Please don't take offence at this ...

by Joe Grundy 74 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  BizzyBee

  This topic - education/intelligence as it relates to JWs - gives rise to further questions, such as:

  "What prevents most JWs from applying critical thinking to the decision to dedicate his or her life to the WTS?" With a reasoned examination of issues, a fairly bright 12-year old could unravel the illogic and twisted, manipulative dogma that the WTS presents.

  From what I've read and seen, JW's as a group are less educated than any cross-section of a population. And of course, since they discourage higher education, how could it be otherwise?
• 

  aniron

  I was a JW for nearly 30 years. In that time I met, JW's who were millionaires doctors, nurses, lawyers, directors of companies, and people in highly responsible jobs etc.

  Just because you have been to college or got a degree it doesn't make you immune to the teachings of the WT. I remember a JW who was a lawyer saying the reason he was a JW was because he didn't have to think about the doctrine, the WT said it was right, so if they got it wrong it was their fault not his.

  Also what crossed my mind is that we go on about JW being a less educated group and therefore are taken in by WT teaching. Yet what about the Mormons, who put great emphasise on education, even have their own universities. Then why are so many still Mormons, considering that their teachings are just as flawed as JW teachings.
• 

  under_believer

  I don't understand most of the posts in this thread. Perhaps in the past it was different, but for the current time, here is what logic tells me:
  * A majority of current JW's were raised as JW's.
  * The Society heavily discourages a higher education, and most Witnesses don't get one.
  * Therefore, most Witnesses must not have a higher education.
  I mean, neither of those points seem controversial, and the conclusion is just simple deductive reasoning. Now, here is what my experience tells me: The only Witnesses I knew with college educations got them before they were Witnesses. There were precious few of those and they usually kept it quiet. I probably only ever remember two or three Witnesses mentioning a college education in my 26 year association with the Witnesses.
• 

  itsallgoodnow

  people join cults all the time for lots of reasons, even when they should have the brains to figure it out before.

  I figure it's a lot like being in a situation where for some reason you fall in love with the wrong type of guy. He seems too good to be true, or too good for you, but he makes you think it's for real and gives you something you need. Your family hates him, but that doesn't stop you. He doesn't like your friends so they are not your friends for very long. Pretty soon, you start to think he might be cheating on you and then when you get the nerve to confront him ( by this time, he has stripped you of your self confidence almost completely ) he gets abusive. Then you are supposed to be afraid to leave.

  It's the same damn thing. Very intelligent people can get caught up in this sort of thing once they are emotionally involved for some reason. If they are looking for something to fill a void maybe? Either way, the way they love bomb an interested person, or the unrealistic promises which they insist will come true, these might be carrots to an otherwise skeptical person. Just don't let this fairytale end, don't look at his cell phone calls, don't look at apostate literature, and the fairytale will continue.
• 

  BizzyBee

  Agreeing with underbeleiver.

  Furthermore - how could one not apply critical thinking especially to the tenets of a "religion" that is so extremely demanding? This isn't like going to church once a month - I could see going along just for the ride (and often do). But JWs require so much!
• 

  sass_my_frass

  In my years on the preach I consistently avoided conversations with people who clearly had advanced ciritical thinking abilities. I didn't even know what that meant at the time, because (and this is among my major beefs with the cult) I was pretty good in school, but was basically prohibited from attending university. 'Deep knowledge' is considered the ability to discuss the more tedious contents of the prophecy books they print. They discourage critical analysis of anything at all.
• 

  breeze

  This is a very interesting thought. Most JW's have been taught to avoid the higher education route, and stay focused on the "truth" and the preaching work. In recnet years the WTBTS has changed their position somewhat and does allow college, since may witnesses couldn't even get work oin some ares of the country/world without some degree.

  There is Dr Riggles, in Houston I believe. He was the open heart surgeon that did bloodless work in the beginning. There has a couple of Dentists that I have met over the years.

  But don't confuse education with intelligence....it is same as assuming a rich man is smart. Money and intelligence has no connection for the most part.

  "NO ABSOLUTES"

  BREEZE
• 

  Joe Grundy

  
  This is not an attempt to btt.

  
  It would just seem rude not to thank everyone for the information provided. I have learned from it.

  
  So, thanks!

  (Besides which, if I'm polite now I won't feel so bad about asking all my other questions!)
• 

  Scully

  I have had the pleasure to meet Jim Penton. He was raised in the JWs (3rd generation, if I remember correctly) and was able to achieve an education to the level of PhD in religious studies while still a JW.

  He even wrote a book that praised the JWs "championing" of civil liberties in Canada. He claimed to be an "anointed" JW, meaning that he believed that he would be one of the 144,000 who would rule in heaven with Jesus during his 1000 year reign over the earthly paradise inhabited by JWs.

  He was disfellowshipped in the late 70s/early 80s for coming to the conclusion (from his own Biblical research) that JWs are not required to go door-to-door. Apparently his being Anointed™ by holy spirit still wasn't an adequate credential which would allow the scriptures to speak to him directly, instead of requiring the interpretation of the Faithful and Discreet Slave™. My guess is that he felt that his perception as being Anointed™, coupled with his advanced education in religious studies, made him feel that he had every right to examine the Bible the way he did, just as much right as those Brothers™ who comprise the Faithful and Discreet Slave Class™.

  Since then he has written Apocalypse Delayed (first edition circa 1980) which is a critique of the WTS and its doctrines and practices, making him Canada's first Apostate™ of renown.
• 

  cognizant dissident

  Kudra: I personally knew 2 medical doctors who were JW's, , 1 hospital administrator, 2 teachers, and at least 4 successful millionare businessmen.

  As far as I know the story, the doctor's and hospital administrator were educated before they became witnesses. Two of them for sure were converted by the women they love and married. Not sure about the teachers.