Posts by fulltimestudent

16

The Dark-Skinned Early Briton.

by fulltimestudent in

jw
friends

i'm sure many others noted in yesterday's news feeds, that scientists deciphering the dna of the skeleton remains of a man thought to have died some 10,000 years ago in the south of england, have presented him as:.

as blue-eyed (now that's quite english) but as dark skinned.

and, that's not very english, to the horror of many.. (link: https://news.nationalgeographic.com/2018/02/ancient-face-cheddar-man-reconstructed-dna-spd/ ).

fulltimestudent

LongHairGal : "They think early Europeans had darker skin and through a mutation lighter skin developed over time."

I would appear so, LHG. Though if we accept the Nat Geo write-up, we could envision people of this type co-existing with people who had a much lighter skin tone.

The other interesting point is that this person had a darker skin AND blue eyes (or, that's how they are reading his genome). I'd previously thought that the blue eyes/pale skin mutation had occurred together.

stan livedeath : "interesting bust. made by cadburys perhaps ?"

Grin! Don't Cadburys' make white chocolate also?
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16

The Dark-Skinned Early Briton.

by fulltimestudent in

jw
friends

i'm sure many others noted in yesterday's news feeds, that scientists deciphering the dna of the skeleton remains of a man thought to have died some 10,000 years ago in the south of england, have presented him as:.

as blue-eyed (now that's quite english) but as dark skinned.

and, that's not very english, to the horror of many.. (link: https://news.nationalgeographic.com/2018/02/ancient-face-cheddar-man-reconstructed-dna-spd/ ).

fulltimestudent

I'm sure many others noted in yesterday's news feeds, that scientists deciphering the DNA of the skeleton remains of a man thought to have died some 10,000 years ago in the south of England, have presented him as:

as blue-eyed (now that's quite English) but as dark skinned. And, that's not very English, to the horror of many.

(link: https://news.nationalgeographic.com/2018/02/ancient-face-cheddar-man-reconstructed-dna-spd/ )

But what immediately jumped into the forefront of my (admittedly distorted by 50 years of JWdom) mind, was that this was the color that WT theorists imagined as Adam's skin color. (The article,that's stuck in my mind, described Adam as a mulatto).

The National Geographic coverage noted: "That's because a new analysis of the ancient man's DNA proves he's genetically similar to other dark-skinned individuals from the Mesolithic era found in Spain, Hungary, and Luxemborg whose DNA has already been sequenced. The new revelation places the Cheddar Man among a group of hunter-gatherers that are thought to have migrated to Europe at the end of the last Ice Age some 11,000 years ago."

How interesting, in the light of current debates about white skin and history,

8

Did the Jews invent themselves and Israel in response to Hellenism

by Crazyguy in

after alexander the great died a greek family called the ptolemy’s took over egypt and the area we call israel today.

they instituted a new form of god worship for their empire the worship of the king and a new god named serapis.

serapis was a combination of several egyptian and greeks gods combined into one god.

fulltimestudent

Crazyguy: " What I don’t understand is why the Ptolemy’s if they actually did this we don’t know for sure, contracted, some Jews to write their books into Greek? If they were not behind writting a Greek bible so to speak then why would the Jews do so, for they thought the older Hebrew language sacred so we’re told? The other question is are these writtings really Jewish and if not why make them look as if they are."

Our main source of information regarding the translation of the Septuagint, is the so-called Letter of Aristeas, which is discussed in the link below, so I won't go into some of the obvious indications that it is has a few deficiencies as an explanation.

http://www.biblearchaeology.org/post/2016/03/31/A-Brief-History-of-the-Septuagint.aspx#Article

Let's extract an important point from that article. By the time of Jesus, Greek had become the most important language of the Eastern Roman Empire and prior to Roman power, the Seleucid and Ptolemaic empires. And, the Greeks did not just live in what we now know as Greece, but also lived around the coast of Asia Minor. They were undoubtedly a very important part of the world at that time. In contrast, aside from the importance that the various brands of christianity have placed on the Jews, they were rather insignificant.

