Indeed @stuckinarut2. Unlike Elders, who would have a mandatory reassessment of their qualificatons if even one of their children rebelled, God is not accountable or subject to scrutiny.
doubtfull1799
JoinedPosts by doubtfull1799
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Today's Text: Proof that God does not abide by His own principles...
by doubtfull1799 in"do not withhold good from those to whom you should give it if it is within your power.
- prov 3:27".
by the common christian definition of god, everything is within his power.
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Today's Text: Proof that God does not abide by His own principles...
by doubtfull1799 in"do not withhold good from those to whom you should give it if it is within your power.
- prov 3:27".
by the common christian definition of god, everything is within his power.
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doubtfull1799
"Do not withhold good from those to whom you should give it if it is within your power. - Prov 3:27"
By the common Christian definition of God, EVERYTHING is within His power.
Every explanation of God's permission of evil (including the JW one) without intervention, seems to ignore this basic scriptural tenant?
Remember the illustration used that God's permission of evil was similar to allowing a child to have a painful operation to fix a broke bone? So, OK, you might have to have the operation for the long term benefit of the child, but do you cease to do good and make it as painless as possible? Would you withhold from the child anaesthetic? Would you deny them painkillers. etc?
Even if JW doctrine on the universal issue was correct, is there really any reason why God couldn't help out and do good in the meantime, give us a cure for cancer for instance? If it is in His power to do that, would it make any difference in settling the issue as to whether man can rule himself? The test (according to the doctrine) is about sovereignty, not medical knowledge! So if providing the knowledge doesn't violate the issue, and God is withholding this good from us in this way, he is acting immortally by His own standard as stated in the daily text...
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Using violence to end violence?
by stuckinarut2 init really is mind blowing when we think about it : witnesses have no problem with a deity who will use violence in order to end violence?!?!.
armageddon will be gods war to kill billions of people...because it shows his love?.
thoughts?.
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doubtfull1799
You'll Be Back lyrics - From the Musical "Hamilton"
(This is King George singing to the American Colonies)
You say the price of my love is price you're not willing to pay
You cry in the tea which you hurled in the sea as you see me go by
Why so sad?
Remember we made an arrangement when you went away
Now you're making me mad.
Remember despite our estrangement, I'm your man
You'll be back
Soon you'll see
You'll remember you belong to me
You'll be back
Time will tell
You'll remember that I served you well
Oceans rise, empire fall
We have seen each other through it all
And when push comes to shove
I will send a fully armed battalion to remind you of my loveYou'll be back
Like before
I'll fight the fight and win the war
For your love
For your grace
And I'll love you til my dying days
When you're gone, I'll go mad
So don't throw away this thing we had
Cause when push comes to shove
I will kill your friends and family to remind you of my love -
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I took a Watchtower Rag !
by Phizzy ini accepted a wt mag/rag from a bro i have known for decades just to be polite.
i asked him if he would like my comments on it sometime, he said he would listen, (yea maybe he will hear, but not really listen and absorb what i have to say.).
the interesting thing is, they are getting better, the borg,there was only one "half quote" where they select what they want from a source, and ignore the rest of what the source says.. and only one blatant lie.. it was the mag about the 4 horsemen, and a supplementary article makes the false claim that " archaeology repeatedly supports the bible's historical accuracy".. this is typical jw borg propaganda speak.
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doubtfull1799
Good pick-up on that blatant lie about archaeology @Phizzy
How brilliant to just completely ignore the mountains of archaeological evidence that died not support the Bible!
I also love the quote about how there are 50 people mentioned in the Bible that have been confirmed to exist by archaeology - shame it is none of the main important characters like Abraham, Jacob, Moses, David, Solomon, Jesus etc etc
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This really does not end well for God.
by pleaseresearch into say this whole creation thing has been or will be a success at the end is absurd.
not only did one third of the angels jump ship to satans side.
but adam and eve screwed up so quickly.
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doubtfull1799
Good post @pleaseresearch
You have no idea of what lay behind the war in heaven, as it's called. You also have little understanding of the fall of man and if Adam and Eve "screwed up" as you say. How do you know they screwed up?
How do you know He did not intend for man to fall?
Did God fully intend for man to remain in an ignorant state forever?Respectfully @Cold Steel, you really don't know the answers to these questions anymore than the OP does! Your comments are just as speculative since God in His wisdom did not see fit to enlighten any of us by means of the Bible as to what his thinking was. It is mere human apologetics. May I suggest the following book for anyone interested in a thorough, well-informed, academic discussion of apologetics:
https://www.amazon.com/How-Defend-Christian-Faith-Atheist/dp/163431056X
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"would you drink a glass of water if it had just a tiny bit of poison in it?"
by stuckinarut2 inno doubt we have all heard that well used "illustration" in public talks etc over the years:.
