Posts by Rattigan350

17

Self control fruits of the spirit. Fat GB seem to lack it

by JohnR1975 in

fruits of the spirit would surely be required to be gb members?

yet some of them seem to lack self control when it comes to eating.

br herd, mark sanderson and br jackson in these are all very obese.. if they travel to poor places wearing their rolex watches and gold pinky rings the brothers there will surely wonder why they are so fat.. there are many scriptures talking about not being greedy and not gluttonous for food.. if they were really chosen by god as his channel on earth then why can’t they show the fruits of the spirit and show self control when it comes to being gluttonous?.

Rattigan350

Seabreeze - The Governing body members are not the leaders of the Jehovah's Witnesses. Jesus is the leader. The GB are just overseers of the worldwide congregation.

Why do people focus on these men so much?

23

Question for JW's: Is Jesus the Mediator of Your Prayers ?

by Sea Breeze in

praying to god “through the son jesus” has nothing to do with christ as mediator.. do jw's even know what a mediator does?.

i am in the insurance restoration construction business and have been in mediation many times when a policy holder sues an insurance company for not paying everything they believe is due them under the terms of their policy for property damage.. i am brought in as a technical expert.. in mediation, the plaintiff (policy holder) and the defendant (insurance company) are placed in separate rooms, they do not talk to each other.

they are separated because the dispute has alienated the one from the other.

Rattigan350

"speak directly to Jesus as did Stephen and John."

Stephen and John saw Jesus in visions. I doubt you do.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with the teaching that Jesus is the mediator of the new covenant for the anointed 144,000 only. The problem is when people say 'Jesus is not your mediator' and they leave it a general statement. As HerIam60 said "the one mediator between God and men who gave himself a ransom for all."

He mediates for all through his priestly duties.

He mediates the new covenant for the anointed only.

Why is it that people don't understand how he does both differently? I've explained it but the problem is that people just want to put themselves into the new covenant. But God does the electing, not your hopes.

23

Question for JW's: Is Jesus the Mediator of Your Prayers ?

by Sea Breeze in

praying to god “through the son jesus” has nothing to do with christ as mediator.. do jw's even know what a mediator does?.

i am in the insurance restoration construction business and have been in mediation many times when a policy holder sues an insurance company for not paying everything they believe is due them under the terms of their policy for property damage.. i am brought in as a technical expert.. in mediation, the plaintiff (policy holder) and the defendant (insurance company) are placed in separate rooms, they do not talk to each other.

they are separated because the dispute has alienated the one from the other.

Rattigan350

" Scriptures says: "There is ONE mediator between God and men, a man Christ Jesus". NO, scripture didn't say that. Paul said that. While what Paul wrote, was written, it is not scripture. It is what Paul wrote to his readers. His use of the word 'mediator' there was not in relation to a covenant. He was just referring to how Jesus was between Jehovah God and humanity in the general sense.

Heb 9:15 & 12:24 was specifically about the new covenant.

"1. There are zero NT scriptures that explain how a person can get their sins forgiven OUTSIDE the new covenant."

There is nothing that says that the new covenant even is for the forgiveness of sins. The blood of Jesus is what forgives sins, not the covenant. Matt 26:28 does not imply that the covenant does that. "for this means my ‘blood of the covenant,’ which is to be poured out in behalf of many for forgiveness of sins". His blood will be poured out for the forgiveness of sins. The shed blood seals the covenant, but that does not forgive sins, it is the atonement that does that.

You have to understand that those who wrote the New Testament letters, didn't have full understanding and they wrote to their audience who were in the new covenant. 1 Pet 1:18,19 "For you know that it was not with corruptible things, with silver or gold, that you were set free from your futile way of life handed down to you by your forefathers. But it was with precious blood, like that of an unblemished and spotless lamb, that of Christ"
The apostles didn't know everything as they didn't have the Revelation. Rev 21:7 "Anyone conquering will inherit these things, and I will be his God and he will be my son."
Rev 22:3 "And there will no longer be any curse."
Those apply to humans alive during and after the 1000 years who will not be in the new covenant.

"3. The message of the Apostles and the Christian church is to be reconciled with God (2 Cor. 5: 18-19) Once you are reconciled to God, you are justified, meaning you have no sin debt."

Except they still had sin in them otherwise they would not have died. God reconciled sinful humans to himself through Jesus. That just for how Jehovah will view humans like Is 1:18 "“Though your sins are like scarlet, They will be made as white as snow;". It hadn't fixed anything yet.

