DJS

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Posts by DJS

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  95

  Just this simple fact of life is proof of God....

  by EndofMysteries in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i'll be curious for any alternative plausible explanations for this...... .

  every lifeform on earth, humans, plants, bacteria, cells, anything with life originated with other life.

  all trees come from living seeds from other trees, etc.

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  DJS

  Tornapart,

  I completely agree with you. I don't do that for the same reasons I find it annoying. May be this discourse will help each side respect the other.
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  95

  Just this simple fact of life is proof of God....

  by EndofMysteries in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i'll be curious for any alternative plausible explanations for this...... .

  every lifeform on earth, humans, plants, bacteria, cells, anything with life originated with other life.

  all trees come from living seeds from other trees, etc.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  DJS

  Tammy,

  You were my sister in Christ at one time, and I have no desire to flame you. Your arrogance is historic. Learned men are having an intellectual discussion and you bring rosary beads and mantras to the discussion. You should be ashamed of yourself. I know lots about lots but I'm humble enough to admit there are many more things I know lots of nothing about. Cofty and some others impress me in their knowledge. When they say things I question, rather than entering the discussion in an impulse control challenged manner I do some research to see if I can: a. refute their facts; or b. refute the logic supporting their facts. So far I haven't been able to. That's it baby. Stay out of these discussions unless you: a. bring facts or can refute someone else's facts; or b. support your facts with logic or refute the logic someone else is using. With facts, empirical data but not your fuzzy feel good mantras. Please. I'm pleading with you. Otherwise you are a troll to me and I won't respond to anything you say. And if I do I will sarcastically and snidely address your rationale but hopefully not you.

  It's really that simple. In addition to your historic lack of humility, you also seem to lack impulse control. And you love the attention. (snide remark alert: I will send you the psychotherapy bill in the mail; i take al major credit cards). Why can't you sit at your computer and simply LEARN something rather than making your embarrassing attempts to prove something by saying the same thing over and over and over. Facts and the logic supporting those facts please.

  There are plenty of biblical purely theological discussions on this board; you don't have to enter where you don't truly have the skill sets to enter. Go argue about your all's interpretation of 1 John 3:2 or whether the slave class truly stood up in 1919. Frankly, those discussions nauseate me. I'd just as soon have a rusty nail driven into my brain with a hammer, and then rinse and repeat, as I would to ever carry on one of those discussioins again. In my perfect world these types of things would never be discussed. But hey, in my perfect world lots of things would change. But I digress.

  So you are a troll; I won't respond to you again.
• 
  95

  Just this simple fact of life is proof of God....

  by EndofMysteries in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i'll be curious for any alternative plausible explanations for this...... .

  every lifeform on earth, humans, plants, bacteria, cells, anything with life originated with other life.

  all trees come from living seeds from other trees, etc.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  DJS

  Snide remarks? I resemble that remark! As I mentioned earlier, in my sojourn from true believer to atheist I had similar thoughts for a while. A god created things and then went to another part of the universe to play around/create/rest, leaving our world to fend for itself. I don't know that I would say that he/she/it put it on auto-pilot; the world/planet is too effed up to say that (which is evidence AGAINST an all wise creator BTW). Or that said god(s) created the earth and everything on it as their last gasp before they expired. We can play around with all sorts of scenarios in our head, and they are ultimately useful in enabling us to make sense of all of this and to re or de-construct our beliefs upon our JW/WT exodus and what we have held dear to us, some of us for most if not all of our lives.

  I did the same thing. But I continued to study, reading many of the books/articles cited herein, and analyzed, researched and meditated for years. Decades. Then I began a systematic deconstruction of the scenarios and hypotheses to determine which, in my mind (my mind was the only one I was worried about and (snide remark alert) thankfully I had enough humilty during this time to not try to argue with people who knew a helluva lot more than I about these topics or desperately hang onto to failed belief systems and thought processes as if I had just left the cave.

  I even thought about writing movie scripts about it; it would make great sci-fi. I an an intelligence analyst, college prof by trade; I earn a living by deconstructing arguments, cutting through the chaff and finding the nugget, the wheat. I don't give a rip about feelings or beliefs and I only care about what I can prove or darn near prove. Otherwise I'm unemployed.

