Posts by TheWonderofYou

19

For those of you "not baptised" and too afraid to front the RC. WT is hoping you won't come forward.

by umbertoecho in

hello to those following what is going in australia with our royal commission.. i want to let all those abused, neglected, shunned and blamed that i understand why you may not front the rc.

the wtbts is hoping you will consider yourself an invalid complainant, because you are not or were not.....baptised.

if you were abused at a young age and you told on your dad or the bad man that did it.......you would have been taken aside by the overseer and read scriptures about lying and being immoral; even if you didn't know what that word meant.

TheWonderofYou

Your story really deeply touches my heart.

189

How much was Christ's ransom sacrifice? Equal to Adam?

by jonathan dough in

how much was the ransom?

gods justice did not require an exact equivalent man-for-man sacrifice between the first adam and jesus, the second adam.

gods gift required more.

TheWonderofYou

@CalebInFloroda,
I am interested in learning ..thats everything. If my comments are useful to strenghten your faith I would be honoured, although my knowledge is about is little compared to you. Im mainly fascinated about the fact how much material is available even in free googlebooks and theological essays in internet. And i like to share a perhaps useful explanation of a certain word and apprecitate your jewish view.
I think that I am implanted in the jewish olivetree, how this works together with covenant-theology is a unsolved mystery.

ad sacrifice
Were the animal and other sacrifices than social and spiritual communion.( korban = coming close to God).

Is it true that the sacrivices according to Leviticus "demonstrated" the might of the sin, by putting the guilt on stage the guilt had consequence for the representative medium, so that the wrongdoer was released of the guilt. Than the victim/sacrifcie was no price in anyway that was to be paid ("like in the corresponding ransom idea) but a medium to make aware of the reality of sin.

189

How much was Christ's ransom sacrifice? Equal to Adam?

by jonathan dough in

how much was the ransom?

gods justice did not require an exact equivalent man-for-man sacrifice between the first adam and jesus, the second adam.

gods gift required more.

TheWonderofYou

@CalebinFloroda

I grew up with catolic shool education, with 16 I was baptized as JW, about 24 I left. Now am 49. with 18 I bought an expensice encyclopedia of a catolic university, a comparison of theological terms of Jewish faith, christian faith and muslim faith to get a better picture of the biblical terms. It was complicated to read, the language ist scientifical, but it lead me to the conlusion that JW have false picture of the church. Issues like blood and sacrificies seemed important for me.

Many years I didnt read religious literature at all because my wife didnt allow me to read, out of fear that I am going back to the witnesses. I married catolic, returned to the church. Nobody of my collegaues of my actual friens knows that I have ever been a witness. Even my daughter doesnt knows of it. About 2000 I got a Bible as christmans present of my daughter. And i liked the comments therein. About 2005 I found some theological book of pope benedikt in a church for free and read it, than I visited a church which functions as central catolic mission basis in my country and i began to read and like to booklets. How much simplier than JW-faith I thought, And now I can say that for each question, were the JW right or not, I found an answer in the catolic mission books for me personally.

This is the reason no why I would like so much to share my discoveries about sacrifice, ransom, redemption, sin, guilt,... all these complitaed old words, sometimes like labyrinth withouth not way out. sometimes I said, I dont wanna hear those theories anymore. But now I am happy that I didnt give up. I am a couch theologian and I wished I had a professional eduation, theological and biblical earlier.

I am trying to put all things togehter and get a picture that is my image of god now.
and I hope that I am not boring anyone with my sometimes complicated insights.

But I think that escpially for ex-jw we should be well informed about terms like:

ransom, sin, sacrifice, redemption.... shouldnt we?

As Paul said:

"To the Jews I became as a Jew, so that I might win Jews; to those who are under the Law, as under the Law though not being myself under the Law, so that I might win those who are under the Law; 21to those who are without law, as without law, though not being without the law of God but under the law of Christ, so that I might win those who are without law."

Wasnt that our motivation as JW? Why did we then not study the jewish religion, why dont we know what HaShem means, why cant we talk with a catolic about the meaning of the ten commandments, because JW dont learn anything really deepgoing about other religions.

