by jwfacts 28 Replies latest watchtower bible
and finally they said that I needed to have a Bible study with a mature member of the congregation, because "it was obvious that I had missed something in my years as a jw"
I would have said...Well if you can't answer my question, then I guess you better have a study with a 'mature' xtian as well!
I did say something to that effect, Legolas. I pointed out that in the 3 hours that we had been talking, they had failed to answer a single question that I asked, or address any of the issues I had raised. One of them stood up and pointed a finger at me and said "You're really proud of all the research you've done, aren't you?" I stood up too...and said calmly, "No....actually, it's been the most humiliating experience of my life."
It amazes me that they took no action against me because I really made them look like idiots. I faded without a single phone call or visit from them. It was almost a year later that someone reported my son attending a birthday party...and the fact that I had given my x a copy of Crisis of Conscience, that it was brought to a head, and I DAed. During that time..still officially in good standing, I manned the 800-why-1914 help-line.
Coffee
We should always look to God's appointed channel for reliable information, not to a network of Internet users
Internet users are able to instantly send information around the world, reliably and with total accuracy. No one from The Tower has yet explained why Jehovah cannot achieve the same results when sending information to the Governing Body.
Perhaps that is why he hates the internet so much!
The Watchtower speaks out of both sides of its mouth on this issue. They're all but inspired when they're making pronouncements, but just uninspired men trying to do their best when their pronouncements are proved false. Most JWs, in practice, believe that the WTS is inspired and that it claims this.
For a detailed look at the Society's claims, see the article
http://www.geocities.com/osarsif/pro4.htm
AlanF
Great website Alan thankyou
I can't pinpoint the date and don't have the old wt issues to tell you when, but during the 60's and 70's, if not later, on the 2nd page of the WT under the "PURPOSE OF THE WATCHTOWER", for years and years they stated, "The Watchtower is NO inspired prophet."
At some point in time they removed that expression, when, I don't know exactly, but a person could interpret the change that they now think they are inspired. Pretty thin though.
The important view of this question is that they ACT like they think they are inspired.
Bunch of haughty arrogant jerks.
uninformed
Read carefully what they say here:
*** re chap. 2 p. 9 The Grand Theme of the Bible ***
Interpreting
the Scriptures The mysteries locked up in the book of Revelation have for long baffled sincere students of the Bible. In God’s due time, those secrets had to be unlocked, but how, when, and to whom? Only God’s spirit could make known the meaning as the appointed time drew near. (Revelation 1:3) Those sacred secrets would be revealed to God’s zealous slaves on earth so that they would be strengthened to make known his judgments. (Compare Matthew 13:10, 11.) It is not claimed that the explanations in this publication are infallible. Like Joseph of old, we say: "Do not interpretations belong to God?" (Genesis 40:8) At the same time, however, we firmly believe that the explanations set forth herein harmonize with the Bible in its entirety, showing how remarkably divine prophecy has been fulfilled in the world events of our catastrophic times.*** re chap. 3 p. 15 Things That Must Shortly Take Place ***
God had a channel for communicating Revelation in John’s day, and John was the earthly part of that channel. Likewise, God has a channel for giving spiritual nourishment to his ‘slaves’ today. In his great prophecy concerning the conclusion of the system of things, Jesus identified the earthly part of this channel as "the faithful and discreet slave whom his master appointed over his domestics, to give them their food at the proper time." (Matthew 24:3, 45-47) He uses this John class in unlocking the meaning of the prophecy....Those of the John class, some of whom have shared for upwards of 70 years in the fulfillment of these visions, are happy that God’s spirit has unlocked the meaning so that they can explain it to others.
They eschew the "inspired" word, but they make the bold claim that (1) God's spirit has made the meaning of Revelation known to them, (2) God has unlocked the meaning for them so they can explain it to others, (3) They represent today the same divine channel that gave John his "inspired" prophecy, (4) God uses them to communicate the true meaning of his prophecy and thus to "nourish" true Christians, (5) Like the patriarch Joseph, they claim that their interpretations "belong to God", i.e. that God is the one that has given them their interpretations (read Genesis 40:8, Joseph is claiming that he is able to interpret the dreams because he receives his interpretations from God).
SO HOW ARE THEY NOT CLAIMING TO BE INSPIRED? They deny the specific word "inspired," but they EXACTLY claim inspiration when they describe what they do.
This spiritual food is available only through the theocratic organization. We should always look to God's appointed channel for reliable information, not to a network of Internet users.
Those internet users know more about the inner workings of the evil WT empire than most Branch Overseers.
(Deutrernomy 18:20-22)
20 “‘However, the prophet who presumes to speak in my name a word that I have not commanded him to speak or who speaks in the name of other gods, that prophet must die. 21 And in case you should say in your heart: “How shall we know the word that Jehovah has not spoken?” 22 when the prophet ( nabiy') speaks in the name of Jehovah and the word does not occur or come true, that is the word that Jehovah did not speak. With presumptuousness the prophet spoke it. You must not get frightened at him.’