  I wil try to minimize my 'snide' remarks, but when Rose, now Tammy and QC and others preach their form of the gospel to me I really want to throw up. Snide, sarcastic remarks are my therapy. Please don't take that from me. And I promise I will stop when they and those like them stop or move past the feel/belief syndrome. They make excellent followers. The Catholic hierarch kept people like them in the dark for hundreds of years by ensuring they couldn't read, frowning on ownership or study of the bible and relying solely on them for guidance. Send the poor souls a miracle or two on occasion to keep them believing and under control. But don't let them start thinking.

  Oh, did I say Catholic hierarch? I meant JW hierachy.
• 
  95

  Just this simple fact of life is proof of God....

  by EndofMysteries in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i'll be curious for any alternative plausible explanations for this...... .

  every lifeform on earth, humans, plants, bacteria, cells, anything with life originated with other life.

  all trees come from living seeds from other trees, etc.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  DJS

  Tammy,

  Yeahhhh. We've all kinda sorta heard all that before and moved on from it. It is embarrassing (and arrogant) that you interject the prayer bead, hail mary, krishna mantra into an otherwise intellectual discussion. Trying to drag us back down the evolutionary ladder, huh? We know it gives you comfort (that warm and fuzzy feeling again we discussed last week), just as counting beads and repeating prayers and chanting mantras do for believers. I do believe in ghosts I do I do I do. I do believe in ghosts I do I do I do. If you repeat it over and over you will continue to reinforce your beliefs and annoy the hell out of everyone else. But Captain Obvious makes a relevant point about such, as he stated that you and others like you are helping the lurkers and others with doubt move away from theism. So maybe you should just continue and I should develop more tolerance.

  We know you feel and believe these things. We truly do; we were on that side once.
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  95

  Just this simple fact of life is proof of God....

  by EndofMysteries in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i'll be curious for any alternative plausible explanations for this...... .

  every lifeform on earth, humans, plants, bacteria, cells, anything with life originated with other life.

  all trees come from living seeds from other trees, etc.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  DJS

  Yes, what Adam said. A loop. What came before that? Then who came before that? And who created him/her/it? Ad nauseum. When was going through my true believer/theist/agnostic/atheist travels, I had similar thoughts. But when it came down to it, minus the science and the bible (both of which I studied for a long time), the thought of a god - especially as we were taught that he is loving, we are made in his image, he cares for us, blah blah blah - was irrational. When I reflected on the age of the universe and the planet, the time humans have spent evolving on a mostly inhospitable planet (it has been VERY difficult to be human on this planet for tens of thousands of years or longer) and considered that 'god' didn't provide any written instructions until a few thousand years ago was, to me, overwhelming evidence of the lack of such imaginary creatures.

  And that written instruction is laughable for any real assistance or guidance it provided humans. Most if not all of the Bible's 'wisdom' was written long before by others. Come on people. The all powerful Oz couldn't do any better than the Bible, of which tens of thousands of interpretations have existed through the millenia, none of which have proved the ONE (yeah as JWs we thought we had it)? Dear god, I could provide better instructions on a rock. And this so called god loves me, views me as his cherised son? I suppose you also have a bridge you want to sell me.

  I have a son. And a daughter. I am crazy stupid close to both of them and have been since the day they were born. I wouldn't ever, in a trillion years, have treated them the way your god has treated me and the countless bilions of humans who have walked the planet. To all those before the bible was written I suppose the message from god would be to figure it out on your own. Sorry boutcha. Or maybe he/she/it was in another part of the universe and didn't return for a while. I could certainly writen a compelling sci-fi movie script about it. Star Trek - the search for god.

  And the message after the bible was written I suppose would be to spend your entire effing life trying to read between the lines or figure out which one of his/her/it's spokespersons had the real 'truth.' Geeesh. The only real surprise is that there are any theists. If we would maximize the potential in our DNA there wouldn't be.
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  95

  Please Share one of your Favourite Quotations

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  have you ever come across words that resonate with you?

  it doesn't have to be a great gem of wisdom, just something that is meaningful to you.. please share, and if you want to, tell us why it's meaningful to you.. here is something that made me nod when i first read it.... .

