she deny the WT?
look up William Branham, good source of false prophecies
The Way international, first century Christianity restored, Victor Paul Wierwille was a total perv granted, but had a structure very similar to WT.
Mormons-First century christianity restored, Joseph Smith false prophet, unity and preaching proves we are the "truth" which they will refer to themselves as.
Also show her the thought processes maybe through use of ex-cult members of different adherence than the WT.
Sun Myung Moon, he's better'n Jesus! Gospel lost then found. The Unification church.
Even Moses David of "The Family" said similar things to the WT.
if you can show her the structure, how they entrap people, how they are entirely exclusive, ask her how these members are supposed to figure out they are being misled when they are not supposed to read any non "kosher" information not approved through their channel. Ask her what this accomplishes for those who are doing the misleading.
They all make claims of being prophets/restored christianity/god's channel. Examine how you would test something like that.
If they make false prophecies, would God truly be using them?
I hope this helps you or gives you an idea of some groups to perhaps research if you think this is a good option :)
cheers for that, interesting stuff.
tread very carefully
Hi KW,
I have a problem with my Mom also. She is DF but thinking about going back. My thoughts were to get out and stay out, but she found all that stuff people wrote to me, and she said "Annie, you need to decide which is the lesser of the Two Evils, baby, the evil who left or the evil who stayed. LOL
She said when people condem and make fun of Jehovah, comdem and make fun of prayer, condem and make fun of your faith.. it only proves that the Bible is true when it says, "you will be persecuted for my names sake."
I said Mom! Words don't really hurt you.... welll, I mean, they hurt your feelings, but sticks and stones can break your bones. And besides, it hurt me when they said we were stupid for riding horses, it hurt when noone would invite us to get togethers because my Dad didn't go to the hall, it hurt me when I saw a wittness woman kissing and hugging a married worldly man in a laundrymat and I told an elder about it and they all had their children quit associating with me, but that woman kept going in service as tho nothing ever happened. It hurt me when I and my sis got blamed for the boys getting drunk around the pool when all we were doing was sitting in chairs on the other side of the pool. It hurt me when I started missing meetings and service but no one ever ask why, or said you need to come back. Gosh.. I'm venting.. soowy bout that. What I was about to say was... Don't let your mom read this board. You just scan thru and print out the things the real nice people on here say. Cause the hateful ones will just make her more intense on staying in the organization. Believe me I know!!
luvs ya, Annie
Blondie made an excellent point about planting and waiting. Real life is not a sitcom, where everything is resolved in a single thirty minute episode. People take a long time to own up to their own flawed view of the universe.
I think you need a plan that spans several years.
I think you don't need more information, you need ideas for presentation. It's not WHAT you know, but WHEN and HOW you share it. Get Steve Hassan's books for ideas there. www.freedomofmind.com
Also, learn to recognize when your mom is most herself. Her demeanor and way of talking, even, will be completely different. Pick THOSE times to question the sociey. Not when she is in full JW-mode.
Annie, thanks for your post - you've given me more to consider and think about
Also jgnat, your right - i should plan this more carefully and do this right and i will do just that!
Dear KW13,
Hang in there!! Please try not to get discouraged. It took me two years before I would listen to anything my own parents were trying to show me. When her hearts ready, she will come around. She may just need time to absorb all that you have alread given her. Don't give up.
Sincerely,
Lady Liberty
KW13: I know it is hard to have someone you love trapped in that org prison. My mom is also there.
For years I tried to bring up topics to get her to think, be non-defensive but ask questions, everyting. Eventually I realized that the best thing I could do for the both of us is just love her for who she is. It's hard KW - but your mom will make her own way in life. To do the best for the both of you is to just love her, as she is, and accept her for who she is - and just be there.
Karl,
A couple of points
Your mum has had a turbulent life full of ups and downs, the one place she has found stability (and probably a degree of happiness) in her life is in the truth. For her the "Truth" and her way in life is something that represents stability and order as opposed to the chaos that was her life before she found the truth.
Most people that turn to become dubs do so because they are deeply unhappy in their normal day to day lives and what you are effectively doing by asking her to leave is to return to the chaotic world that she once left behind. A lot of people just can't do that.
Leaving the truth means that she would probably piss off her husband and may even loose him. Is she willing to do that? You and I both know he's a d*ck but she obviously feels something for him.
As for trying to turn a dub I think you are going about it the wrong way. Most here will agree that while dubs if we had cold hard anti org facts thrown at us we would shut up our ears and ignore them. We wouldn't listen. Your mum is in dub mode, shes not going to pay attention to anything you have to say about the org because she thinks you are under the influence of Satan.
The only way you can reach people like her is on an emotional level, you cant reason with people like her. She simply has too much to loose, you'll be leaving home in a few years and if you had your way you may well destroy her marriage and then where would she be, single and living on her own again.
My advice would be to leave her to her own life. Let her find out the truth in her own time rather than ramming it down her throat and remember, its a cliche but, you can take a horse to water but you cant make it drink.
