I honestly believe WT needs to be thankful for speaking up about this and I also think that Wt owes owes Bill Bowen and Barbara Anderson a massive big apology for DFing them. If it wasn't for them doing what they did when the did it. Wt would of been in for a heap more hurting.
joe134cd
JoinedPosts by joe134cd
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Is shunning a common religious punishment for reporting sexual abuse (or other crimes)?
by Fernando inin other words, is it true that the watchtower is just like other religions when it comes to cover-ups?.
from personal experience (with incest and doctrinal/financial fraud) in the watchtower i would say so.. especially when i compare stories like the one i read today:.
"its impossible to know how many women have been raped by jewish men.
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Conti Appeal Oral Arguments slated for 9 A.M., Jan. 14, 2014. Recap of Defendant Watchtower's Complaint of Errors for your info.
by AndersonsInfo inconti appeal hearing-summary of watchtowers complaint of errors with plaintiff's reply.
the following statements were taken from the introduction of respondents brief a136641 -attorney richard simons' response for plaintiff.
defendants argue that the affirmative duty imposed by the trial court impinges on their religious freedom.
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joe134cd
This is getting interesting. I hope that the watchtower loses in magnificent glory, but I've got a feeling that they will wriggle out of it. -
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Is shunning effective?
by rebel8 indoes shunning accomplish its objectives:.
make the person repent?.
deter others from committing similar offenses in the future?.
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joe134cd
Is shunning effective. Here's some things to consider.
66.6% of DFed people never return.
From my observation (and although I have no evidence to it)I would say that the frequency of DFs is increasing.
Some DFed ones then take their issues to the internet which in turn creates further havoc when it's members and those thinking of joining the group read it. Hence the 2014 increase in most western countries is 1%. The world is growing at a rate of 1.3% so they weren't even able to retain the rate at which the world is growing.
I personally think shunning just sweeps issues under the carpet. It antagonize and makes the shunned one worse and more determined than ever that they will never return.
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I questioned some Mormons today
by joe134cd inas a result of my fading from the jw religion, i have taken an interest in the mormon religion.
personally i think mormonisim is a bigger con than the jw religion.
with all knowledge i've been acquiring, i was interested to find out what the followers of the mormon religion knew about the churches history.
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joe134cd
Despite the above, and the totally off the wall beliefs of the mormon church. I do forsee a better out come for the Mormon church. They have encouraged their members to succeed in life. Financially they better systems in place e.g tithing, although they do run the same wt financial scams of realestate. One thing I do think the Mormon church is years ahead in is fussing up to its members about its past. Well put it this way the missionaries knew that J.smith was a con man and about his various sleeping arrangements. How many JWs would know that Rutherford was a raging alcoholic, who was an abusive pig. I guess we must all reach our own conclusions. -
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I questioned some Mormons today
by joe134cd inas a result of my fading from the jw religion, i have taken an interest in the mormon religion.
personally i think mormonisim is a bigger con than the jw religion.
with all knowledge i've been acquiring, i was interested to find out what the followers of the mormon religion knew about the churches history.
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joe134cd
ShirleyW=I think although the issues of credibility the two organizations face are different, they are in essence the same. With regards to doctrinal flip flopping.
http://www.concernedchristians.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=298&Itemid=14
I also believe that the evidence to disprove the Book of Mormon is more substantial and concret. Sure watchtower has had flip flops but they have been that just flip flops. Explained away by new light, greater understanding, human imperfection etc. For instance did christ take up kingship in 1914. I'm buggard if I know and since God ain't saying anything I can't say for sure. We could argue both ways. Where as the with the Book of Mormon and the ideas of smith received under Devine inspiration by heavenly farther can be proven to be false with hard physical evidence. For instance we now know that people don't live on the sun and moon. The physical evidence of the kinderhook plates, and the book of Abraham ( pearls of great price) has clearly shown that Smith had no idea of translation. I think the most damning of all is the physical evidence from mitochondrial DNA which shows the ancient Americans immigrated from North Eastern Asia. For Gods sake you have just got to look at the American indians to see they have no physical charistics of the Jews. When I sort of look into the history of smith and some of his ideas I can't help but think of him as been a charismatic lyer who ended up believing his own lies. I think both religions developed out of the times they lived in. For instance at the time of smith there was speculation about the lost tribes and the American Indian roots. I guess the Book of Mormon was an answer to this. Then a few decades later with the Adventist movement of which the JWs and SDAs developed from. Both Russell and Smith were not immune to a few shady business dealings- perhaps more so with smith.
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2014 Watchtower Publisher Statistics
by jwfacts inthe 2014 grand totals page has been released onto facebook.. .
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i have started updating the statistics and graphs at jwfacts.com/watchtower/statistics.php, and will release highlights as i work through it during the rest of the day..
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joe134cd
I live in a first world country. In around the time I walked out the door (in a congregation of 100 pubs) there were 6 people who walked and 3 more disfellowshipped. 4 of those 6 were a family of converts (good steady people I might add, and they will probably never return). Since I have left I have heard of 1 other who no longer goes plus another 3 who more or less are also inactive. So you could say with in the space of about 2 years they have lost nearly 10% of the congregation. As far as I know the 3 that were disfellowshiped have since returned and I am not aware of any new converts or people moving in. -
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joe134cd
Smiddy= You made an interesting point there about been gullible.i remember when I became aware of the KH sign over scam. At the time I wanted to find out if it had happened to the Hall I went to. So I phoned the PO to find out. His reply was "yeah there was something like that but I really didn't want to get involved in it." After I hung up the phone I thought you total f/wit have you got any idea of just what you're done because of not wanting to get to involved. The guy really had no idea. -
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I questioned some Mormons today
by joe134cd inas a result of my fading from the jw religion, i have taken an interest in the mormon religion.
personally i think mormonisim is a bigger con than the jw religion.
with all knowledge i've been acquiring, i was interested to find out what the followers of the mormon religion knew about the churches history.
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joe134cd
As a result of my fading from the JW religion, I have taken an interest in the Mormon religion. Personally I think mormonisim is a bigger con than the JW religion. With all knowledge I've been acquiring, I was interested to find out what the followers of the Mormon religion knew about the churches history. So I stopped some Mormon missionaries on the street. I have to say I was quite surprised about what the knew of the churches past and the colourful nature of its founder. I told them about been a JW, and to my surprise found the two religions very similar although theologically quite different. After we finished the conversation I couldn't help but think how more open and transparent they are.
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joe134cd
The thing I can't work out is they are getting all this money from the sell off of Mill Hill in London. Building some where significantly cheaper and are still begging for money. They must be awash with cash at the moment. Where has it gone and what's it been used for. I'm surprised more arnt questioning this. -
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Hi! Long time lurker finally signing up!
by LosingMyReligion inok, so the time has finally come to register an account on this site.
not that i think i have much to contribute to the discussions here, but more out of a desire to show that yet another person has learned ttatt.
i am a fader, not discussing ttatt with anyone as i know the inevitable outcome it would have.
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joe134cd
Your comment reminded me of a you tube clip I saw with regards to ex-mormons. One of the protesters had on his sign "google will set you free". How true those comments are.