If you think the JW's are correct on Blood don't read

by skyman 30 Replies latest watchtower medical

  • skyman

    IF anyone can disprove my conclussions please send me a letter in my inbox, or if you can think of other points please drop me a line. Feel free to copy and use part or all of this letter. I started my biblical sereach after I was asked by a brother in my Book Study group why we could use fraction that was taken from coagulated blood, but can not AUTO-TRANSFUSE {store our own blood for later use} becasue the blood coagulates and then must be poured out onto the ground. HERE IT IS it is long but very black and white that the bible does not agree with the Society's stand on blood.

    I would like to make it clear to anyone that might read this I need to know what Jehovah requires of us on blood. In no way am I stating that I’m correct. But I’m putting into words how I understand blood. I feel compelled to find the answers from the bible.

    The first misuse of blood is found in the book of Genesis. Cain became a cultivator of the ground. Able a herder of sheep. The time came for appreciation to be shown to Jehovah for what He had provided for them. As we all know, Cain offered the fruitage of the field to Jehovah but Able Killed and gave to Jehovah a young lamb. (It is very important that we remember the fact that before Noah, man had the right to kill animals). Cain became jealous of Able and murdered him. They had never seen a man die. They had seen animals die, and had even killed animals themselves. This was the first time that a human had died; complicating things further was the fact that Cain did the killing. Did Jehovah kill Cain for recompense? No. Why? Because, there was no law that stated you could not murder. Plus Cain may have not realized that he could actually kill his brother. Cain felt great pain for his actions at Gen. 4:13 he said, “My punishment for error is too great to carry”.

    The earth then became filled with murderous hybrids. Jehovah could not stand it any longer. He cleansed His earth from the bad that man had created by flooding it. He saved Noah’s family and the animals in the Ark. We now need to reflect on what Noah and his family had seen. Jehovah just killed almost all life on Earth. Stop here and reflect… What would you have done if you were Jehovah? This flooding showed Noah’s family how easy life could be taken. He needed to show Noah that life was precious. So, he asked the human family to respect life by not eating the blood, which represented the life that was taken. Plus, he now required that you give up your own life if you murdered another human. The whole reason for him asking to not eat the blood of an animal that you killed for food was to show Jehovah that you recognized the value of that life.

    Man had no other requirements on blood given to him at Gen. 9:4 except, that he must not eat the flesh with its blood. He could use the blood for fertilizing the ground, as paint, or even animal feed. To show this point clearly we need only to look too the scriptures. At Duet. 14:21 it states “You must not eat any body [already] dead. To the alien resident you may give it, and he must eat it; or there may be a selling of it to a foreigner.” There in Israel’s mist was the man of the nations,