But large numbers lived in other areas of the ancient world. It is known that the city of Alexandria had a large Jewish population, as an example. Also, there were at least two Jewish temples in Egypt (that we know of), the first is the temple of Onias which was located at Leontopolis, and the other was located on the island of Elephantine, where it served a garrison of Jewish soldiers (who were in the service of the Ptolemies). In Roman times, as friction developed between the Jews and the Romans (that eventually led to the destruction of the temple in Jerusalem and Jews being expelled from Jerusalem), Jews in Egypt and some other north African locations conducted a serious guerrilla campaign against Roman forces. All these Jews likely spoke Greek rather than Aramaic, so a possible reason is that a Greek translation served these non-palestinian Jews.

And noting that the Letter of Aristeas invokes the world famous Library of Alexandria (then the largest in the world - or so it is claimed) and an associated research centre known as the Mouseion, maybe a translation of the Jewish religious books was wanted for the Library and the Mouseion, for the sake of owning a copy that could be read by Greek speaking students and teachers.

( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Destruction_of_the_Library_of_Alexandria )

By the way, there were other translations of the OT into Greek, not much remains of them, but I suggest they were another indication that Jews in the Palestine area were becoming hellenised.

8

Did the Jews invent themselves and Israel in response to Hellenism

by Crazyguy in

after alexander the great died a greek family called the ptolemy’s took over egypt and the area we call israel today.

they instituted a new form of god worship for their empire the worship of the king and a new god named serapis.

serapis was a combination of several egyptian and greeks gods combined into one god.

fulltimestudent

Crazyguy: "After Alexander the Great died a Greek family called the Ptolemy’s took over Egypt and the area we call Israel today."

Just a minor correction. After Alexander's death, the west Asian section of his empire was divided between the Seleucid dynasty, based mainly in Syria and the Ptolemaic dynasty in Egypt. Control of Palestine and Jerusalem seesawed between the two rival Greek dynasties.

Is that important? Yes, because the best Jewish account that we have of opposition to the hellenising process is the semi-canonical Maccabees, which took place against a background of a time when the Seleucids were in control.

The author of a Wikipedia entry, notes: "Antiochus' aggressive Hellenizing (or de-Judaizing) activities provoked a full scale armed rebellion in Judea—the Maccabean Revolt.[31]Efforts to deal with both the Parthians and the Jews as well as retain control of the provinces at the same time proved beyond the weakened empire's power."

First Maccabees, describes some of the acculturation process: "... Some of the people eagerly went to the king (i.e Antiochus). He authorized them to observe the ordinances of the Gentiles. So they built a gymnasium in Jerusalem, according to Gentile custom, and removed the marks of circumcision, and abandoned the holy covenant. They joined with the Gentiles and sold themselves to do evil."

And second Maccabees provides more detail. Under High Priest Jason, the account tells us even priests wore Greek garb and attended the gymnasium:

Chapter 4.
Verse 10. "When Jason received the king’s approval and came into office, he immediately initiated his compatriots into the Greek way of life.He set aside the royal concessions granted to the Jews through the mediation of John, father of Eupolemus* ... he set aside the lawful practices and introduced customs contrary to the law.
With perverse delight he established a gymnasium* at the very foot of the citadel, where he induced the noblest young men to wear the Greek hat.13The craze for Hellenism and the adoption of foreign customs reached such a pitch, through the outrageous wickedness of Jason, the renegade and would-be high priest, that the priests no longer cared about the service of the altar. Disdaining the temple and neglecting the sacrifices, they hastened, at the signal for the games, to take part in the unlawful exercises at the arena. What their ancestors had regarded as honors they despised; what the Greeks esteemed as glory they prized highly."

You have to put the two texts together to see the full picture.