"4. The two-tier Salvation WT tries to sell was unknown to the apostles."

Of course it was unknown to the apostles and to Jesus. None of them had the Revelation yet. That's what the critics don't understand. Jesus and the apostles weren't all knowing. Even some of their teachings were changed in the Revelation. Jesus knew that some would be raised to heaven to serve with him. "the house of my Father are many dwelling places." But he may have thought it was only a few as in his apostles. But he didn't know the number 144,000 until the Revelation was given. The apostles never knew that. It was open ended to their teachings.

"5. If anyone preaches a different message than the apostles, they are twice cursed. (See Gal. 1: 8-9)"

Wow. If the Governing body said that you would be all over them. But the apostles said that and you eat it up. Reread my answer to #4. They didn't know everything so we don't want to stick to the old light of the apostles.

Also read the context. Gal 1:6 "I am amazed that you are so quickly turning away from the One who called you with Christ’s undeserved kindness to another sort of good news". So they were called to the good news and then quickly turned to another. He doesn't say what that is. "there are certain ones who are causing you trouble and wanting to distort the good news about the Christ." He doesn't say how it is distorted. Most likely saying that Jesus is God. "Even if we or an angel out of heaven were to declare to you as good news something beyond the good news we declared to you, let him be accursed." Hmmm. So who is the "we"? Just Paul's little group? The apostles as a whole? The angel out of heaven is the one that conveyed the Revelation to John. Is Paul cursing that angel that gave the Revelation? Paul is saying that he is above and beyond God's further word. What Paul wrote here is too vague for us and it was written to his audience there.

"6. Once we are justified, we have peace with God and are saved from his wrath (Romans 5: 1& 9)"

Who is this we? It is his audience Rom 1:7 "to all those who are in Rome as God’s beloved ones, called to be holy ones". Revelation doesn't agree with your statement there. His wrath goes on many that thought they were saved.

"7. Salvation is available to "whosoever" not limited. (John 3: 16, Acts 2: 21, Luke 112: 8, Romans 10: 13)" Salvation is not heaven only. Heaven is available for the 144,000 only . But the rest of humanity will either live through the great tribulation or be resurrected to live in it for the 1000 years.

"8. Jesus 3 times told Nicodemus that a person MUST be born again. When we are born again we get a new spirit, one that is sinless and can then fellowship with God." You contradicted yourself here. Jesus told Nicodemus, not you or anyone else today.

Since Jesus told Nicodemus that it must refer to something true about him. What was true about him and those like him? They were born into a covenant, the Law covenant. And they need to be born into another covenant, the new one. Thus the being born again. They needed to be born of water (baptism) and spirit (anointed by holy spirit). That was them, not us.

"The Watchtower denies every one of these points related to Salvation." No, you just want to apply everything to you without considering context.

23

Question for JW's: Is Jesus the Mediator of Your Prayers ?

by Sea Breeze in

praying to god “through the son jesus” has nothing to do with christ as mediator.. do jw's even know what a mediator does?.

i am in the insurance restoration construction business and have been in mediation many times when a policy holder sues an insurance company for not paying everything they believe is due them under the terms of their policy for property damage.. i am brought in as a technical expert.. in mediation, the plaintiff (policy holder) and the defendant (insurance company) are placed in separate rooms, they do not talk to each other.

they are separated because the dispute has alienated the one from the other.

Rattigan350

Sea Breeze - LISTEN

PRAYERS HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH MEDIATOR OF THE NEW COVENANT. NOTHING TO DO WITH COVENANTS.

I'll explain this to you.

Rev 5:8 specifically says "The incense means the prayers of the holy ones"

There was Moses. He was the mediator of the Law, or old covenant with Israel. The covenant mediator did not offer incense or sacrifices.

There was Aaron. He was the high priest. The priest offered incense and sacrifices, not the covenant mediator.

There was/is Jesus. He was the mediator of the new covenant with spiritual Israel.

There was/is Jesus. He was the high priest that offered sacrifices and is the one that descrambles our prayers to his Father, Jehovah God. Our prayers are like scrambled TV signals that need a descrambler to view them. That is why Jesus said 'I am the way, truth and life, no one comes to the Father except through me'

Praying in Jesus' name descrambles our prayers so God can accept them.

So you see, Jesus does both jobs. That of Moses and of Aaron, but they are two separate things. You are mixing them when they shouldn't be mixed just because he does them both.

