When they finally cut the anchor of 1914 loose the church will be much freer to adapt and grow. I'd give it another 10 years or so.
peacefulpete
JoinedPosts by peacefulpete
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89
Myth of 1914
by peacefulpete inthe wt engages in history revisionism when insisting the world changed overnight in 1914. in fact the european power struggles that came to a head were centuries old.
millions of lives had been lost in the wars of the 19th century, with the world a powder keg the years prior to the assassination of franz ferdinand in june 1914 which is often said, albeit rather arbitrarily, as the start of the war that escalated over the next 4 years into the great war.
take a look at these two pages and ask if the wt's interpretation of history seems accurate to you.
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how do you perceive jehovah?
by stan livedeath inwhat did you think god looked like when you were ( or still are ) a jw ?
or even never a jw..but believe in god ?.
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peacefulpete
Never visualized him as listening to my prayers. The artwork and descriptions in the Bible are of an old guy with a beard of course. I think in some odd way the name had been elevated to such importance that I pictured the name when praying.
Some may find it peculiar I generally use Yahweh went discussing the OT now. Not only is it more accurate but it's not a trigger word. When leaving a high control group it's healthier to avoid the language and lingo of that group for a while maybe forever.
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Pioneer couple sense of entitlement
by nowwhat? inso there's this middle age pioneer couple.
he works part time and the wife doesn't work at all.
their daughter is getting married and even though it is known they go on multiple vacations a year, they expect the grooms parents to pay for 100% of the wedding!
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peacefulpete
Funny someone mentioned "gleaning". In my family we took it literally. We got much of our vegetables for canning by trespassing in fields after the harvester went through. Or picked apples off trees that weren't ours. Actually funny now but we were quite sure we were OK with God because of Leviticus. It left a deep impression apparently. I 'dumpster dived' as a pioneer quite regularly. I shared good scores with the rest of the pioneers. Even impressed my wife to be in that way. Good times lol.
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89
Myth of 1914
by peacefulpete inthe wt engages in history revisionism when insisting the world changed overnight in 1914. in fact the european power struggles that came to a head were centuries old.
millions of lives had been lost in the wars of the 19th century, with the world a powder keg the years prior to the assassination of franz ferdinand in june 1914 which is often said, albeit rather arbitrarily, as the start of the war that escalated over the next 4 years into the great war.
take a look at these two pages and ask if the wt's interpretation of history seems accurate to you.
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peacefulpete
Earnest...thanks. I remember reading a very old WT that expanded upon that stuff when I was at Bethel. It appears that the 40 year addition was arrived at in that chart as 37 years from Jesus death to 70 plus 3 for something. It is complete gibberish. Do you understand the mental process involved in going from 1844 (Millerite date) to 1874 to 1914 so as to summarize it?
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Best Xmas Songs
by peacefulpete inmy favorites.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsdg9qtjzzi.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7uudu66e_vw.
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why celebrate xmas?
by enoughisenough inmany on here are ex jw....they have left the jws because of coming to find out the many false indoctrinations.
one of the things learned as a jw is that there isn't anything true about xmas being the birth of jesus.
( matt chapter 2 tells a whole different narrative about the baby jesus than what is portrayed by the christian churches) they learn the ways that are celebrated are pagan practices jesus told the samaritan woman that god wanted to be worshipped in spirit and it truth.
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peacefulpete
Everyone has a unique home situation that affects what they can do but to see only the negative in a holiday that celebrates Peace on earth and goodwill toward men is just sad. If you are really unable to see the good in things like this you are a damaged human being IMO. Or maybe a grinch. Again because I hate typing, I'll repost from last month:
We host a fairly large international Xmas. It's a highlight of our year. If the ice is good, I clear an ice rink with lights around it, bond fire where we burn last year's tree. We feature the traditions of a different county every year. (almost blew myself up with Mexican fireworks last year) It means a lot to see friends and catch up. Everyone has a stocking that usually has trivial trinkets and candy. It takes effort but last year when my health was so uncertain I needed a little Norman Rockwell escape. It meant so much to have everyone come like every other year.
People are the reason for the season.
If you don't now have a friend to celebrate with, reach out to a workmate or distant family, you'd be surprised how good it feels to be welcomed.