The Awake said "in the preaching work we learn about other cultures and to have respect of other religions", while the Watchtower at the same time condemns the other religions as Babylon that is only awaiting the final innihilation, the clerks would be the first feeling the hand of the UN-lead forces innihilating them.

That is no respect of other religions and so they will never learn anything about other religions, how can you help someone without knowing the other religion better than mentioning: they have the trinity, they are supporting war, they bless weapons, they adore Mary that is idolatry, they have pagan tradition, christmas, easter. They dont need to know more?

If you would like to discuss the terms, ransom, sacrifice further with me, I would be glad.

Latest institutional response

by TheWonderofYou in

whaaaat di-di-did they say there in australia?.

"you look old now".. "oh only because i am a old institution dinosaur, but they respect me either, dont they?.

TheWonderofYou

Whaaaat di-di-did they say there in Australia?

"You look old now".

"Oh only because I am a old institution dinosaur, but they respect me either, dont they?

221

Day 4 Looks to Be Live at Any Moment - Link...and Upcoming Witness List!

by LostGeneration in

https://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/case-study/636f01a5-50db-4b59-a35e-a24ae07fb0ad/case-study-29,-july-2015,-sydney.

anyone know who this monty baker is?

i'm sure this guy will be able to tell the rc how things work behind the scenes without all the evasiveness, being that he is an "apostate".

TheWonderofYou

Can you give more details about the connections between tricky lawyer arguments about....or write s spevial thread.

..theliterature is openly writing about how handle abuse cased, elder book

But we cannot talk about abuse in the congregation, not warn, bevause th JC is about pastoral secrecy., we cant give info to the public and to police because it is pastoral secrecy

judicial is public,pastoral not? AND effect for victims?

is it a pastoral committee or a judicial committee

Th judicisl system wil

.

189

How much was Christ's ransom sacrifice? Equal to Adam?

by jonathan dough in

how much was the ransom?

gods justice did not require an exact equivalent man-for-man sacrifice between the first adam and jesus, the second adam.

gods gift required more.

TheWonderofYou

@CalebinFloroda, kind regards.

Your scripture passages of Ezekiel emphazise that sin is a dsturbance of the connection between man and god, and that god is ready to forgive a repented sinner.

But its a fact too that jews knew sacrificies for sins. I cant explain yet why the jews had sacrificies in the temple at all? Was that an optional ritual? Animal were killed although the prophets said it was useless? Of some sacrifice was said that they would atone sins of the highpriest and of the people ..oxen.., the asasel was not killed but sent to the desert with the sins that were not atoned, the lamb was a daily sacrifice for sin at the morning whorship in the temple called Tamid sacrifice, we have the pesach passah lamb which was slaughtered and sacrified once a year for blessing and welfare. At Jom kippur the highpriest spelled the divine name but not after s sacrifice and after one person forgave its next.

So ...was not the jewish religion and its pictures actually the basis for applicstion of "sacrifice"pictures unto jesus?

what was the addional sense of the sacrificies a the temple, if a sin was forgiven bx god directly

only for discussion, to come further thx.

34

If Disfellowshipping pedophiles protects the congregation, what does it do for "Those Outside" they are expelled to?

by Wasanelder Once in

we all know the wt basis for disfellowshipping, (1 corinthians 5:9-13) 9 12 for what do i have to do with judging those outside?

do you not judge those inside, 13 while god judges those outside?

remove the wicked [man] from among yourselves.. if removing "the man" is a protection for the congregation and no police are called, what does it say about the witnesses view of the world?

TheWonderofYou

As citizen everybody has a liabilty to protect others from harm.

That is called civil courage, moral courage.
The elders have to protect others for the collective good.

50

Will Child Abuse Issue Keep Growing Like A Forest Fire?

by OnTheWayOut in

i don't know if a commercial will come up and i can't find this on youtube as it is probably copyright material or i am just not in a good search pattern today.

anyway, try to view this if you haven't seen it:.

https://rutube.ru/video/0ba7a3ee7e89dbbc730c4af32032e33b/?ref=logo .

