birthdays

by cr1234 55 Replies latest watchtower bible

• 

  AlmostAtheist

  More than anything else, they are another way the Watchtower tries to make itself "differant" from everybody else, helping "prove" they are the only ones serving God.

  Yes, and of course it also has the effect of keeping you segregated from those that might lead you "astray". Birthdays and holidays are the times that families typically come together. But denying JW's those opportunities, they keep you from getting too close to your non-JW family.

  It's almost too sinister for me to believe as a true motive for the doctrine, but when you look at what they DO forbid (birthdays, holidays) and what they DON'T forbid (makeup, embalming, windchimes) all with the same "pagan origins", it makes you wonder...

  Dave
• 

  lonelysheep

  It's amazing how they (WTS) instill so much fear in jw's by using their interpretation of the bible to create a belief/doctrine/ "Christ-like" avoidance rather than the bible itself.

  Birthdays are just one example.
• 

  JH

  My birthday is in 5 weeks

  For those who want to send me a gift, pm me.
• 

  funkyderek

  "Awake!" responds: Christians refrain from any celebrations or customs that continue to involve false religious beliefs or activities that violate Bible principles. For example, the Bible definitely puts birthday celebrations in a bad light. (Genesis 40:20; Matthew 14:6-10) However, if it is very obvious that a custom has no current false religious significance and involves no violation of Bible principles, each Christian must make a personal decision as to whether he will follow such a custom.

  This statement, as a reply to clear up an apparent ambiguity, is itself so ambiguous that it can only be deliberate. On the one hand, they remind the reader that birthdays are put "in a bad light" in the Bible, but follow that with a "however". Celebrating birthdays is clearly a custom, and it "has no current false religious significance". Does it involve a "violation of Bible principles"? Awake! doesn't say. It just doesn't answer the question, although most faithful JWs will be unlikely to notice that.
• 

  Woodsman

  Funny Derek,

  I think you are right on. The "However" applies to the sentence previous that birthdays are in a bad light in the Bible. The portion of the next sentence in commas is the rule for deciding if one could use their conscience.

  For example, the Bible definitely puts birthday celebrations in a bad light. However, if it is very obvious that a custom has no current false religious significance and involves no violation of Bible principles, each Christian must make a personal decision as to whether he will follow such a custom.

  So if it were obvious that "Birthdays" have no CURRENT false religious significance and violate no Biblical principles, which they don't, then one could make a personal decision.

  That is allowed by the grammar of the sentences. If the WTS really cared why would they use a phrase like "bad light"? What kind of a phrase is that? What the heck do they mean? That could mean anything. Shouldn't a religious organization who claims to be responsible teach to all mankind about God's requirements try a little harder to articulate what they mean? I agree with you that they ambiguity must be deliberate or else they are really losing their academic abilities.

  They should clarify whether or not "bad light" is equal to " false religious significance and violation of Bible principles". Since they do not it would be wrong to assume that is what they mean.

  The two sentences clearly go together as an "example" using birthdays as the subject. So when the second sentence uses custom one could understand that to mean birthdays.

  It could have been written better.
• 

  undercover

  It's a hypocritical answer to a hypocritical situation.

  They've always condemned birthdays so as to keep the flock isolated. Along comes the hispanic population, the only real growth in WT land. Much like the Catholics of yesteryear, the WTS gives approval to a long standing custom of the hispanic population that they hope to gain new recruits from. (even though, as a child I remember pinatas being among the things not allowed).

  Some people see the obvious contradiction...birthdays from pagan origins = bad pinatas from pagan origins = okay. When the WTS is called on it, they give a two-sided answer that doesn't answer the question at all, but reminds followers that birthdays are bad. Cult mind control at its most obvious, except to the cult follower, that is.
• 

  Schizm

  More than anything else, they are another way the Watchtower tries to make itself "differant" from everybody else, helping "prove" they are the only ones serving God.--drew sagan.

  You hit on the "real" reason why true Christians don't celebrate birthdays, and it is proper that they not do so. Celebrating one's birthday, or that of another person's, is a practice of the "world". Christians are not to get "cozy" with people of the "world". Indeed, they are to be "no part" of the "world". "Friendship with the world is enmity with God," the scripture says.

  .
• 

  lonelysheep

  Christians are not to get "cozy" with people of the "world". Indeed, they are to be "no part" of the "world". "Friendship with the world is enmity with God," the scripture says.

  Not a jab at you; this is something that had never set right w/me:

  So why not live like the Amish have been known to, and remain in seclusion? I have more respect for them then I do other groups who throw up those verses when they see fit.
• 

  AlmostAtheist

  >>Celebrating one's birthday, or that of another person's, is a practice of the "world".

  Schism! How could you be a member here for so long and still spout such garbage? You know as well as any of us that this is totally arbitrary. Birthdays = bad. Pinata = good. Embalming = good. Clinking Glasses in a Toast = bad.

  There's no "separateness from the world" involved here. It's simple, arbitrary, Pharisaical rule-making.

  I'm not just pontificating, I'm saying what I see and why. Can you honestly defend the Watchtower's position in a way that disproves my accusation of arbitrariness? (Is "arbitrariness" a word?)

  Dave
• 

  Schizm

  Christians are not to get "cozy" with people of the "world". Indeed, they are to be "no part" of the "world". "Friendship with the world is enmity with God," the scripture says.

  Not a jab at you; this is something that had never set right w/me:

  So why not live like the Amish have been known to, and remain in seclusion? I have more respect for them then I do other groups who throw up those verses when they see fit.

  To be a Christian requires that the person not be a hermit. Christians are told to "go" spread their faith. In order to do that they MUST be around worldly peoples (while at the same time not picking up the worldly practices of those people, of course).

  .