    this foreigner represented the rest of mankind that Jehovah gave the command to at Gen: 9:4. Noah was instructed not to eat the blood of an animal that was to be eaten. This showed it’s not the blood itself, nor was it the act of eating the blood that God was addressing. He was instilling into man what was important, not the blood nor the eating of blood but Jehovah’s High regard for life. This is the key, God regards life higher than he does blood. This point can be proven clearly from the bible at Lev. 17:15 read “As for any soul that eats a body [already] dead or something torn by a wild beast, whether a native or a alien resident, he must in that case wash his garments and bathe in water and be unclean until evening; and he must be clean.” Here God say’s even the NATIVE could eat an animal that he personally did not kill and he knew that this animal had not been bled, and not be in violation of god’s law on blood. {A native, is a person that was clearly under the Mosaic Law and bound by it} How can this be? A Native, an Israelite eating un-bled meat? If eating blood was in violation of god’s law on blood which we all know it was, how could we explain this verse? If Jehovah did not make an exception to the rule how can this be explained? If we truly know Jehovah, and understand his high regards for life it is very easy to understand. Look at Duet. 14:21 it is clear here that Jehovah told Israel not eat a body already dead. Then why would he change it at Lev. 17:15? Here it states a native {person under the Mosaic Law} could eat an animal not bled and not be put to death. Why? His only sin is one of touching a dead animal and then he became unclean. He did not violate God’s law on blood here or Jehovah would have put the sinner to death. His only sin here was one of touching a dead animal. {The Law’s requirement for touching a dead animal is he became unclean by the act of touching a dead body}. Since he touched a dead body he was unclean until evening and he had to wash in water. At Lev. 17:15 Think about this example, Jehovah gave Israel away out of death. If there was a famine in the land or drought… and one happened upon a dead animal, the eating of that animal could literally have meant saving the life of that person and his family. If though he personally killed the animal and he did not drain the blood on the ground Jehovah would have killed this man for violating the law on blood why? Because, he did the killing. The act of killing was not charged to him if he found the body. If he killed it, Jehovah demanded that he acknowledge the life of that animal by pouring the blood on the ground. This showed that he respectfully proved to God that he realized that life was important. But finding the animal in which he had no responsibility of killing and he ate the body with its blood he did not break Jehovah’s law. Because eating it meant saving his life and that of his family. Thus showing Jehovah what was important life not death. What is the whole reason for Jehovah’s law on blood in the first place? The sanctity of life . Now if that same person under normal times ate an un-bled animal when there was no drought or famine, he would of have been put to death because it did not mean saving his life. He could have easily went without eating and be hungry until clean food was found. However the native could sell the animal for profit to a person that lived within the nation that wasn’t an Israelite. Then he could use the money to buy himself a meal that was bled. If one kills to sustain life by eating its flesh, then the one doing the killing must recognize that Jehovah requires the giving of the life represented by its blood back too Him. Jehovah wants us to live not die He values life more than sacrifice.

    We can see that the law Jehovah gave Noah was not equal to, or the same as, the law he gave to Israel. Under the Mosaic Law, blood was more restrictive for Israel than of the rest of the earth. Defining the law on blood given to Israel, and making it apply to the rest of mankind is unworkable in the scriptures. Blood was uniquely used by the nation of Israel for atonement sacrifices. There are two different worlds here. , The one under the Law of Israel and the rest of the world that’s not under it. This is clearly stated in the Insight On the Scriptures Vol 1 pages 345, paragraph 6 “At Deuteronomy 14:21 allowances was made for selling to an alien resident or a foreigner an animal that had died of itself or that had been torn by a beast. Thus a distinction was made between the blood of such animals and that of animals that a person slaughtered for food. {Compare Le 17:14-16} The Israelites, as well as alien residents who took up true worship and came under the Law covenant, were obligated to live up to the lofty requirements of that Law. People of all nations were bound by the requirement at Gen 9:3,4 but those under the Law were held by God to a higher standard in adhering to that requirement than were foreigners and alien residents who had not became worshipers of Jehovah.” Notice those under the Law were held by God to a higher standard regards blood. I would like to ask a question here. Could an alien resident break other Laws, stealing, dealing treacherously with his fellow man and get away with it? No, because he was under the legal Laws of Israel, not the Mosaic Law given to the Israelites.

    At 2 Samuel 23: 13-16. David showed that the reckless act of risking the lives of the Soldiers needlessly was likened to risking their blood {Life

    } David said “It is unthinkable on my part, O Jehovah, that I should do this! Shall I drink the blood of the men going at the risk of their souls” The water here represented their blood { LIFE } David was given the water by the solders to drink but he could not drink the water {blood} so he poured the water out onto the ground giving it to Jehovah. Notice, David poured it on the ground, sound familiar? The water or blood represented life. The act of wanton waste of life is repulsive to God.

    Let us take a look at how Jehovah reacted when the Soldiers of Saul disobeyed God’s law regarding blood. Remember they knew the command given to them on blood. [This was not the law given to the rest of mankind] At 1 Samuel 14: 31-35. “The people began darting greedily at the spoil…fell to eating along with the blood. Vs. 33...The people are sinning against Jehovah by eating along with the blood.” What happened to them? They were given a reprimand. They made atonement for their sin through sacrifices. Was it not the Law, that they were to be put death? These men had proven their loyalty on many occasions. In their mind it was a life and death matter. Their selfish hunger drove them to act greedily, so they did not take the time to properly give to God the blood [LIFE]

    back. As obvious the sin is here. Jehovah valued the Loyalty of the Soldiers from their past deeds. Jehovah shows he valued their life by not killing them.