  "fortunate are those who have learned to see, in the wild things of nature, something to be loved, something to be wondered at, something to be reverenced, for they have found the key to a never-failing source of recreation and refreshment".

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  DJS

  Desmond Tutu:

  When the missionaries came to Africa they had the Bible and we had the land. They said 'Let us pray.' We closed our eyes. When we opened them we had the Bible and they had the land.

  Star Wars:

  Let the Wookie win.
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  371

  Design or Non-Design, finally we know, Darwin's Doubt

  by QC in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  if you want to read the definitive explanation on fossils and how life arrived its covered in darwins doubt, by s.c. meyer.

  this is a game changer.

  the bomb!.

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  DJS

  Ditto Captain Obvious,

  QC is doing the work for the non-theists. And to lurkers and those who continue to believe, pay close attention to this argument as CO states. The primary arrogance is coming from the theist camp, which is typical in these types of discussions. And I will eat my IMac (OK maybe not really) the first time a theist admits they were wrong or shows a little bit of humility on any of these types of subects/topics. Rose, QC, are you listening?
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  31

  ApostateChick Strikes again "Jehovah's Witnesses--Why The @#$% Are You Here? "

  by Watchtower-Free in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  fyi just saw her latest youtube vid.

  .

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwd72g8pb3q.

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  DJS

  I'm in love.
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  371

  Design or Non-Design, finally we know, Darwin's Doubt

  by QC in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  if you want to read the definitive explanation on fossils and how life arrived its covered in darwins doubt, by s.c. meyer.

  this is a game changer.

  the bomb!.

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• 

  DJS

  QC,

  And to see how silly your premise statement that people are finally awakening, I have included 2 year old gallup data about the beliefs of Americans regarding evolution. It took me all of 5 minutes to find this; maybe if you actually thought about what it is you are trying to prove and then provide proof of it we wouldn't be so harsh. So again, if the theists/creationists are in the majority (by a lot), what point are you trying to make about 'awakening?"

  To quote 2 famous 20th Century philosophers (Simon and Garfunkel): "A man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest." Now go away QC and take a research class on how to academically and objectively research a topic to support your defniitive statements (which should be few and far between in ANY analytical or academic paper anyway, which is why scientists use words like "suggest" when they discuss the results of SCIENTIFIC observations) BEFORE you make definiitive statements about it. I'm an ex college prof and taught research classes in addiiton to lots of other courses. I red-lined everything students wrote that wasn't supported by the best empirical academic data they could find. It is an opinion, and opinions have no real place in serious debate, unless you qualify it as your opinion (which kinda sorta indicates that you are open to change your mind). You of course, aren't

  From a 2012 Gallup Poll:

  Forty six percent Americans believed in creationism, 32 percent believed in theistic evolution and 15 percent believed in evolution without any divine intervention. As the graph below shows, the percent of Americans who believe in creationism has increased slightly by 2 percent over the last 30 years. The percent of Americans who believe in evolution has also increased by 6 percent over the last 30 years while the percent of Americans who believe in theistic evolution has decreased by 6 percent over the same time period.

  

  Regular church attendance is strongly positively correlated with believing in creationism, and negatively correlated with believing in theistic evolution and evolution. Among those who attend church weekly, two-thirds believe in creationism, 25 percent believe in theistic evolution and a mere 3 percent believe in evolution.
• 
  371

  Design or Non-Design, finally we know, Darwin's Doubt

  by QC in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  if you want to read the definitive explanation on fossils and how life arrived its covered in darwins doubt, by s.c. meyer.

  this is a game changer.

  the bomb!.

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  DJS

  Let's see QC, you started this post and now you wait a week after the last post to have a final say. Is that it? I followed the conversation and couldn't/wouldn't in a thousand years arrive at your conclusions. So the Amazon rating is the trump card in this argument? I'm really unsure of what it is you are trying to state.

  And just to what are those taking the Amazon poll awakening? The 4.2 out of 5 who would be attracted to this book are likely the choir or the amen corner They probably didn't need awakened; it just reinforced a belief, which is why you likely made this weak post a week after the real discussion was completed.

  It is also clear that you didn't really read any of the dialogue or arguments as to why this isn't science. I will make a note to ignore all future posts from you an others (i.e. Rose) who try to proselytize and who completely ignore facts.