That was my first question to God.
Why?
Does anybody have any understanding on this question?
pomegranate
Satan...Why wasn't he destroyed right AWAY??
by pomegranate 47 Replies latest watchtower bible
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stephenw20
Welcome
pomegranate,THis is not based on anything but Energy...and what WE know,there are many other things we dont know , like what the other planets are for?
MY opinion is he is the negative charge needed to complete the universe.......and I feel this because even in the abyss he will dwell in.......... in REV.......... it never says he will die
spirits in my opinion can never die....thats is why I feel we keep on going and going cause we are part spirit as well.
ying yang sort of thing , a battery is a great example regardless of what is contained within , it needs a ground...or a negative
I look forward to everyone elses responses
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dreamer
I heard this somewhere:
God wanted to make an example of the Devil (and Man) by allowing us to try and rule ourselves, thus, with over 6000 years of human history, we would learn that we can't. This way, after armageddon, we would know better than to reject God.
It makes some sense, but I still don't see why:
a) It takes so long for this point to be made
b) There is anything to stop another 'Devil' in 'paradise'Some answers from JWs on point a:
- He is so compassionate that he wants as many humans to turn to him before the inevitable end
- He has a plan, and that is thatanswers to b:
- It could happen again
Can anyone do better?
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Francois
Perhaps from the perspective of an infinite, eternal being he was!
No one ever went broke underestimating the stupidity of Jehovah's Witnesses
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perfectpie
Hello,
Obviously God would be the best to answer that question but the Bible does shed some light on your question.
The account in Genesis shows Satan raised questions as to the rulership of God. It also was slanderous to Gods personality in effect saying he lied and he was withholding qood things from his children.
Satan raised questions that took time to answer. Satan was trying to buy time in order to quench his appetite for being worshiped. He felt if the question could not be answered he would buy his own everlasting life. He was incorrect, because at the approval of Jesus sacraficial death from God the death sentence was officially slammed.
But that still dosn't answer your question. I myself have been left perplexed by the very same thought.
Perhaps he was having respect for the other Angels to whom would have heard and understood the implications of the issues raised. Since they may have wondered whether Gods rule was best and if man really may have been flawed if Satan was able to move the first two humans away from Gods love.
Really it still leaves me wondering. I guess for me the big thing is if I trust God knows the best and does the best for all involved. He has the capacity to undo all harm and reward in a big way and in this I hope all have confidence.
Thank you for the question best regards 3.14
"Never underestimate the power of the human spirit"
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pomegranate
It's a tough question, but I needed a really logical answer. This is what I got..
Rom 4:15, "And where there is no law, there is no transgression."
Rom 5:13 "...But sin is not taken into account when there is no law."
Without any law for "bad," God could do NOTHING to Satan immediately, as there were NO LAWS that he was breaking. None.
This is how I have come to understand. Before Satanic rebellion there was ONLY good. Nothing BAD at all whatsoever.
So, in the passing of existence in the spiritual domain, all was GOOD until Satan began HIS own creating of bad. He is responsible for ALL THAT IS BAD. Even the CONCEPT. An all Good God would not even have had the infinitely smallest iota of the CONCEPT of bad within him.
1 John 1:5, "This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; <b>in him there is no darkness at all</b>."
God would not have even used His omniscience at this point as there was no NEED for it. Everything was good. Omniscience is a tool God uses to guarantee his will and purposes are fulfilled. Without bad in the creation, good could only come to be. But, bad gets in the way of good. That's when God needs to use omniscience in order to look beyond the bad and see that all He wants is accomplished. That also means foreordination.
As evil, corrupt and flagrantly malicious Satan's attacks were, first on God, then onto Adam and Eve, there was nothing God could do immediately, because there was NO LAW against what he was doing. As the Bible states above, "where there is NO LAW, there is no transgression," and "sin is not taken into account when there is NO LAW."
Put on your spiritual eyes. Before Satan left the Way of Love, everything was Good. If you go back to the beginning, before ALL creation, all there was was the Father and Son. First, there was only God (Good). THE FIRST LIGHT. Father and Son together in a bond of Agape'. THEY ARE LIGHT. They are a duality in unity, as Head (Father) and Body (Son) OR, a Body (Father) and Seed (Son), even better if you can transcend the physical, they are both at the same time. They are complete in themselves, they lack nothing. Within them is ALL, and ALL is within them. A vortex of enigmatic spirituality. A Supreme Being. Two beings of the only true God nature (LOVE and ETERNITY) in an envelope of singular spirituality bodily. WAY GOOD.
Then they begin to create spirit beings from nothing and out of Love.BOOM. Masses of spirit beings. ALL is Good. ALL is still Light. ALL is in Love. Until...
Darkness began "covering" and challenging the Light. One creature who was once free to Love ALL, left ALL, including the Love of God, for the love of himself.
What happened to this once good and perfectly good being?
James 1:14-15, "...but each one is tempted when, by his own evil desire, he is dragged away and enticed. 15 Then, after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin;..."
Satan's exact thoughts were recorded for us by God in the Bible. God created and used the King of Tyre as the physical representation of what Satan did in the heavenly realm:
Ezek 27:3, "I am perfect in beauty."
I guess the haughty dude stayed in the mirror a bit too long eh? He was thinking way too much of himself. So much so, that in his own mind HE IS GOD. Satan's desire had conceived and given birth to his sin, ASS*UMING god ship. Satan then begins pulling in legions of angels to his side of the issue, that being that any creature that wants to be a god can be a god. Assume god ship for yourself. We are all gods! Do whatever you want.
