Jesus disses corporation-led religion??

by not a captive 76 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  BurnTheShips

  The Jews of Jesus day added to the Law of Moses, it was no longer worship as God intended. But, it was Jewish "religion"

  In those things that were of the Law, Jesus told his disciples to follow them. In those human traditions that violated the Law, Jesus himself told the disciples where they were wrong.

  Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples: "The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat. So you must obey them and do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach. They tie up heavy loads and put them on men's shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them."

  BTS
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  Deputy Dog

  Burn

  In those human traditions that violated the Law, Jesus himself told the disciples where they were wrong.

  So the Talmud was not an "institution" of the Jewish religion in Jesus day?
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  BurnTheShips

  Instances of hierarchal authority in the days of the Apostles.

  These verses show us there was a community of Christians and the Apostles were acknowledged as leaders of the community:

  The community of believers was of one heart and mind, and no one claimed that any of his possessions was his own, but they had everything in common. With great power the apostles bore witness to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus, and great favor was accorded them all. There was no needy person among them, for those who owned property or houses would sell them, bring the proceeds of the sale, and put them at the feet of the apostles, and they were distributed to each according to need. Acts 4:32-35

  In the next verses, we see the Apostles appointed deacons from among the disciples:

  At that time, as the number of disciples continued to grow, the Hellenists complained against the Hebrews because their widows were being neglected in the daily distribution. So the Twelve called together the community of the disciples and said, "It is not right for us to neglect the word of God to serve at table. Brothers, select from among you seven reputable men, filled with the Spirit and wisdom, whom we shall appoint to this task, whereas we shall devote ourselves to prayer and to the ministry of the word. (Acts 6:1-4)

  In this verse, we see that presbyters were already common in the Church:

  This they did, sending it to the presbyters in care of Barnabas and Saul. (Acts 11:30)

  In this next verse, we see the Christians had already considered themselves a church:

  About that time King Herod laid hands upon some members of the church to harm them. (Acts 12:1)

  Also, there were, within the Church, particular, local churches:

  Now there were in the church at Antioch prophets and teachers: Barnabas, Symeon who was called Niger, Lucius of Cyrene, Manaen who was a close friend of Herod the tetrarch, and Saul. (Acts 13:1)

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  Deputy Dog

  Burn

  Jesus kills the Jewish religion with this statement.

  Mat 23:38"Behold, your house is being left to you desolate!"
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  BurnTheShips

  So the Talmud was not an "institution" of the Jewish religion in Jesus day?

  The Talmud did not exist in Jesus' day.

  BTS
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  BurnTheShips

  Burn

  Jesus kills the Jewish religion with this statement.

  Mat 23:38"Behold, your house is being left to you desolate!"

  And fulfills it with something greater. An Israel, not of a single nation of people, but of all nations, out of all humanity. The tree has never been cut. Only branches get pruned off, and new ones grafted in.

  Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. (Matthew 5:17)

  If some of the branches have been broken off, and you, though a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others and now share in the nourishing sap from the olive root. (Romans 11:17)

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  PSacramento

  PSAC, I appreciate your perspective. However, none of this addresses the simple fact that Jesus founded a visible, universal church. It is this simple fact that I am trying to underscore. He founded a body that had a clear formal structure under the guidance of the Apostles--to whom he gave clear and explicit authority to do so.

  Oh I agree Jesus did that too, but guidance is one thing, authoritive dictatorship is another.
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  PSacramento

  Differences of opinion?

  In terms of doctrines they were establishing and in terms of authority, yes.
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  BurnTheShips

  authoritive dictatorship is another.

  I know that false teachers, like vicious wolves, will come in among you after I leave, not sparing the flock (Acts 20:29)

  In terms of doctrines they were establishing and in terms of authority, yes.

  Yes.

  BTS
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  Deputy Dog

  Burn

  The Talmud did not exist in Jesus' day.

  Not formally. But many of the oral traditions of it came before his day. Many of the sabath teaching for example.