Prophet--( nabiy')
1) spokesman, speaker, prophet
a) prophet
b) false prophet
c) heathen prophet
(Matthew 24:23,24)
23 “Then if anyone says to YOU, ‘Look! Here is the Christ,’ or, ‘There!’ do not believe it. 24 For false Christs and false prophets will arise and will give great signs and wonders so as to mislead, if possible, even the chosen ones.
(Reasoning from the Scriptures pp136)
Have not Jehovah’s Witnesses made errors in their teachings?
Jehovah’s Witnesses do not claim to be inspired prophets. They have made mistakes. Like the apostles of Jesus Christ, they have at times had some wrong expectations.—Luke 19:11; Acts 1:6.
(Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary)
Inspired
: outstanding or brilliant in a way or to a degree suggestive of divine inspiration <gave an inspired performance>
Inspiration
1 a : a divine influence or action on a person believed to qualify him or her to receive and communicate sacred revelation b : the action or power of moving the intellect or emotions c : the act of influencing or suggesting opinions
(Awake 93 3/22 Why So Many False Alarms?)
Jehovah’s Witnesses, in their eagerness for Jesus’ second coming, have suggested dates that turned out to be incorrect. Because of this, some have called them false prophets. Never in these instances, however, did they presume to originate predictions ‘in the name of Jehovah.’ Never did they say, ‘These are the words of Jehovah.’ The Watchtower, the official journal of Jehovah’s Witnesses, has said: “We have not the gift of prophecy.”
(Jeremiah 1:9 NWT)
9 At that Jehovah thrust his hand out and caused it to touch my mouth. Then Jehovah said to me: “Here I have put my words in your mouth.
(W79 9/1 The Royal “Shepherd” of Bible Prophecy p29-30 par.28)
28 Unlike the clergy class, those of the Jeremiah class have been sent by Jehovah to speak in his name. Nevertheless, the clergy prophets also claim to speak in his name and, hence, to tell the Bible truth. In this way Christendom’s religious leaders really ‘steal’ away the force and effect of the calamitous message proclaimed by the Jeremiah class. True, the Jeremiah class back up their message by quoting the words, “This is what Jehovah has said.” But the clergy try to add weight and the ring of truth to what they preach by affixing the words, “An utterance!” Seemingly they speak from God. So they may use a Bible text as a pretext for preaching about politics or even war propaganda. Yet Jehovah is against such clergy prophets whom he did not send forth from his intimate group and who ‘steal’ words from his Bible in order to make a wrong application of them.—Jer. 23:30, 31.
(w59 1/15 Down with the Old—Up with the New! P41)
. Jehovah’s witnesses are deeply grateful today that the plain facts show that God has been pleased to use them. All the preaching and all the Bible educational work that they have done till now in 175 countries and islands of the sea they confess has been, not by help of a military army, nor by human power, but by God’s spirit, his invisible active force. (Zech. 4:6, AV) It has been because Jehovah thrust out his hand of power and touched their lips and put his words in their mouths. It has evidently been because he commissioned them to be over the nations and over the kingdoms
(w57 6/15 Overseers of Jehovah’s People p370 par7)
7a Let us now unmistakably identify Jehovah’s channel of communication for our day, that we may continue in his favor.
7b It is vital that we appreciate this fact and respond to the directions of the “slave” as we would to the voice of God, because it is His provision.
(W94 3/1 Jehovah’s Judgment Against False Teachers p11 par.13,14)
13 Please note Jeremiah chapter 23, verse 22: “If they had stood in my intimate group, then they would have made my people hear my own words, and they would have caused them to turn back from their bad way and from the badness of their dealings.” If Christendom’s religious prophets were standing in Jehovah’s intimate group, in close relationship with him as though a faithful and discreet servant, then they too would be living by God’s standards. They too would have been making the peoples of Christendom hear God’s own words. Instead, the modern-day false teachers have made their followers blinded servants of God’s Adversary, Satan the Devil.
14 Exposure of the clergy by the Jeremiah class has been powerful.
(W86 4/15 What Jehovah’s Times and Seasons Mean for Our Day p18 par.11)
11 So God’s servants know what this world’s rulers do not. They know Jehovah’s purposes and his seasons. First Peter 1:11 says that, in the past, God’s servants “kept on investigating what particular season or what sort of season the spirit in them was indicating.” With God’s spirit indicating this, the apostle Paul could say to true fellow worshipers: “You people know the season.” (Romans 13:11) Since Jehovah’s servants of today obey him as ruler, God’s holy spirit also reveals to them what season it is from his viewpoint. Amos 3:7 says: “The Sovereign Lord Jehovah will not do a thing unless he has revealed his confidential matter to his servants the prophets.”
(Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary)
Reveal
1
: to make known through divine inspiration
2 : to make (something secret or hidden) publicly or generally known <reveal a secret>
(W80 10/15 Execution of the “Great Harlot” Nears p17 par.1,2)
THE Creator, Jehovah God, knows exactly what will take place in the future. He is “the One telling from the beginning the finale.” (Isa. 46:10) Being “perfect in knowledge,” he knows the details about the “finale” of this system of things at the coming “great tribulation.” (Job 37:16; Matt. 24:21) Because he is a God of love, he reveals enough of these details to those who serve him loyally that they can be properly informed, upbuilt and protected. The Bible states: “The Sovereign Lord Jehovah will not do a thing unless he has revealed his confidential matter to his servants the prophets.”—Amos 3:7.
2 Thus, God gives his humble servants special knowledge that others do not have. As the apostle Paul said: “This wisdom not one of the rulers of this system of things came to know . . . For it is to us God has revealed them through his spirit.” (1 Cor. 2:8-10) Having advance knowledge from Jehovah, his servants are equipped—indeed, commissioned, by God—to herald throughout the world the warning of this system’s approaching end, along with the comforting message of the new order.—Matt. 24:14.
(W72 3/15 Wanted—a Messenger p189)
Therefore, when it came time for the name of Jehovah and his purposes to be declared to the people, along with God’s warning that Christendom is in her “time of the end,” who qualified to be commissioned? Who was willing to undertake this monumental task as Jehovah’s “servant”? Was there anyone to whom Jehovah’s heavenly “chariot” could roll up and whom it could confront? More accurately, was there any group on whom Jehovah would be willing to bestow the commission to speak as a “prophet” in His name, as was done toward Ezekiel back there in 613 B.C.E.?
(W72 4/1 ‘They Shall Know that a Prophet Was Among Them’)
(P197) A third way of coming to know Jehovah God is through his representatives. In ancient times he sent prophets as his special messengers. While these men foretold things to come, they also served the people by telling them of God’s will for them at that time, often also warning them of dangers and calamities. People today can view the creative works. They have at hand the Bible, but it is little read or understood. So, does Jehovah have a prophet to help them, to warn them of dangers and to declare things to come?
IDENTIFYING THE “PROPHET”
These questions can be answered in the affirmative. Who is this prophet? The clergy of the so-called “Christian” nations hold themselves before the people as being the ones commissioned to speak for God. But, as pointed out in the previous issue of this magazine, they have failed God and failed as proclaimers of his kingdom by approving a man-made political organization, the League of Nations (now the United Nations), as “the political expression of the
However, Jehovah did not let the people of Christendom, as led by the clergy, go without being warned that the League was a counterfeit substitute for the real . He had a “prophet” to warn them. This “prophet” was not one man, but was a body of men and women. It was the small group of footstep followers of Jesus Christ, known at that time as International Bible Students. Today they are known as Jehovah’s Christian witnesses. They are still proclaiming a warning, and have been joined and assisted in their commissioned work by hundreds of thousands of persons who have listened to their message with belief.
(p198-199) Thus this group of anointed followers of Jesus Christ, doing a work in Christendom paralleling Ezekiel’s work among the Jews, were manifestly the modern-day Ezekiel, the “prophet” commissioned by Jehovah to declare the good news of God’s Messianic kingdom and to give warning to Christendom.
(p200) The scroll was doubtless delivered to Ezekiel by the hand of one of the cherubs in the vision. This would indicate that Jehovah’s witnesses today make their declaration of the good news of the Kingdom under angelic direction and support. (Rev. 14:6, 7; Matt. 25:31, 32) And since no word or work of Jehovah can fail, for he is God Almighty, the nations will see the fulfillment of what these witnesses say as directed from heaven.
(Daniel’s Prophecy chap 17 p292 par 11)
THEY ‘SHINE LIKE THE STARS’
11 The next two verses of Daniel chapter 12 do even more to help us identify “the holy ones of the Supreme One.” In verse 3 the angel tells Daniel: “The ones having insight will shine like the brightness of the expanse; and those who are bringing the many to righteousness, like the stars to time indefinite, even forever.” Who are “the ones having insight” today? Again, the evidence points to the same “holy ones of the Supreme One.” After all, who but the faithful anointed remnant had the insight to discern that Michael, the Great Prince, began standing as King in 1914? By preaching such truths as this—as well as by maintaining Christian conduct—they have been “shining as illuminators” in this spiritually bedarkened world. (Philippians 2:15; John 8:12) Concerning them, Jesus prophesied: “At that time the righteous ones will shine as brightly as the sun in the kingdom of their Father.”—Matthew 13:43.
Some great answers. So many terms they use that mean inspired, like 'God's channel of communication' that I can believe they did not slip up just once and actually say what they mean, 'we are inspired'.
Did they ever say 'inspired' in old mags? Rutherford was arrogant enough to have said as much in the early 1920's.
Great experience coffee. Similiar to my jc. They can't answer the questions, then try to make it imply that there is something wrong with me for asking intelligent questions.
