the following is an extract from an article i wrote when i left the watchtower 25 years ago.
it may be helpful in reasoning with a jw about the anointed/great crowd distinction.. --------------------------------.
to divide people into those with a heavenly hope and those with an earthly one is not a biblical concept.
Steve,
Russell certainly had his own two classes doctrine. But Bible Students would mostly go for the high calling to Jehovah nature.
There is one hope, one baptism etc. Jesus brough down the wall seperating Jews and gentiles (and kicked their behinds in AD 70).
we keep seeing posters bringing col. 1.16 and john 1.3 up as proof that christ is excluded from the creative acts.
the proof they submit is that the words "all things [gk., pánta]" appear in these texts.
however, they are missing this important element from the discussion: the word "all" is rarely used in greek, and even in our everyday language to mean literally "everyone" or "everything" under the sky.
Yes indeed. All means all within a context. But various groups want all to mean this and that. It is not just the JWs. There are many others. Calvinists have been busy telling us that all or the world means a few.
When it says all things were created in Christ (Colossians 1.16) and the statement is attacked, we must ask who do you think was not created? Then the JWs can start looking for evidence for any teaching of a created a god that created all [other] things. When it says all things reconciled in Christ (Colossians 1:20), we must ask if the few of the narrow path of Matthew 7:13 are spoken of here. No. Some other group is spoken of.
I sense the reason they add [other] in John 1.3 and Colossians 1:16 is to emphasis low Arianism. In high / semi Arianism Jesus is not "a god" and he is not on par with other creatures. Here they wanted to emphasize that this a god was a creature not to be worshipped. But you can wonder why they felt the need to add others and at the same time later produce a paper like this?
Most of the watchtower quoted verses are taken out of their context. We would use language in the same way today. “Everybody” came to the show. If you want to use the same criteria for creation and salvation be my guest. Matt 10:22 “you will be hated by everyone” must be limited to those the believer came across and in general the Christians were hated. But the context shows exceptions to “everyone”, namely the one being spoken to. Genesis 3:20? Genesis 3:15. Context. Creation is sustained through Christ (again, Colossians 1:16-20).
Context is the big problem in JW religion. They say a lot and then they quote some verses that seem to support the thought. But context of the Bible passages is often ignored.
is there a difference ?
i believe so ,and a very big difference.one that harmonises with the new testament in bearing witness to jesus and his kingdom and one that amounts to a new gospel bearing witness to jehovah and his kingdom something that is condemned in the bible.. c.t.russell started the magazine called "zions watchtower and herald of christs presence" and its emphasis was on bearing witness about jesus christ and his kingdom ,of course he got many things wrong ,but he was focused on jesus & his kingdom with what the new testament is all about.. j.f.rutherford in his wisdom decided to change the heading of the watchtower to " the watchtower announcing jehovah`s kingdom" a phrase / term / doctrine that is not in the new testament and takes away the importance and role that jesus christ has in bringing people to god.phil.2:9-11. nowhere in the christian greek scriptures / new testament are followers of jesus christ instructed to be witnesses of jehovah ,nowhere there is not one scripture that instructs them to do so.. however in the christian greek scriptures / new testament there are over twenty scriptures whereby christians are told to be witnesses of jesus.. and it was by divine providence that followers of christ were to be called christians .acts 11:26 , not jehovah`s witnesses.. do jw`s even know what it means " by divine providence " ?.
the jw`s use isaiah 43:10-12 an old testament scripture to justify calling themselves jehovah`s witnesses,however that was applied to the israelites back then ,did they adopt the name jehovah`s witnesses ?
the last couple years i have been really getting into watching these videos called the bible protect.
there is no real dogmatic axe to grind.
just simple 10 -15 min videos on the individual books of the bible and kind of how it’s all connected together.
JW leaders definetly have another spin on the Bible story than the Bible writers. But they use verses from them here and there. It is a clever arrangement.
the following is an extract from an article i wrote when i left the watchtower 25 years ago.
it may be helpful in reasoning with a jw about the anointed/great crowd distinction.. --------------------------------.
to divide people into those with a heavenly hope and those with an earthly one is not a biblical concept.
No such thing as two classes of believers. You have to be able to isolate all the stuff not found in the Bible and then discern if the JWs are prophets of God with the right to bring us new mail from God
when i was a kid they implied that all animals and humans were vegetarian before the flood but i don’t know the scriptures they used, anyone know?
.
It is clear we got a teaching of early purity that creation will be restored to. Along with Isaiah 11:6, Daniel 1:8-16 imply that meateating is impure. Original covenant creation with innocent Adam as head therefore ate veggies. It is just as literal as talking snake and supernatural trees. In line with this revelation 22:2 speaks of healing leaves.
the last couple years i have been really getting into watching these videos called the bible protect.
there is no real dogmatic axe to grind.
just simple 10 -15 min videos on the individual books of the bible and kind of how it’s all connected together.
The jw org or Russell definetly does not teach you to read the Bible in context. You should always study the context and background of Bible verses
when i was a kid they implied that all animals and humans were vegetarian before the flood but i don’t know the scriptures they used, anyone know?
.
A literal interpretation will also teach there was talking snake and trees with supernatural abilities
if you read my book "new boy" i talked about a girl i met in 1972 at a convention in allentown pa. i fell in love with her at first sight.
however a problem came up a couple of months later, when i met and fell in love with my future wife, debbie.
both women's mothers didn't like me at all (go figure) and it was literally a coin toss between the two women.
A lot of tragic stories. You got a bad experience but thankfully got out in time. The spiritual types have no savings but never dreamed that the armageddon could prolong so long. I remember a story from my mom about how a very spiritual sister told her to stop murmuring about the elders, she should think of her eternal life now the end was so near. For decades this spiritual sister had expected the end to be so soon that there was no time to think or question.
if you read my book "new boy" i talked about a girl i met in 1972 at a convention in allentown pa. i fell in love with her at first sight.
however a problem came up a couple of months later, when i met and fell in love with my future wife, debbie.
both women's mothers didn't like me at all (go figure) and it was literally a coin toss between the two women.
LongHairGal,
I can only imagine. Lots of hierachy and peer pressure. In the last days of her attending my mother refered to herself and other low status sisters as "sister zero'.