23

Question for JW's: Is Jesus the Mediator of Your Prayers ?

by Sea Breeze in

praying to god “through the son jesus” has nothing to do with christ as mediator.. do jw's even know what a mediator does?.

i am in the insurance restoration construction business and have been in mediation many times when a policy holder sues an insurance company for not paying everything they believe is due them under the terms of their policy for property damage.. i am brought in as a technical expert.. in mediation, the plaintiff (policy holder) and the defendant (insurance company) are placed in separate rooms, they do not talk to each other.

they are separated because the dispute has alienated the one from the other.

Rattigan350

Beth Sarim said "John 6: 53 clearly says if you dont eat the bread or drink the wine,,, you have no life in you."

And that only applied to the ones to whom he spoke. Why do people keep expanding and applying what Jesus and the apostles said beyond their audiences?

23

Question for JW's: Is Jesus the Mediator of Your Prayers ?

by Sea Breeze in

praying to god “through the son jesus” has nothing to do with christ as mediator.. do jw's even know what a mediator does?.

i am in the insurance restoration construction business and have been in mediation many times when a policy holder sues an insurance company for not paying everything they believe is due them under the terms of their policy for property damage.. i am brought in as a technical expert.. in mediation, the plaintiff (policy holder) and the defendant (insurance company) are placed in separate rooms, they do not talk to each other.

they are separated because the dispute has alienated the one from the other.

Rattigan350

Jesus is the priest. Priests offered incense. Prayers are likened to incense offered. Thus Jesus is the priest that offers prayers or mediates prayers for us.

So Seabreeze, rethink your objections. This has nothing to do with the new covenant.

16

New Light!

by blondie in

jw
friends

.

Rattigan350

Since there is no such thing as a Watchtower prediction or promise...

The only problem with the doctrines are in the past, during the Rutherford, Knorr and Franz days, they wanted to be better and more righteous than everyone else. That is why they made no birthdays into a religious issue. That is why they were pharisaical on many issues without any direct Bible prohibitions such as no-blood. They say we go out in the door to door work because that is what Jesus did. Well, Jesus had no other alternative.

13

Did the WT Policy on Lying Bother You When You Were a JW?

by Sea Breeze in

here's the wt standard for lying: "while malicious lying is definitely condemned in the bible, this does not mean that a person is under obligation to divulge truthful information to people who are not entitled to it" - insight pp.

244-245. vs. websters dictionary:.

lie, noun.

Rattigan350

And the problem with this is what?

94

Jephthah's Daughter

by cantleave in

i have read somewhere that jephthah's daughter did not really go into temple service but was a victim of ritual sacrifice.

the bible says that after weeping over her virginity that the maidens would visit her annually.

how could they visit her if she was killed?.

Rattigan350

Peacefulpete, You took those out of context

"A human sacrifice for good of a community thru appeasement of a god? (John 18:14 "...it would be good if one man died for the people.""

Caiaphas said that as a justification to kill Jesus.

"How about a god sending his people to war where many are killed? (Judges 20)"

Those are not human sacrifices. That is just how war works. The enemy gets killed.

"Are they not human sacrifices to please a god?"

Not by God's people.

"Or the burning alive members of the tribe that behave in unapproved manner?"

Only by dragon riders.

94

Jephthah's Daughter

by cantleave in

i have read somewhere that jephthah's daughter did not really go into temple service but was a victim of ritual sacrifice.

the bible says that after weeping over her virginity that the maidens would visit her annually.

how could they visit her if she was killed?.

Rattigan350

"Is Jehovah ridiculous for asking Abraham to burn Issac? And is Abraham ridiculous for trying to do it?"

Why would people question Abraham's ATTEMPT at sacrificing Isaac when it was not meant to go through to completion. It was a test of faith.

Gen 22:2 "Take, please, your son, your only son whom you so love, Isaac, and travel to the land of Mo·riʹah and offer him up there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains that I will designate to you.”"

vs 8 "To this Abraham said: “God himself will provide the sheep for the burnt offering, my son"

vs 10 "Then Abraham reached out his hand and took the knife to kill his son."

vs 11 "But Jehovah’s angel called to him from the heavens and said: “Abraham, Abraham!” to which he answered: “Here I am!”   Then he said: “Do not harm the boy, and do not do anything at all to him, for now I do know that you are God-fearing because you have not withheld your son, your only one, from me"

See. It was a test and Abraham passed it and it was never meant to hurt him.

Jephthah was the one that made the vow. He would not kill and burn another human from his household. So Jehovah would not want him to kill and sacrifice another human.

The problem is that people read the words in the Bible, though badly written and reading not from the writer's perspective, in a vacuum and take it without considering other texts.