Wow Norm!!! EXCELLENT!!!!
I just had to quote one of the JW's giving his testimony here:
--------------------------
Mr Toole—
I guess so, and I guess it is the same thing—you will disagree but yet you are the best of friends. That is the view we take. The fact that people do not necessarily share our particular understanding and they think, ‘Oh no, that is the not the way I want to
believe it,’ is fine. We are really trying to educate people and teach tolerance. That really is
getting at the very root cause of the problem. It is fanaticism that causes some of these
problems, where people have a singular view that their way is right and woe betide anybody
who disagrees with it. It gets to the stage, when you start having that elevated to a level of
government, where you have a very dangerous situation because then you are only one step
away from totalitarianism, where you have people in high places deciding what you can and
cannot believe on a whole host of things.
Or another quote, that hit's kinda home:
CHAIR—So if, for argument’s sake—heaven forbid—a terrorist bomb exploded and this building crumbled and we were all killed, there are people in this room who are Catholics, there are yourselves and there are those who have no faith at all. That is on the public record this morning. After the initial trauma and so on, it is likely there would be a memorial service. Would you join with other religions or churches in a joint memorial service for those who perished in this terrible tragedy or would you stand aside from that and have your
own totally separate service? I think this is what Senator Harradine was getting at.
Mr MacLean—We will take an example of what happened with that terrible train crash in Britain. Individuals certainly have a feeling of compassion and concern for those people who perished and we certainly want them to be remembered by God, as well as, naturally,
by their loved ones and so on. That would be an individual matter of choice. Some individuals from our people may want to go along and express condolences, and even say a prayer on behalf of those people that they might be remembered by God.
CHAIR—There were multidenominational commemorative services there.
Mr MacLean—Yes.
CHAIR—You are saying that your church as an organisation would not officially participate in that?
Mr MacLean—As an organisation we would probably not be there, no, but individuals have that right.
And yet a third quote:
Senator PAYNE—I have read in a number of the submissions a reference to voting. Do members of the church not vote?
Mr MacLean—No. We do not take sides politically; we avoid that. We maintain a neutral stand in regard to those things.
Senator SCHACHT—You do not vote?
Senator PAYNE—That is what he said.
Mr MacLean—No. We take advantage of the laws in each of the states in this country which allow people who have conscientious religious feelings not to vote if they wish not to.
Mr HOLLIS—Don’t you feel that you have a moral responsibility to vote?
Mr MacLean—I will just make this point: please do not feel that because we do not vote that we do not believe in order and the law and the support of Caesar, as the Bible terms it. We have a moral obligation to be strictly obedient to the law of the land. We support it and we believe it is correct to do that. We have a God-given right to do it and we should do it. But as far as supporting one party against another, we have never done that.
Mr HOLLIS—It is an interesting point and I do not want to labour it, but many people would argue that thousands of people in Timor lost their lives because they took advantage of their democratic right to vote. But I do not want to pursue that.
Mr Toole—In answer to that question—just so that you get a bit more of an overall picture—the world over we do not vote. We are neutral politically the world over.
Mr HOLLIS—We do not accept that, but that is—
Mr Toole—No, I am not asking you to, but of course it is nice that we can share those differences at the table. That is what we are all about. On the other hand, we do not go to war either. Hitler tried to get people to say, ‘Heil, Hitler.’ As far as religious organisations
were concerned, we were basically the only religion in the whole of Germany that stood its ground. He put our members in concentration camps, tried to exterminate us, and thousands lost their lives, but they would not compromise because they felt that killing people was
incompatible with being a Christian. The world over we are endeavouring to be neutral. To take Mr MacLean’s comment just a little further, we do conscientiously do what all governments would like their citizens to do—we pay their taxes and obey their laws.
There is one exception: if the government asks us to do something that we feel God has commanded us not to do, or vice versa, then we feel we have a prior obligation to obey God. That is the only limit on our obedience to governments. If all subjects of Australia, for
example, took that view it would be a very obedient country.
Senator PAYNE—We would possibly be out of a job.
Mr HOLLIS—Or it could go the other way. You make much of obeying the laws of the country, but it often is because of the laws of the country that people vote. If everyone decided not to vote, you may get laws in the country that you may have a little bit more
difficulty invoking. I personally think it is a bit of a cop-out when people use these arguments about not voting.
CHAIR—We are now into subjective judgment. We have asked the question and we have got the response, which is what we needed.
----------------------------------
Very interesting indeed...
I particularily like the "There is one exception: if the government asks us to do something that we feel God has commanded us not to do, or vice versa, then we feel we have a prior obligation to obey God. That is the only limit on our obedience to governments." quote....
I guess they felt god had commanded them to be present at this very political meeting expressing their views (basically, ehh, lobbying for their view).. God likes lobbiests.. Who would have thunk?