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Pioneer couple sense of entitlement
by nowwhat? inso there's this middle age pioneer couple.
he works part time and the wife doesn't work at all.
their daughter is getting married and even though it is known they go on multiple vacations a year, they expect the grooms parents to pay for 100% of the wedding!
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peacefulpete
We pioneered for many years, had many friends as well who pioneered. Never asked anyone to fix my car. I did it. Never had any reason to believe they would have helped if I asked. Knew only one joker who did something like that, that was because he was a 'taker' not because he was a pioneer. There were many things pioneering fostered, a lax attitude toward health and financial stability for example. But I'd not include the sense of entitlement you are describing. If anything we cultivated a "do without" mentality and expected, and got nothing, from the congregation.
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349
Who really is the Faithful and Discreet Slave?
by Godlyman inif anyone were to come up to you claiming that they are the faithful and discreet slave, how would you go about proving them to be false, based upon scripture?.
estephan.
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peacefulpete
- “You are My servant, O Israel” (41:8)
- You are My servant, Israel” (49:3)
- But hear, now, O Jacob My servant,
Israel whom I have chosen!(44:1) - Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen (43:10)
- Thus saith the LORD that made thee, and formed thee from the womb, which will help thee; Fear not, O Jacob, my servant; (44:2)
- Remember these, O Jacob and Israel; for thou art my servant: I have formed thee; thou art my servant: O Israel, thou shalt not be forgotten of me. (44:21)
- Go ye forth of Babylon, flee ye from the Chaldeans, with a voice of singing declare ye, tell this, utter it even to the end of the earth; say ye, The LORD hath redeemed his servant Jacob. (48:20)
- READ chapt 52 through 54 again and ask who is God's Servant being mocked and oppressed then restored?
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349
Who really is the Faithful and Discreet Slave?
by Godlyman inif anyone were to come up to you claiming that they are the faithful and discreet slave, how would you go about proving them to be false, based upon scripture?.
estephan.
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peacefulpete
No hard evidence could convince the Jews that Jesus is the Messiah. They didn’t want it.
Or stated more precisely, they understood their own writings precluded the idea of vicarious human sacrifice buying the forgiveness for the sins of others. The "promised" Messiah was a real savior not an invisible secret one. Much like why most Christians today reject the WT's invisible spiritual return.
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39
why celebrate xmas?
by enoughisenough inmany on here are ex jw....they have left the jws because of coming to find out the many false indoctrinations.
one of the things learned as a jw is that there isn't anything true about xmas being the birth of jesus.
( matt chapter 2 tells a whole different narrative about the baby jesus than what is portrayed by the christian churches) they learn the ways that are celebrated are pagan practices jesus told the samaritan woman that god wanted to be worshipped in spirit and it truth.
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peacefulpete
enough...you do know the two stories in Matt and Luke are incompatible and that they reflect just 2 of any number of Jesus birth traditions. The church Xmas nativity stories today in the Western Christian tradition are an attempted blending of the two. The Greek Orthodox tradition however maintains Jesus was born in a cave. In this they agree with Justin Martyr and Origen who both said a cave in Bethlehem was the site of Jesus' birth. The Protoevangelium also testifies to this early tradition. Emperor Hadrian even went and leveled the site because first century Christians were making pilgrimages to the cave. Ascension of Is has him born in a house like Matt..
Then we have Ignatius, the supposed first attestation of Matt, he has a very different version of the star story where Jesus IS the star.
Now the virginity of Mary was hidden from the Prince of this world, as was also her offspring, and the death of the Lord; three mysteries of renown, which were wrought in silence by God. How, then, was He manifested to the world? A star shone forth in heaven above all the other stars, the light of which was inexpressible, while its novelty struck men with astonishment. And all the rest of the stars, with the sun and moon, formed a chorus to this star, and its light was exceedingly great above them all. And there was agitation felt as to whence this new spectacle came, so unlike everything else above. Hence every kind of magic was destroyed, and every bond of wickedness disappeared, ignorance was removed, and the old kingdom abolished, when God appeared in human form [or revealed himself in a human manner] for the renewal of eternal life.
Ignatius, Letter to the Ephesians 19We haven't even started on this topic, but my point is that there simply wasn't the a singular tradition about Jesus' birth in the earliest Christian records. No one appears to be fixated or maybe even aware of the contradictory birth narratives in Matt and Luke.