"if you were handed a glass of water that looked pure, but were told it has just a tiny drop of poison in it, would you drink it?".
the society has used that illustration at length to say we should avoid all influences of every part of the world.. but, as we know, the society has had a track record of errors, false ideas and doctrines.
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doubtfull1799
@Nathan Natas - Interestingly, the JW predilection for pseudo-scientific alternative medicine was one of the things that woke me up. I figured if MOST witnesses are willing to believe in that nonsense, perhaps their religious beliefs are also nonsense...
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Hank's Witnesses
by doubtfull1799 injust had to share this - it was posted on reddit.
a brilliant and entertaining debunking of theism.. https://youtu.be/6x-lw9pc6ie.
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doubtfull1799
Just had to share this - it was posted on reddit. A brilliant and entertaining debunking of Theism.
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Let's all play a game! What does this passage of the Bible tell us about Jehovah?
by stuckinarut2 inlets play a fun game?.
we all know that as witnesses, we were constantly told to read the bible, and ask ourselves what the passage we read reveals about god.. as an example, here is a wt that highlights this.. may 2016 wt study edition "benefit fully from jehovah's provisions".
8 ask questions.
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doubtfull1799
So I got about 4:30 in and Daniel C Peterson starts out with the best of counter arguments - to attack Dawkins and/or Hitchens' MOTIVES! I hope it improves from there!
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Let's all play a game! What does this passage of the Bible tell us about Jehovah?
by stuckinarut2 inlets play a fun game?.
we all know that as witnesses, we were constantly told to read the bible, and ask ourselves what the passage we read reveals about god.. as an example, here is a wt that highlights this.. may 2016 wt study edition "benefit fully from jehovah's provisions".
8 ask questions.
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doubtfull1799
I would respectfully disagree with you @Cold Steel.
I HAVE taken courses in OT theology and it doesn't change the fact that God did not always warn people before destroying or king them - remember Uzzah for example? 2 Sam 6:7. And how exactly were the tribes that the Israelites conquered warned by God? He did not speak to them did he, he only prophesied to or warned the Israelites.
You say you have no problem with God destroying people who practised forced prostitution, but it was God himself that condoned such practices. How do you account for the Israelites being instructed by him to take the virgins for themselves as spoils of war? For what purpose other than rape would this be for. Legitimised by forced marriage. Do you really think that a young girl would willingly marry and have sex with a soldier that just slaughtered her whole family in front of her eyes?
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Crossing the Elders
by Cold Steel infew things draw my interest as much as people on this board who talk about the elders, the insidious little toadies who lurk around kingdom halls, the proverbial big fish in little ponds.
it amazes me the terror and the veneration they inspire, as well as the occasional ridicule.
it makes me wonder how they're selected and whether most of them come into the position with a sense of power, entitlement, authority and control, or whether many of them are pretty nice people and that i'm just hearing about the bad apples?
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doubtfull1799
I served as an Elder for many years in a number of congregations so I can answer your questions (from my own experience anyway).
I accepted the position with a genuine desire to teach, help, and care for others. I've worked with many other humble elders who worked hard to do the same without any sense of entitlement, control or power. However I also worked with some others who did act as masters over others and enjoyed a sense of "control" over people. And some who were very bad apples. So I guess its a mixed bag, though in my experience there were more of the former than the latter.
Elders are certainly not above or immune to counsel, only they usually would receive counsel from fellow elders. Though I was certainly on occasions "counselled" (and accepted the counsel) by rank and file members (including sisters).
My relationships with friends did not on the whole change when I was appointed, though some who are not close friends certainly look at you or treat you a bit differently. Some show more respect, others just hate all elders (perhaps because of a bad experience with the bad eggs) so they treated you worse!
Elders report to each other and to the branch office (usually via the Circuit Overseer, but sometimes via direct letter). An anointed member, if they were a sister or a non-appointed brother, would still be subject tot he authority of the Elders.
The anointed ones are no longer members of the F&DS - this was a recent change of doctrine (in 2013 I think), only the GB are now the F&DS.
Elders are called "Brother" not "Elder so and so". Elder is not used as a title... well not in the sense of a descriptive title when referring to an individual. It IS a title describing the position.
Hope that helps?