TheWonderofYou

Another case study idea:

A victim 13 y girl calls the police and tells about what happend and says.

"I am a 13 y and i am a JW. My daddy kisses me and touches me."

The police asks: "are you a JW?" If the girl mentions the JW, the police sends instantly the "JW crisis intervention team" to the girl. So the police works together with the JW desaster team. This would be adquate help by the police.

The ACCC the concentration camp for JW abusers is a therapy center together with a jail-like facility, if a locking away would be the right help at all. There are therapies especially for JW who have a special needs after becoming abusers. So they are not together with the worldly criminals but have a spiritual paradise within this camp. The costs for the institution are carried by the Body.

50

Will Child Abuse Issue Keep Growing Like A Forest Fire?

by OnTheWayOut in

i don't know if a commercial will come up and i can't find this on youtube as it is probably copyright material or i am just not in a good search pattern today.

anyway, try to view this if you haven't seen it:.

https://rutube.ru/video/0ba7a3ee7e89dbbc730c4af32032e33b/?ref=logo .

TheWonderofYou

Permanent abuse commission (handling the abusers)

This commission is permanently tracing the abusers and watching their progresses, also to help them fighting against their bad behaviour in cases where that is possible.

There are thousand of victims and thousands of abusers/pedophiles.
It will be a very very diffiult job to work with them. but if they go to the jail too to find criminals to convert, they should be able to help those ill people too and make separate congregations in camps or recovery centers.

The permant abusers commission shall work togehter with police.

Trained sisters or brothers who are policemen, shall educate and help these people to be a helpful part of our society. Even in these abusers/pedophile centers will be spiritual help of the Body. and the communtion with other brothers and "sister?" will help them. Of course family members are allowed to come togehter with the abuser. But not in the frame of the old congregations where they were before daily confronted with victims.

50

Will Child Abuse Issue Keep Growing Like A Forest Fire?

by OnTheWayOut in

i don't know if a commercial will come up and i can't find this on youtube as it is probably copyright material or i am just not in a good search pattern today.

anyway, try to view this if you haven't seen it:.

https://rutube.ru/video/0ba7a3ee7e89dbbc730c4af32032e33b/?ref=logo .

TheWonderofYou

Humor

Possible "Divine institutional responses for abuses cases" already worked by Tower-laywers and waiting to get put out of the drawers.

To show our christian compassion with our beloved victims we ask the Body to establish

- a "crisis intervention team for abuse accusations" that will have first contact with victims and abusers to minimize the first risks after such an accusation

- a "permant abuse commission" that will trace any accusion, watch the abusers like the police and make final reports to the police.

- and a establish a new entity called the permanent kingdom recovery works.

The judicial committee of elders will only form to talk about spiritual matters and consequences for the other congregation members, but shall not act as investigator in an case of abuse.

The elders duty will be to call as primary action the new crisis intervention team (to help the victim) and the new permanent abuse commission (to watch the offender)

So the primary action in case of accusation will be done by the crisis intervention team for the victim and simultanousley by the permanent abuse commission, they are acting as civil authorieties in cooperation with the police.

The local elders sheperding judgical committees are not concerned with the matter at all.

Details about the crisis intervention team (protecting the victims):

In case a sheperd elder is aware of an accusion of abuse he has to call professional help namely the "JW crisis intervention team for abuse cases" establihed in each country prospectively.

The JW crisis intervention team holds the first contact with the victim. It decides together with the victim about the following steps and organize the revovery.

It will consist of

- a JW female doctor, worldly educated or if not available a worldly female doctor

- a professionally desaster trained sister for abuse cases, maybe even a former victim now working for the recovery service.

Preparing and organizing the recovery of the victim is the utmost duty of this new "crisis or desaster team". The victim shall receive all necessary help from within the christian cong. and from professional outside too. As soon as the "Kingdom recovery works" is established all victims will have the possibiliet to begin a new life, thanks God.