Young priests (and other young men of the Jewish elite) were going to the Greek gymnasium, which was also a school teaching Greek thought. In the exercises they performed they did so naked, that's why the previous text mentioned that the Jews attending attempted to "de-circumcise,**" themselves.

And that led to the Maccabean rebellion, and some 100+ years of independence. But the elite did not resist cultural Hellenisation in other fields. Greek became the main language of the Jews, and Yes! Your, main premise has at least a grain of truth in it.

** In other words, they attempted to stretch what remained of their foreskin, so that they would not stand out as circumcised. An interesting contrast in customs. Jews could not be Jewish without circumcision, thus exposing the head of their penis. The Greeks of that time, thought it shameful to expose the head of their penis. To ensure that did not happen, some would tie a ribbon around the foreskin so that it could not rise and expose the head of their penis.

-----------------------------------------

Some more interesting references for you:

https://www.haaretz.com/jewish/.premium-a-story-of-a-fallen-high-priest-1.5346565

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/need-to-know/the-daily-need/jews-who-went-to-the-gymnasium-or-the-real-history-of-hanukkah/5605/

And a very long examination of the hellenising process:

"A HISTORY OF JEWS IN GREEK GYMNASIA FROM THE HELLENISTIC PERIOD THROUGH THE LATE ROMAN PERIOD."

https://getd.libs.uga.edu/pdfs/jordan_holly_a_200908_ma.pdf

20

Another trolley (That's Cart to Americanos), encounter today.

by punkofnice in

i couldn't bleedin' well resist it.

there were these 2 jobo blokes standing behind a jobot trolley.

jobo, 'what's that?'.

fulltimestudent

I like it!

Next time your in Sydney I'll treat to you some cake from an excellent Taiwanese cake shop.

8

"Gay sex is not porneia" started in 1947!

by ILoveTTATT2 in

jw
friends

look at this "gem"!.

it's from the november 1st, 1947 watchtower, p.336.

essentially, this is what started the doctrine that you couldn't divorce your spouse if he/she cheated on you with another member of the same sex.. this ended in 1972 with another wt article.

fulltimestudent

Nothing in the bible says that you have to be intelligent, in order to lead god's people.

11

Another Aspect from which to View Prostitution

by fulltimestudent in

jw
friends

if we put on our western cultural (you know, the ones that say jesus made the world) eye-glasses we will 'see' prostitution as something bad.. the 'christian' influenced view is that prostitution is a criminal racket run by gangsters, and the women (and sometimes men) have either been bullied by their pimps, or drugged until they become addicts and forced to work in brothels.**.

some of that is likely true (at times), but is it always 'truth'?.

australia's government owned abc media network, has an article that invites us to take off our western cultural eye-glasses and see the world as it really is.

fulltimestudent

Clearly, prostitution is a complex profession as all the views expressed so far indicate. May I expand on some comments.

scratchme1010: Also, I wouldn't say it's a "Christian" view of prostitution. First, Christians are not the only ones who share a demeaning perspective towards prostitutes.

Quite true, but within the anglosphere ( Anglo-American sphere) wouldn't you agree that the main negative influence is the church. And there's a lot of nuances in it, as it all get's mixed up with the church's attitudes toward sex.

I know other groups also take a negative view of prostitution. The Chinese government (as an instance) prohibits prostitution, despite the fact that one of the most common offences a senior public servant can be wrist-slapped for, is using prostitutes (usually disguised as too many girl friends). Yet in many hotels in which I've stayed in China, I've experienced (within a short time of checking into my room) a phone call asking me, "Did I want a girl for the night?" When you say, No! they'll ask if you want a boy? Although to be honest, the CPC's attitude to sex may be sourced back to the christian Taiping rebellion (in the mid eighteenth century) that nearly defeated the Qing government.

And the christian church (not just the J-double u's) loves a reformed sinner. The best story reformed prostitute story, I've come across in studying church history (in this case the Eastern Byzantine church) is the story of St. Mary of Egypt.

