Slavery is often the most abused morality issue to make Christianity look good by spreading lies that as a faith it had always opposed slavery. Of course this is not true, but this is monopolized by Christianity due private conduct of many anti-slavery clergy. Greek philosophers in Hellenistic era and Persian kings debated slavery and saw it as something moraly wrong. They were not Christians. This was also picked up by Romans philosophers who channeled this idea to the early Christian fathers. St. Augustine saw it as necessary evil and John Chrysostom as a confirmation of man's fall from the grace. Overall Christian position to slavery from among main denominations was lukewarm. Many early medieval kingdoms abandoned slavery for military reason, not for moral. There were anti-slavery bishops like St. Adalbert (+997), but Catholic and Orthodox church never took official position in that time. Slavery in kingdom of Bohemia was abolished by royal decree in 1092 because it was easier to create army from peasants than slaves. Church did absolutely nothing. Church wasd also against abolishement of serfdom in the 18th century, which was also ended by royal decrees (Joseph II in 1782) or by French guillotine (1789). Everytime I read how Church stood up against the slavery, where are the official acts?
Posts by kaik
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10Is The Bible Now Obsolete - On Moral Standards?
by metatron insometimes, i feel like my life has been summed up by a grateful dead quote: "what a long strange trip it's been".. .
after many years as a witness, i discovered that i worked with gay people - and that they struggled to pay a mortgage and had pretty much the same problems as everyone else.
what was i concerned about?
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10
Is The Bible Now Obsolete - On Moral Standards?
by metatron insometimes, i feel like my life has been summed up by a grateful dead quote: "what a long strange trip it's been".. .
after many years as a witness, i discovered that i worked with gay people - and that they struggled to pay a mortgage and had pretty much the same problems as everyone else.
what was i concerned about?
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kaik
Bible moral standards were obsolete at the moment they were completed. Western civilization derives its laws and judicial proceeding from Roman Law not from biblical. This was already known in the late antiquity that fundamentalist and theocratic approach to biblical morality is not possible nor desirable. However, in past 1600 years in regular intervals came crazy movements that tried to enforce biblical standard upon society with catastrophic results. Christianity is in its substance oriental religion, which is not compatible with civic freedom and individuality, something that was born in ancient Greece and defined a world west of Jerusalem. Late antiquity attempted to compromise bilblical morality with reality creating this bipolar view on what is moral and what is wrong. Christians claims that they were always against slavery, oppression, etc. yet most of these ideas were copied by non-christian thinkers.
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Christian Pastors ORDERED to Marry Gays or Face JAIL TIME & FINES $$$
by oneyeopen ino.k just worked out how to start a new post/thread, just came across this and wanted to share with anyone that may be interested.. http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/oct/20/idaho-citys-ordinance-tells-pastors-to-marry-gays-/.
coeur dalene, idaho, city officials have laid down the law to christian pastors within their community, telling them bluntly via an ordinance that if they refuse to marry homosexuals, they will face jail time and fines.. read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/oct/20/idaho-citys-ordinance-tells-pastors-to-marry-gays-/#ixzz3ibe4kyvq follow us: @washtimes on twitter.
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kaik
Viviane, it is well known that homophobic people tends to hide their same-sex desires behind hatefull anti-gay biases. Leader of UK nazis movement was gay and died of AIDS and have Jewish bf in the closet. Leader of East German neonazi was also gay and died in from AIDS complications in 1990's. I am not sure how many people get preoccupied with thinking what two adults do in their privacy and generally nobody want to know...
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Christian Pastors ORDERED to Marry Gays or Face JAIL TIME & FINES $$$
by oneyeopen ino.k just worked out how to start a new post/thread, just came across this and wanted to share with anyone that may be interested.. http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/oct/20/idaho-citys-ordinance-tells-pastors-to-marry-gays-/.
coeur dalene, idaho, city officials have laid down the law to christian pastors within their community, telling them bluntly via an ordinance that if they refuse to marry homosexuals, they will face jail time and fines.. read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/oct/20/idaho-citys-ordinance-tells-pastors-to-marry-gays-/#ixzz3ibe4kyvq follow us: @washtimes on twitter.
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kaik
Civil marriages in Europe are in existence from 1791-1805 as a result of French Revolution and subsequent occupation of most of Europe by French troops. In most of Europan countries under rules of secularization, every marriage license have to be issued by local townhall, even when the ceremony was performed by priest in church. Marriage is foremost civic contract, not religious.
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To all secret faders who still believe in Christianity
by Chris Tann ini have been fading for six years now.
i only continue to do the minimum to keep my family together and to keep association with close friends.
i would like to hear your experience and how you are getting along.
