fulltimestudent

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Posts by fulltimestudent

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  19

  The Worst Year to be Alive? Answer: Most likely to be 536 CE

  by fulltimestudent in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was a witness, since the early 1950's, to the relentless claims of the wt society (then synonymous with jws) that this was the worst of times to be alive.

  if i had been more questioning and less accepting, i would never have become a shill for these apologists pf the murderous yhwh and his accomplice jesus,.

  so how interesting to see today an opinion in science journal that:- .

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  fulltimestudent

  Bill, i could not argue with your comments on WW1, at least regarding the technological advances that became evident in that war. I was mistaken in my comment that machine guns were used in the ACW, but the quotes I ioffered above indicate that there is an opinion held by some historians that 'modern' warfare was initiated during the ACW.

  My initial comments focused on the terminology of this statement, "the first industrialised war in history" I proposed that that honor (or dishonor) belonged to the ACW,

  You now want to change ths topic of discussion ever so slightly by saying, "However, World War One was the first time in which modern industrialised countries went to war with one another."

  The ACW as the term implies was a civil war, though I guess one could construct an argument that the South's secession meant that it had become a separate nation. Of course, the North did not recognise the South's right to secede.

  But the initial discussion was about the first industrialised war in history, not the first time that 'modern industrialised countries went to war with one another.'

  This discussion could also focus on the precise meaning of a term like 'industrialised.'

  There is evidence that there were industrial complexes in China built adjacent to coal mines, producing steel at least as early as the Song dynasty. (See John M. Hobson's, The Eastern Origin of Western Civilisation, Ch 3 and Ch 9,)

  He also pffers a list of some remarkable weapons developed in Chinese history, which include Flame Throwers (circa 900 CE) Fire arrows (949) CE. Bombs, grenades and rockets (by 1231). Land and sea mines (by 1231) rocket launchers that could launch 329 rockets at a time. And Korea used a armored boat in a war with Japan in the 16th century.

  My point is simple. what is progress? And what does industrialisation really mean? In this context, we are discussing an incremental change in the way things are done or made, and from that perspective, the ACW was a turning point as the historians cited in a previous post argued. Of course your welcome to hold a contrary viewpoint.
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  19

  The Worst Year to be Alive? Answer: Most likely to be 536 CE

  by fulltimestudent in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was a witness, since the early 1950's, to the relentless claims of the wt society (then synonymous with jws) that this was the worst of times to be alive.

  if i had been more questioning and less accepting, i would never have become a shill for these apologists pf the murderous yhwh and his accomplice jesus,.

  so how interesting to see today an opinion in science journal that:- .

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  fulltimestudent

  Thank you Bill for correcting my misunderstanding re the use of machine guns in the American Civil War. However, it still seems (to me) that the ACW was the event that started the world on a faster path of weapon development.

  I appreciate your arguments and viewpoint, but still feel inclined to view the ACW as the commencement of industrialised warfare. It could be said, that the fact that American industry was (generally) located in the north was the deciding factor in that war. The south could hardly appreciate what that meant, as they attempted to fight with 18th C tactics and weapons, Of course, whatever view we take of the ACW, considerable progress is seen by WW1, and even more in the 100 odd years since then, until now the nation with the most destructive power in history is the USA.
  

  What do you think of the viewpoint expressed on this "History' site ?: https://www.history.com/topics/american-civil-war/civil-war-technology

  Some historians refer to the ACW as the first 'modern' war. A page owned by the Virginia Museum of History and Culture makes the points:

  The First Modern War?

  The technology of the industrial revolution applied to the science of killing made the Civil War a turning point between the limited combat of professional armies of the 1700s and the "total" mobilization of World Wars I and II. This device creates a record of incoming messages by embossing a series of short and long marks on a moving strip of paper.

  Muzzle-loading firearms and communication by drum, flag, and bugle were holdovers from the past, but rifled weapons increased the range of firearms, and telegraphy allowed distant armies to communicate and coordinate. Railroads moved armies faster than before, and iron ships, land mines, hand grenades, and torpedoes made their debut. As reconnaissance balloons took war to the skies, many of the essential elements of modern warfare were in place by 1865.