The spiritual wheeling and dealing between Satan and other fallen angels in this matter of god ship is recorded for us in Ezekiel, depicted as BIG BUSINESS dealings. The other demons even raise him on high, as BUILDING him up as he has shown them THE REAL TRUE FREEDOM. WE ARE ALL GODS! (Ezekiel 27:4-24)
The heavens have now become divided because of the Darkness of the first Lie (I am a god) and the sympathetic followers of that lie (we are all gods).
Ezek 28:2, "In the pride of your heart you say, "I AM a god; I sit on the throne of a god in the heart of the seas."
The false god Satan sitting on his self made throne with his "seas" of other false gods, in the now spiritually divided heavens.
Ezek 28:17 "Your heart became proud on account of your beauty, and you corrupted your wisdom because of your splendor."
That's WHY I think a LOVING GOD could do nothing about Satan in the beginning, immediately. BECAUSE THERE WAS NO LAW, against bad. Bad had never come into creation before, so there were no laws for bad, never mind a punishment. Yet.
The Father and Son had a plan.
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perfectpie
Rock on!
That was the best and most original take on that question I've ever heard. Thanks!
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willy_think
just a thought, "before satan left the way of light, everything was good." this can not be true. with out a duelistic experience there is no good. there is only what is. light witchout darkness is bliding and we can not see. what people think of as "evil", disobedience to the law of whatever god you choose is, to my mind, a choice and without choice there is no freedom and no way for us to grow. no change ever never. i am not saying be bad what i mean to say is no options no growth.
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MDS
Hello Pomegranate:
Satan...Why wasn't he destroyed right AWAY??
I'd like to reply to your question above. It is a very good one.
After sinning in the Garden, there were three (3) rebels in existence, three that had sinned before God:
1. Satan
2. Adam
3. EveAll "sons (& 1 daughter) of God."
All made in God's image.
If Jehovah punished Satan, the first "disobedient Son," and put him to death IMMEDIATELY, right after the sin...
...what must he do to the other two sinners?
What would be considered "fair"?
IMMEDIATE DEATH to the both of them...
That would be "fair"...right?
What punishment you give out to one person...give out to all "sons" for sinning....IMMEDIATE DEATH death would be "consistent," Justice, fair play, for God to do here.
All three (3) of them must die, IMMEDIATELY.
Why didn't God do this?
L-O-V-E...
He allows all to survive...Adam lives some 930 years...
...has a chance to Produce offspring...unborn offspring...
billions of people, unborn, descendants of Adam.
God mercifully allowed sinners Adam and Eve to live on, and produce offspring.
We were born, allowed to live because of this merciful act of God.
Further, Jehovah God, utters the first prophecy, after the sinning of these three persons.
Genesis 3:15, shows the outcome...
Jehovah shows the "end" from the "beginning." He shows how this will all end, ...
...righteousness will OVERCOME evil...
The righteous "seed" would overcome the "wicked" seed of Satan, in the end. (Gen. 22:18)
By allowing wickedness, allowing the three sinners to live, allowing Satan to live, Jehovah shows that Good will overcome Evil in the end, in the long run.
Moral of Story:
God's way is best...never follow Satan...right always wins in the long run...righteousness is stronger than evil...right wins in the long run.
So, Jehovah let Satan live.
One other thing...God's Name.
when all is said and done, all will see the "wisdom" of Jehovah allowing Satan to live, and mankind to practice all forms of sin too...in the long run, all will know WHY, God's methods are best for mankind, as revealed in the Bible...this will magnify God's Name...in the end.
"For by now I could have thrust my hand out that I might strike you and your people with pestilence and that you might be effaced from the earth. But in fact, for this cause I have kept you in existence, for the sake of showing you my power and in order to HAVE MY NAME DECLARED IN ALL THE EARTH." -- Exodus 9:15, 16
Jehovah has accomplished many things, by allowing Satan to exist and set up goverments that he can personally "rule." He will receive much praise for this in the future...it is a smart "move" on God's part, all things considered. -- Luke 4:5,6; John 14:30; Rev. 12:3; 16:13, 14
It is a "smart" move because, all up until that point, even from the angels in heaven point of view...no one had done ANYTHING different from what God Almighty had said. No one. Everything had gone God's way, totally His way all up until then. That first "sin" in the Garden, was the first time anyone had done anything OUTSIDE of God's Stated, Revealed Will. This was the first time.
So, if Jehovah allows someone else to "rule," ... to do it "THEIR WAY," instead of His way all of the time...
...then for the FIRST TIME...peoples, nations, even angels would be in a position to make a...COMPARISON...A COMPARISON between the way God Rules and Satan, or Man...
Now, a Comparison can be drawn up between the differences in the rulerships...a Comparison can be made...
So, it was a smart move on God's part to allow Satan to live and set up human governments, humans who have tried every form of government and have utterly failed...in every civilization and culture, worldwide, earthwide for the past 6,000 years!
It was a smart move on God's part...to allow Satan to live.
Peace.
MDS
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unclebruce
After sinning in the Garden, there were three (3) rebels in existence, three that had sinned before God: 1. Satan 2. Adam 3. Eve
Well MDS that's an interesting scenerio - Adam, Eve and Cain - all of earths inhabitants taking Satans side - not one person on earth siding with poor old Jehovah, fruit guarding god of bbq'd meat. Sounds to me, in line with your reasoning that this is a cosmic court case, that God lost the case there and then - case dismissed! Next!
things that make ya go mmm, unclebruce (who reconds Judge Judy is better qualified to judge mankind that the Jewish tribal God of thunder and unfermented cakes)
PS: Your JW apologist blather is very much like a character called obves on DeJaVu. (Swallowed the fundy bait - never was a baptised JW - can't see what all this fuss is about)