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kaik
There are ex-JWs who set up ministry along side of the WT and think they will follow WT teaching as they fit. There are ex-JWs who live in illusion to be the next prophet Jeremiah and see the shunning and isolation from KH as necessary sacrifice in order to reform WT. There are ex-JWs who became even more crazy after DF, do rain dances, speak in tongues, and yelling on every side that Jesus saves/loves/comes/punishes/redeems. I have met all these types. Even Christians do not have unified belieffs due poorly written ancient scrolls and think their faith is the only correct one.
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If you have been inactive for over a year can you get disfellowshipped?
by cognac ini've read conflicting things so was hoping to get this clarified.. .
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kaik
Absolutelly, you can be DF for anything they decide to. Even to disagree with small changes of doctrine based on the older literature or momentary explanation will get you DFs quickly. JC does not need to prove anything. If they want you out you are out and there is NOTHING you can do. In Czech Republic they use traveling elders who are known as executioner squat and they brag how many apostate and innactive people had DFs. I have heard about attempt DF someone who was innactive. Older lonely woman who never married and never had children. One of these who are available after Armageddon. She suffered some medical condition and was in and out of nursing home or so, and stopped attending to meetings for long time until people forgot about her. Once DO mentioned to reach out people who were innactive to find out what are their standing in the organization or get them DFs if they did not return. To the suprise they find out that this old woman was for a while dead and buried at the city expenses. There was still debate in the KH if she was JW until her death or she left organization before and should be DF post-mortem. Elder wife said that the woman was never good christian and probably not eligible for resurrection. I do not know if they privatelly DFs but since she was gone and buried in pauper grave without any relatives around, they did not care about annoucjing it.
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The High Cost Of War
by designs inbritain is refinancing some soverign war bonds dating from the crimean war, napoleonic war and wwi, 2 $billion worth.
2 century old debt.. our president has been reluctant to begin another war when the debt of the previous two wars hangs heavy.
those of the prowar persuasion have insisted on 'boots on the ground' a move that would require 100,000s of personnel in the middle east and allocating billions in debt to cover the cost.. "every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed" president eisenhower.
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kaik
Excellent point Prologos. I think many people forget that USSR was aggressor and engaged hostile takeover of six countries west of it (Finland, 3 Baltic states, Poland, and Romania), and USSR was the only country that was EVER kicked from League of Nations. Only one. UK and France hoped in 1938-1939 that dictators from Germany and USSR will kill each other and bleed out on battlefiled and have no problem sacrificing Czechoslovakia to the Hitler and Albania to Mussolini. Stalin even conratulate to Hilter for Munich. Until 1941, UK was the only country in Europe fighting while USSR did nothing. They lost 20 millions of own citizens, but it is also crucial to say that USSR ruled by communist party which has a major blame for starting WWII.
designs, also look into how many Russians and other citizens of USSR died fighting each other durign WWII. Collaboration with Nazis also happened among Russian population- look into the fate of Vlasov-, because many Russians believed fighting communism.
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Have you investigated Gnostic Christianity?
by Gnostic Bishop inhave you investigated gnostic christianity?.
the gnostic wing of christianity, if it can even be called that today, has quite a few differences to christianity and catholicism.
if the old gnostic christians were here, they would hardly recognize what has happened to the original orthodox catholic church or its various offshoots in protestantism and islam.
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kaik
I had books from E. Pagels and enjoyed them tremendously. I read also early Christain Magic and it was interesting book on mixed superstitions, curses, hexes, and mixed beliefs of early Christianity, Judaism, and Hellenistic culture.
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The High Cost Of War
by designs inbritain is refinancing some soverign war bonds dating from the crimean war, napoleonic war and wwi, 2 $billion worth.
2 century old debt.. our president has been reluctant to begin another war when the debt of the previous two wars hangs heavy.
those of the prowar persuasion have insisted on 'boots on the ground' a move that would require 100,000s of personnel in the middle east and allocating billions in debt to cover the cost.. "every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed" president eisenhower.
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kaik
DJS, you wasting your time, these people will never change, they will admire their holy Russia even when is waste deep in the mud. I knew these people from communist years, and they believe that there is a huge paradise in northern Asia since 1917 and USA (and decandent West-Democratic world) is on the verge of bankruptcy to be swept by Stalin, A.H, Mao, Putin, Saddam....
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The High Cost Of War
by designs inbritain is refinancing some soverign war bonds dating from the crimean war, napoleonic war and wwi, 2 $billion worth.
2 century old debt.. our president has been reluctant to begin another war when the debt of the previous two wars hangs heavy.
those of the prowar persuasion have insisted on 'boots on the ground' a move that would require 100,000s of personnel in the middle east and allocating billions in debt to cover the cost.. "every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed" president eisenhower.
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kaik
Even Romans had figured in the past that prolonged conflicts drain treasury and many times the objective of the war was not met. Rome abandoned a conquest of Germania due extensive cost associated with uncertain payback. Extensive military spending bankrupts countries even without war. USSR is one of the example.