  -----------------------------

  And, this feature story in the Scientific American. Refernce: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-technology-shaped-the-civil-war-classics/ )

  How Technology Shaped the Civil War,

  Secession not only spurred rapid improvements in warships and weapons, but also led to advances in communications and medicine

  -----------------------------------------------
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  14

  "The sun will be darkened, & the moon will not give its light." How do events like this affect superstitious humans?

  by fulltimestudent in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the gospel of matthew's homily on the signs connected with the imagined return of christ, features an element of the sign that seems to really scare superstitious people.. matthew 24:29 reads: "immediately after the distress of those days "'the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light;".

  in the nineteenth century such an even occurred twice in the 19th century and apparently became part of charlie russell's conviction that the end of the world was nigh, charlie, of course, was a 'man of faith' accepting the bible as true and not willing to search for alternative explanation for such events.

  if charlie r. had been the sort of person that continually asks why, his life and ours may have taken a different course.. i cannot quote where in his mass of writings he cites those 19th c events (its a long time since i've bothered to be interested in his writings), but mention them he did, and saw these events as proof of the imminent return of jesus christ.. so let's look at these two 19th c.natural occurrences, and compare them to another occurrence some 1400 years ago.. the 19th c events occurred in 1814-16 and again circa, 1883. the reason for the sun and moon being darkened was volcanic activity, easy for us to appreciate, but more difficult for religiously superstitious people.. the wikipedia encyclopedia notes the 1814-16 event: quote.

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  fulltimestudent

  The Gospel of Matthew's homily on the signs connected with the imagined return of christ, features an element of the sign that seems to really scare superstitious people.

  Matthew 24:29 reads: "Immediately after the distress of those days "'the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light;"

  In the nineteenth century such an even occurred twice in the 19th century and apparently became part of Charlie Russell's conviction that the end of the world was nigh, Charlie, of course, was a 'man of faith' accepting the bible as true and not willing to search for alternative explanation for such events. If Charlie R. had been the sort of person that continually asks why, his life and ours may have taken a different course.

  I cannot quote where in his mass of writings he cites those 19th C events (its a long time since I've bothered to be interested in his writings), but mention them he did, and saw these events as proof of the imminent return of jesus christ.

  So let's look at these two 19th C.natural occurrences, and compare them to another occurrence some 1400 years ago.

  The 19th C events occurred in 1814-16 and again circa, 1883. The reason for the sun and moon being darkened was volcanic activity, easy for us to appreciate, but more difficult for religiously superstitious people.

  The Wikipedia encyclopedia notes the 1814-16 event: Quote."The year 1816 is known as the Year Without a Summer (also the Poverty Year and Eighteen Hundred and Froze To Death)[1] because of severe climate abnormalities that caused average global temperatures to decrease by 0.4–0.7 °C (0.7–1.3 °F).[2] This resulted in major food shortages across the Northern Hemisphere.[3]

  Evidence suggests that the anomaly was predominantly a volcanic winter event caused by the massive 1815 eruption of Mount Tambora in the Dutch East Indies (now Indonesia) . This eruption was the largest eruption in at least 1,300 years (after the extreme weather events of 535–536), and perhaps exacerbated by the 1814 eruption of Mayon in the Philippines." (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Year_Without_a_Summer )

  Charlie was, of course, not an eye-witness to that event, but was alive for the second, 1883 event: An eye-witness account describes the after affects - "The air grew steadily darker and darker, and at 10:30 a.m. we were in total darkness, just the same as on a very dark night. The wind was from the west-ward, and began to increase till it reached the force of a hurricane.

  So we let down both anchors and kept the screw turning slowly at half speed in order to ride over the terribly high seas which kept suddenly striking us presumably in consequence of a "sea quake," and made us dread being buried under them. Awnings and curtains from forward right up the main-mast, three boat covers, and the uppermost awning of the quarter deck were blown away in a moment. Some objects on desk which had been lashed got loose and were carried overboard; the upper deck hatchways and those on the main deck were closed tightly, and the passengers for the most part were sent below.
  Heavy storms.
  The lightning struck the mainmast conductor six or seven times, but no damage. The rain of pumice-stones changed to a violent mud rain, and this mud rain was so heavy that in the space of ten minutes the mud lay half a foot deep. Kept steaming with the head of the ship as far as possible seawards for half an hour when the sea began to abate, and at noon the wind dropped away entirely. Then we stopped the engine. The darkness however remained as before, as did also the mud rain." (from VanSANDICK)

  (http://historyofgeology.fieldofscience.com/2010/08/august-27-1883-krakatoa-day-world.html )
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  19

  The Worst Year to be Alive? Answer: Most likely to be 536 CE

  by fulltimestudent in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was a witness, since the early 1950's, to the relentless claims of the wt society (then synonymous with jws) that this was the worst of times to be alive.

  if i had been more questioning and less accepting, i would never have become a shill for these apologists pf the murderous yhwh and his accomplice jesus,.

  so how interesting to see today an opinion in science journal that:- .