    During my life I have heard talks from the platform discussing Num 11:31-35. Here it talks about quail being sent to the camp of Israel. From the talks, the brothers usually point out that the people broke the law on blood given to Noah, which is no doubt true. But what is of interest to me is the fact the Bible does not mention this apparent sin. It states that the Israelites were killed because of their greed. Why is there no mention of the sin of blood here? Could it be that the sin of greed is worse? I do not know! If I was to ask any JW’s what the worst sin was here… they would say with out hesitation the sin of blood! The reason HE killed them is made clear at Num 11:34 it states “selfish craving”. If our answer were the sin of blood it would not be in agreement with the mind of Jehovah. Have we really come to know Jehovah? Do we have the right to speak for him? We must come to know who this Jehovah is, and his thoughts are higher than ours.

    The Society clearly recognizes the fact that before Christ’s death, two

    different laws on blood were in effect. One for the world of mankind. [The laws given to Noah at Gen 9:4] The other for his people Israel. Look at Insight On The Scriptures Vol. 1 pages 345, paragraph 6. Do we have two different laws today? No. Since the Law given to Noah still applies, and the Mosaic Law, the more ridged Mosaic Law is not binding on us. There were two different laws regarding blood. I would like to ask a question. Did Jehovah make an exception when it comes to blood and we are still under the same law on blood, that the Nation of Israel was under? [Insight Vol 1 page 345 par. 6] This is what we are told, that we are still under all the Laws regarding blood, even the law exclusively given only to the Israelites under the Mosaic Law, are we not! The Bible shows two different laws READ Duet. 14:21. And the Society clearly shows this in it's own book [Insight On The Scriptures]. Many churches of Christendom claim that we are still under portions of the law given to the nation of Israel. Like the law of the Sabbath and the law on Tithing… The Bible clearly states that we are not bound by the Mosaic Law Col 2:14. But are we not still bound by laws given to all of mankind? We tell members of other churches that the Law given to Israel was taken away by Jesus death. For example, we are not bound by the Sabbath or Tithing. Paul's word's at Romans 7:7 say‘s "Really I would not have come to know sin if it had not been for the Law…I would not have known covetousness if the Law had not said:" Are we not doing the same thing in regards the Laws on blood?

    Look at Acts 15: 17-20. It clearly say’s “abstain from blood”. Lets take a closer look. First we have to recognize the fact that this statement was given in harmony with the older men of Jerusalem on their decision over circumcision. This was a volatile time in the first century church. If you look closely, you will notice the bible does not state that the Mosaic Law on blood was still binding. But the law of Noah was to be kept. “Hence my decision is not to trouble those from the nations who are turning to God,” Jehovah was not giving the nations a new command at Acts 15: The new converts came under the same law that had been in place for thousands of years they were to abstain from things polluted by idols, fornication from things strangled and blood. All of these laws were in effect before Jehovah gave Israel the Mosaic Law. Is this not the very reason we concluded that circumcision is not binding on us? Remember the Golden calf; remember Joseph and the wife of Potiphar remember the law on blood given to Noah? God did not ask anything more than these necessary things to keep doing.

    So let us pretend for a moment that the Law on blood is still exactly the same today as it was for the Israelites. Would it mean that Christians today should die in order to keep the law on abstaining from blood? How would dieing show God you respect his sanctity of life? Bible scholars state that Jehovah at Lev 17:15,16 made an exception and this exception was allowed during difficult times when their very lives were at stake. Heb 6:18 say’s “It is impossible for God to lie” Isaiah 55:8 say’s “For the thoughts of you people are not my thoughts”. By dieing, are we not saying, “Jehovah, you had no reason to given your Israel a way out of death over your law on blood.” Jehovah clearly shows us what HE wants! That is, for us to recognize that HE is the provider of life. Its blood represents life in the soul. At 2Samuel 23:16 life was even represented by water. Thus the sanctity of life is shown when blood is poured out or even water when it symbolizes blood. Dieing is the opposite of life, when life can be preserved. By making a standard today that one must die so as not to violate blood it is like telling Jehovah our thoughts are higher than his. There is no way we can ignore what Jehovah has penned in his Bible, it is clear HE gave Israel the right to choose life. I have to ask myself. When did HE make commandments for our day more stringent than HE did for his people Israel?