This St Mary, ran away from home at age 12 and became a street girl who loved sex so much that (sometimes) would not charge the men who used her services. Years later Mary decided to go on a pilgrimage to Jerusalem. She did'nt have enough money to pay for the boat trip, so worked her passage to Palestine laying on her back for the whole voyage.

When they got to Jerusalem and everyone off the boat (including the men who used her services) poured into the church for the festival. But when poor old Mary got to the church, some unseen force kept her out. In the story, she then realises what a terrible sinner she was, and on seeing an image of Mary Theotokos (mother of God Mary) she repents, praying for fogiveness and decides to give up the world. This Mary spent the rest of her life running around the desert as a hermit in constant prayer.

13

A New World is here, and YHWH's version is out of date

by fulltimestudent in

jw
friends

that highly emotive headline is just to have a wack at bible believers.

but the world around is showing so many signs of change, that it's certainly looking like something new is here.. for example, driverless cars and buses are now possible.

and its the buses that are already hitting the road.. watch this video, and say hello to the usa's olli:.

fulltimestudent

Betheliesalot : Maybe the WTS should charter some of these and fill them with up to date carts that can only hold 3 magazines. They would have a captive audience, and put a few video screens playing "just around the corner" as it goes around the corner...

Hey mate - what a great idea! Stuff the WT, in ten years, they won't have the money to do it.

But commercially!!! - if you have twenty of these things running a certain route, i.e. one ten seater every five minutes, rather than a sixty seater diesel guzzler every 20 minutes, The bus company would have a captive audience to run non-stop advertising videos. They'd be making more money than TV stations.

11

Another Aspect from which to View Prostitution

by fulltimestudent in

jw
friends

if we put on our western cultural (you know, the ones that say jesus made the world) eye-glasses we will 'see' prostitution as something bad.. the 'christian' influenced view is that prostitution is a criminal racket run by gangsters, and the women (and sometimes men) have either been bullied by their pimps, or drugged until they become addicts and forced to work in brothels.**.

some of that is likely true (at times), but is it always 'truth'?.

australia's government owned abc media network, has an article that invites us to take off our western cultural eye-glasses and see the world as it really is.

fulltimestudent

stan livedeath : ive never used the services of a prostitute,---simply because ive never met one--or know any.. ive dated loads of women. some have cost a lot of money in wining and dining--all for nothing. some have had sex with me for free--just for the asking. would i have used a prostitute--? course i would--if she was attractive and i had the money to spend.

Cool mate - and if you were much less good looking, or with a personality problem, or just old, and without a partner, you may also wish to use such a service. Again if you were physically damaged in some way, 'a sexual services carer,' ( a much nicer expression than the word 'prostitute') visiting you once a month would be quite acceptable, I'm sure.

And, yes! you usually get to choose one that is 'attractive' (I'm sure you mean in both a physical and spiritual sense) to you. In fact friends tell me that in many establishments you can arrange to talk briefly to a number of available women (or men, if you're a woman)

13

A New World is here, and YHWH's version is out of date

by fulltimestudent in

jw
friends

that highly emotive headline is just to have a wack at bible believers.

but the world around is showing so many signs of change, that it's certainly looking like something new is here.. for example, driverless cars and buses are now possible.

and its the buses that are already hitting the road.. watch this video, and say hello to the usa's olli:.

fulltimestudent

And what about a tram without rail-tracks. Steel rail tracks are replaced with a virtual track imprinted into the road surface.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kr9-J3nOKbE

Sydney (Aust) has had one of its main business (CBD) streets closed for 2+ years while the whole street has been ripped it to relocate services and lay tram tracks. The system illustrated would have avoided that major inconvenience.

Combine that with a facial recognition payment system, which would eliminate a slower card payment system and you may have a very efficient public transport system for CBD areas. Plan it right with a virtual ring track around the CBD and you could eliminate private cars from the CBD.

fulltimestudent

Posts by fulltimestudent

Grin! Don't Cadburys' make white chocolate also?