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  2. 
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  fulltimestudent

  Quote: "That allowed them to get away with making a big issue of 1914. Persons who had just lived through the first industrialised war in history,"

  Yes, the 1914-1918 war was 'industrialised.' But, I think that an examination of the American civil war, and some of the 19th century European wars (before the Great War) will show that these wars can also be considered 'industrialised.' Perhaps the use of flying machines and tanks in the 1914-1918 could be considered as marking WW1* as a more 'industrialised.' war..

  The deadly affect of machine guns may be first seen in the American Civil War, and were certainly used by the British Army in the 1904 invasion of China's Tibet, when a nervous CO ordered their use against Tibetan irregulars who had just surrendered. Slaying some 300 Tibetans. (The Tibetan irregulars did not have state issued guns, but brought with them yheir personally owned guns, most of which were little better than flintlocks, and that was why they would not surrender their guns.)

  * If you do some searching you could find a number of historians who see WW1, not as a genuine first world war, but as the last of the purely European struggles for World supremacy. Other areas of the world that were affected by WWI were affected because of the European notion of colonisation, And, in some ways WW2 was also a continuation of those 19th C European struggles for world domination. The determination of Hitler's Germany to 'win' was certainly based on the harsh treatment of Germany in the Versailles Peace Treaty.

  What made WW2 a truly world war, was Japan*, and from that viewpoint, WW2 can be seen as starting in July 1937, with Japan's invasion of a still disorganised China. Japan went on to steam-roller the European Military in S.E. Asia. A victory that should not have shocked the European military establishment, because the newly industrialised Japan had defeated Russia in the 1904 war, not just on land, but also at sea, the Japanese Navy sinking two Russian fleets. That should have been a warning to the West, that a re-organised Asia would have to be treated with caution and respect.

  ----------------------------------------------------

  Quote:

  • "Any time an uber-Dub says something like "this is the worst time in all of human history"... ...counter with: "So you'd rather live in the Old West? The Middle Ages? The Roman Empire?"

    Quite right! Daily problems fade into insignificance when we are faced with life or death medical issues. So many diseases, once incurable, can now be fixed through advances in medical science.
• 
  8

  Charlie Russell, A Zionist Hero

  by fulltimestudent in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was rather surprised today as i explored some archaeological news for my macquarie asian history fb page, to be suddenly confronted with this heading in the israeli haaretz media site.. before herzl, there was pastor russell: a neglected chapter of zionism.

  years before theodor herzl proposed creating a jewish state, charles taze russell was traveling the world holding jewish mass meetings, beginning in 1879, at which he urged jews to find a national home in eretz israel.

  ... and this quote from charlie's zion's watchtower (p. 329, 1892: .

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  fulltimestudent

  I was rather surprised today as I explored some archaeological news for my Macquarie Asian History FB page, to be suddenly confronted with this heading in the Israeli Haaretz media site.

  Before Herzl, There Was Pastor Russell: A Neglected Chapter of Zionism

  Years before Theodor Herzl proposed creating a Jewish state, Charles Taze Russell was traveling the world holding Jewish Mass Meetings, beginning in 1879, at which he urged Jews to find a national home in Eretz Israel

  ... and this quote from Charlie's Zion's Watchtower (p. 329, 1892:

  "There are now in the world more than ten million Jews, about three-quarters of whom are in Russia, Poland, the Balkan States, and Turkey. If the movement toward Palestine should get the impulse that the Hirsch committee is able to give it, an imaginative person can conceive of the country's doubling or trebling its Jewish population before the close of our century"
  

  And to find the article adopting Charlie as an early and enthusiastic proponent for a Jewish state.

  You may be able read the article at:

  https://www.haaretz.com/jewish/.premium.MAGAZINE-before-herzl-there-was-pastor-russell-a-neglected-chapter-of-zionism-1.6409303?v=871F47BC8E181BF48C973D505C18DAC3

  (There's no paywall, but Haaretz wants you email before letting you read the full story.)