    We should always look for ourselves by studying the Scriptures to understand Jehovah’s thoughts. We cannot hide from Jehovah’s wrath. He will deal with anyone whom he wishes. Can hiding under a blanket protect us, thinking we are not the one responsible and pretend we will not be held accountable to Jehovah? I know Jehovah penned these scriptures sited here in this discussion. HE also penned, “Better is a live dog than a dead lion.” If I am wrong, I wish someone could explain these scriptures to me. I do not want to believe something that Jehovah does not teach. If I am right, that Jehovah really meant that these scriptures should be in the bible and somehow HE really meant for us to read them and understand them, are not the implications huge? Even the point that the Israelites could profit from the selling of an un-bled animal makes huge implications for today. We cannot use blood even for fertilizer let alone profit from its use. We would be Disfellowship if unrepentant. Since the Jews could profit from un-bled meat means today we could own stocks in the so-called blood subitutes like Polyheme and Biopure. Biopure is 100% cows blood that has been highly filtered. Polyheme is 100% human blood that has been highly filtered. Both of these are safe for all blood types and free of known risks. They are used to carry oxygen in the body. Both of these are OK to use according to the Society. Both however are 100% blood. Both have not been properly poured out on the ground. Both coagulate while waiting to be filtered. We are not allowed to store our own blood for later use because the Society say's it can't be allowed to coagulate. So auto-transfusions are in violation of the scriptures according to the Society. It is punishable by Disfellowshiping. Hold it here!!! I can see a double standard, a big one at that. Even blood used for fractions have coagulated before the factions are taken out. Someone had to donate that blood too. If we donated blood we would be Disfellowshipped. But we can use blood fractions that have been donated. We can't donate blood ourselves. We can however use blood fractions from blood that has coagulated. It really does not make any sense to me, how we can say one applies, but the other does not. We have clear scriptures that show what Jehovah's stand is on blood. Plus we violate our own law when it comes to fractions because blood can't coagulate and be used. Now the Society say’s we can use the new blood substitutes like Polyheme and Biopure. I think that the bible is so clear. We are told to wait on Jehovah. But there again, the bible teaches that we are held accountable too him. We teach that if we take our own life it is self-murder. If we contribute in any we to the death of someone else, we are blood guilty. For example, if our car needs brakes and we don’t fix them and someone is killed because of the brakes not working, then we are blood guilty. Our own record on blood shows that there is a big problem when it come to the biblical stand and making it apply to the world today, or it would not be so confusing. Every brother I have talked too about our stand on blood has a different way of viewing it. Some will take fractions, some will not. Some will use blood recycler’s, some will not. If the scripture sited in this discussion are really in the Bible and I understand them correct. Someone is in trouble. I have shared my thoughts with several Elders and none of them have disagreed we me. Why? Jehovah is not about change. HE will not make the light clearer at some miraculous time in the future, as if his he has changed his mind. It has been clear in the scriptures the whole time. HE will demand the blood of the little ones back too HIM. Just like HE will demand the blood of the prophets back too HIM, if someone, or some organization causes the death of a person because of a command that did not originate from God. Then it is nothing short of murder. Jehovah always asks for that blood to be paid back too HIM by the persons responsible for taking that life.

  • Dark Knight
    Dark Knight

    I remember reading Deut 14:21 when i was a dub having doubts. The implication of it totally blew me away. What further impacted me was the fact that i could not find any significant comments on that scripture in any watchtower publications. It was totally sidestepped!

    That's why i believe watchtower leaders and governing body members do realise that their blood doctrine was and still is on shaky ground.

    They are personally responsible for the lives that have perished as a result of their doctrine regarding the use of blood. Their failure to acknowledge this error reveals the true nature of these heart-hearted men.