  I knew that Charlie had a greater leaning toward Zionism than the WTS in my time. but to see this fulsome praise was surprising.

  
  
• 
  19

  The Worst Year to be Alive? Answer: Most likely to be 536 CE

  by fulltimestudent in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was a witness, since the early 1950's, to the relentless claims of the wt society (then synonymous with jws) that this was the worst of times to be alive.

  if i had been more questioning and less accepting, i would never have become a shill for these apologists pf the murderous yhwh and his accomplice jesus,.

  so how interesting to see today an opinion in science journal that:- .

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  fulltimestudent

  I was a witness, since the early 1950's, to the relentless claims of the WT society (then synonymous with jws) that this was the worst of times to be alive. If I had been more questioning and less accepting, I would never have become a shill for these apologists pf the murderous YHWH and his accomplice jesus,

  So how interesting to see today an opinion in Science Journal that:-

  Quote: "Ask medieval historian Michael McCormick what year was the worst to be alive, and he's got an answer: "536." Not 1349, when the Black Death wiped out half of Europe. Not 1918, when the flu killed 50 million to 100 million people, mostly young adults. But 536. In Europe, "It was the beginning of one of the worst periods to be alive, if not the worst year," says McCormick, a historian and archaeologist who chairs the Harvard University Initiative for the Science of the Human Past."

  You can read why at: https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2018/11/why-536-was-worst-year-be-alive?fbclid=IwAR0zxOTAKAqV1lLnk1QVYpjFP_urdvEsJaHsw-b4xcYZ9IN0DPCjJrClaY0

  But humans survived, although many christians likely predicted the imminent return of Jesus and the end of the world. But they were wrong, just as the present mob with that same message is also proving wrong. The generation that 'saw' 1914 have long gone to their graves, and the believers in JW.com will also go to their graves and will not see the fulfillment of 'fake promises.'

  Sad isn't it, to have spent so many years preaching falsehood!
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  1

  Lucky Pommies - New exhibition at the British Museum - "I am Ashurbanipal: King of the World

  by fulltimestudent in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  in case your puzzled, pommie is an old australian slang word for an english person.

  but that aside, the major point is this exciting exhibition at the british museum.. here's their description of it.. step into the world of ashurbanipal – one of history’s greatest forgotten kings – in our major new exhibition.

  ashurbanipal has been given other names (in case you asked).

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  fulltimestudent

  In case your puzzled, Pommie is an old Australian slang word for an English person. Still in (some) use.

  But that aside, the major point is this exciting exhibition at the British Museum.

  Here's their description of it.

  Step into the world of Ashurbanipal – one of history’s greatest forgotten kings – in our major new exhibition.

  Ashurbanipal has been given other names (in case you asked). Wikipedia notes: "n the Hebrew Bible he is called Asenappar (Hebrew: אָסְנַפַּר, Modern: 'Asnapar, Tiberian: 'Āsenapar - Ezra 4:10).[3] Roman historian Justinus identified him as Sardanapalus, although the fictional Sardanapalus is depicted as the last king of Assyria and an ineffectual, effete and debauched character, whereas three further kings succeeded Ashurbanipal, who was in fact an educated, efficient, highly capable and ambitious warrior king.[4]"

  Here's some extant reliefs extolling his power:

  

  

  And, (hopefully) if you can attend this exhibition you will see what could be the original flood story, A story adapted by some proto-Jewish scribe to 'prove' that YHWH is the most powerful personage in the entire universe.

  
  
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  23

  Noah 'warning the people'

  by KW13 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  am i imagining this?at the kingdom hall we were told many times that noah warned the others about the coming flood and was ridiculed but actually there is no evidence of this in the bible!there is however evidence to the contrary.

  matthew 24:37-39.

  37 as it was in the days of noah, so it will be at the coming of the son of man.

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  fulltimestudent

  Quote" "So, by clever translation, you can insert the diea that Noah was indeed warning them, but they simply chose not to pay attention."

  Translating is bloody hard work, especially so when you'r attempting a translation of an ancient language. Just what concept did the author have in mind when he used a particular word? I have no particular interest in supporting blind Freddy's translating ability or the translation skills of any current Jw guru, but I am sort of always thinking about the truthiness of statements. (My own included).

  So whenever there is outright condemnation of a NWT choice of a contemporary English word to translate an ancient language word, I start to think, and think (and so on) and then i try to check .... !!!!!

  And a handy sort of place to check is the internet, and I often use the Blue Letter Bible site ( as I'm going to do now).

  Going to the site, I type Matthew 24:37-39 into the search box, and up comes Matthew 24. (KJV) verse by verse.At verse 39, i click on the tools box on the right, and get a list of the words in the verse. with the greek word in another column, I want to know what the word used in the KJV (know) was in Greek, I see it is ginosko, and the Strong's discussion reference is G1097. Clicking on that I get (down a bit) an "Outline of Biblical Usage" which are stated to be:

  Quote:

  1. to learn to know, come to know, get a knowledge of perceive, feel

     1. to become known

  2. to know, understand, perceive, have knowledge of

     1. to understand

     2. to know

  3. Jewish idiom for sexual intercourse between a man and a woman

  4. to become acquainted with, to know.

     ---------------------------

     And then comes a definition TO SHOW HOW THE WORD MAY HAVE BEEN USED.;

     γινώσκω ginṓskō, ghin-oce'-ko; a prolonged form of a primary verb; to "know" (absolutely) in a great variety of applications and with many implications (as follow, with others not thus clearly expressed):—allow, be aware (of), feel, (have) know(-ledge), perceived, be resolved, can speak, be sure, understand.

     
     

     Armed with that scrap of information, I am in a much better position to think about the NWT's latest refinement.

     So what do YOU now think about the NWT's choice of an English word/phrase to translate ginōskō ?????

     -------------------
     

     The OP did not state which translation he used in making his discovery, but It appears to be the NIV,

     On the biblehub web-site you can get a list of translation of vs 38 to compare what selections other translations have made. It's quite interesting, check this case out at:

     https://biblehub.com/matthew/24-39.htm

     I don't think most usages exclude someone telling the pre-flood population about the coming disaster.

     But since it was all a myth anyway, how could anyone know what was in the mind of the Genesis author?

     
     
     

     
     

     
     
     
• 
  2

  More Research on Cult Behaviour.

  by fulltimestudent in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  came across this research today, on why cult leaders can induce so much conformity among the cult's membership.

  it may be of interest to some here.. abstract: .

  "several pieces of literature suggest that most individuals who are successfully integrated into cults do not typically manifest symptoms of mental illness.

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  fulltimestudent

  Came across this research today, on why cult leaders can induce so much conformity among the cult's membership. It may be of interest to some here.

  Abstract:

  "Several pieces of literature suggest that most individuals who are successfully integrated into cults do not typically manifest symptoms of mental illness. However, the public is often taken aback by the lack of autonomy displayed by cult members and is bewildered by the ability of the cult leader and other cult members to transform fundamental personality functioning in an individual. Within the framework of an object relations model of personality structure and functioning as delineated by Otto Kernberg and using existing data concerning the cult experience, the authors engage in a theoretical exploration of cult membership. The authors propose that some behaviors exhibited by cult members may be a function of an object relations-level regression, which is exemplified by the activation of primitive defensive operations that are usually relegated to those suffering with severe personality disorders."

  Link: https://psychotherapy.psychiatryonline.org/doi/abs/10.1176/appi.psychotherapy.2011.65.4.381?utm_source=TrendMD&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=TrendMD_APA3month_Nov2018
• 
  15

  Hey jesus! So tell us all about heaven!

  by nowwhat? in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i always wondered, how come the apostles never asked jesus what heaven is like compare to earth.

  and wouldn't they be bugging jesus to tell them all kind of stories of such?.

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  fulltimestudent

  Steve2 wwrote: "I’m sure not every conversation he had with his early followers was (eventually) recorded (or remembered). Which is very different from arguing that his followers never asked what heaven was like."

  And then there is the problem of knowing what Jesus really did say and teach, Of course, our former loving brothers believe that everything in the gospel accounts records exactly what jesus said and did. But these accounts were written at least two decades after jesus died.

  Can you recount precisely conversations you had with someone 20 or 30 years ago? That's why the holy spirit mythology was likely invented.

  Of course, the Jewish homeland was by then, heavily influenced by Hellenic (Greek) thinking and beliefs. And, it was a common belief that the Greek gods could come down and walk among humans and have conversations with them. Does any today, imagine that those conversations and visitations were real? But, back then it was a common belief.