  • skyman

    I had two Circuit Overseers at the same time came and visted my wife and I because of this letter. The oldest of the two that had been a C.O. longer we will call him C1 finally admitted that he had known for quit awhile that the Society was wrong. The other we will call him C2 jumped out of his seat and yeild I can's believe you just said that. C1 told him to sit down and let him finish his statement. C1 said skyman you have to wait on Jehovah to take care you this and then asked C2 if he could prove skyman wrong. C2 said NO! he could not and then C2 warned me to keep my mouth shut because it would stumble weaker one in the Organization.

    Both C.O. are friends of mine that happened to be on vaction visiting their OLD Congregation.

    Wait on Jehovah what a bunch of Bull S. The state of Washington took legal action on me years ago because I refussed to let my little GIRL have an transfussion. think about that I was willing to let her die thinking I was doing what Jehovah demanded of me. This makes me so mad at times when I think about it I allmost could climb out of my skin. I personally whould love to see the Governing Body taken out and beaten over and over again. I allmost spent the rest of my life knowing I had killed my baby girl. I see her big smile and thank heavens she is still with me. The Society is EVIL AND they know the truth about blood.

  • MegaDude

    When did you ever have to wait on truth?

    When the JWs say "wait on Jehovah" it really means, wait until the corrupt Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses decides to let the false doctrine drop. Right now they won't because they can't bear the shame of killing their own members with a false doctrine. That is all that "wait on Jehovah" means to the JWs.

    I asked the same questions to a long-time faithful editor of one of the magazines at Bethel. He wouldn't even say he believed the blood doctrines as they are taught but simply that "I don't think the Governing Body is going to change that." His advice? Put your doubts on a shelf and out of your mind. "That's what I do!" he said. Today he is suffering from Alzheimers. Self-inflicted?

  • serendipity

    It appears to me that the WTS is rusting away the blood policy. I predict the next thing to go will be 1-4 of the components or the prohibition on auto transfusions or the prohibition on blood donations. Most likely one of the latter two. The changes will take place slowly, considering the statute of limitations on lawsuits.

  • skyman

    The next part to change is the Auto Transfusion and this can be seen from the 2001 Blood card that we did not get

    The congergation did not give them out after they were printed and sent to the congregations The difference is one line where the older March - 1999 card states "I direct that no blood transfusion (whole blood, red cells, white cells, platelets or blood plasma) be given to me...," the June - 2001 version reads "I direct that no allogeneic blood transfusion (whole blood, red cells, white cells, platelets or blood plasma) be given to me..." So the difference in the cards is the use of the word allogeneic in the June 2001 version.

    So we stood at the thresh hold of being able of aottransufsiion and then stepped back.

  • hartstrings

    Thanks for sharing this. I copy and pasted it into my files. I always knew in my heart that God would never require a parent to sacrafice their child for a symbolic gesture. Thanks for spelling that out through the scriptures.


  • MidwichCuckoo

    There seems to be changes with thye blood issue, but I don't think the Society can drop it altogether. I think there may possibly be a 1970s style New Light (when JW were given 6 months to stop smoking) and the New Light will be that 'Abstain From Blood' will mean become vegetarian (with 6 months to do so....). Of course, the Awake?WT articles will also be backd up by 'Secular' evidence of the dangers of eating meat........

    THIS would be a very clever move for the WTBTS as I have heard it said that in the New System all will be vegetarian, so by preparing the R&F it will also give the message that the New System is almost upon us, and the R&F will fill in the blanks without the Society actually saying so (1975 all over again).

  • defd

    Skyman you lost me right here at the beginning so I went no further. Cain didnt feel great pain for what he did. He was worried about his PUNISHMENT! Read on in that verse and he goes to explain why.

    Cain felt great pain for his actions at Gen. 4:13 he said, “My punishment for error is too great to carry”.

  • jwfacts

    Heres a simple question defd.

    Are we allowed to eat food sacrificed to idols? Yes.

    So why does Acts 15:28 say we can not? Is the bible wrong? No. Acts 15:28 only applied to the congregations with a mix of Jews and Gentiles to avoid stumbling. Likewise blood is also acceptable. That is why it is never mentioned as a reason for shunning or the second death.

    Russell knew it, Christians know it, so why don't JWs these days?

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