Posts by jabberwock

Amarillo Elder: "I don't know what to do, Watchtower. The economy is weak, it's weak. Anyway, if I had these lower convention rates, it puts us right back on top, you know. But these... these motel owners out here. They won't give it to me...Oh, Watchtower, I don't know what to do, I don't know what to do... "

WT Rep: "YOU CAN ACT LIKE A MAN!...I'm gonna make him an offer he won't refuse. Okay? I want you to leave it all to me. Go on, go back out in field service."

32

Amarillo City Representatives Went to Bethel--Look what they said...

by CrimsonBleu in

jw
friends

this email came from my sister.

i copied and pasted as is.

i'd like to reply with a comment to my sis, but maybe better keep quiet.... .

jabberwock

"And it was reported to me that some motels actually raised rates to the brothers giving no thought to possible consequences."

How exactly did they raise the rates for the brothers?

"Hi, our family would like to stay at you hotel. How much per night for a double?"

"$100.00 per night."

"Did I mention that we'll be attending the Jehovah's Witness convention?"

"Oh, well in that case it's $150.00 per night."

Unlikely and illegal. The motels probably just raised their rates for everyone and stopped giving group discounts because they were losing money.

10

The movie 'Doubt'

by sass_my_frass in

jw
friends

this has probably come up before but i thought it was worth suggesting: this movie is quite intense but meryl streep and philip hoffman are just magnificent (as always), and it really portrays what members of an organisation do when confronted with abuse.

the leaders of the church handle it internally, but if it's the leaders who are the perpetrators, what can be done?

it doesn't even occur to the members of the organisation to go to the police on their own; they trust the system they know.

jabberwock

A few people have mentioned that they feel Meryl Streep's character strictly held the priest to the rules and held him to the letter of the law.

I have to disagree.

The letter of the law would have her suppress her suspicions and obediently leave the matter in the hands of her superiors. Here she knowingly breaks the law in order to protect Donald Miller and the other children at the school. She clearly states her belief when she says, "When you take a step to address wrongdoing, you are taking a step away from God, but in his service."

Considering the inaction of others in the movie and in similar real life situations I rather admired her courage in saying, "I will step outside the church if that's what needs to be done, till the door should shut behind me! I will do what needs to be done, though I'm damned to Hell!"

If only more people had even just a fraction of her determination to expose wrongdoing and protect the innocent.

Whether her action was justified is purposely left unclear. If you are certain about whether or not the priest is guilty then I think you have missed the point of the movie.

I'm sure most people will be convinced of the priest's guilt. I was when I first watched the movie.

But, let me offer the following possibility:

Is it possible that Father Flynn is gay? This might have seriously upset his fellow priests and the parishioners in the parishes that he had to leave.

Is it also possible that he doesn't believe, contrary to church doctrine, that homosexuality is a sin? We know that he is an advocate for change within the church. Perhaps he hopes that a progressive church will eventually accept homosexuality as natural.

Could he know that Donald Miller is gay and have told him that it wasn't truly a sin?

I think it's possible though not necessarily likely.

25

What made me take "The Red Pill"?

by God_Delusion in

what made me open my eyes after 30 years and smell the coffee?

and why did i accept the red pill, but my parents and everyone else is content with the blue pill?.

has anyone done any research as to what wakes us up?.

jabberwock

Baba Yaga, that has been just my experience. Thanks for mentioning it.

LeavingWT, that describes me very well. I had doubts for awhile, but I never gave myself permission to consider them. I should check out Steve Hassan's book. It sounds helpful.

I would add that I was tired of the mental gymnastics required to fight my doubts and ignore anything that challenged my beliefs. My justifications for ignoring apostates, historians, archaeologists, scientists, and my own doubts just did not seem honest or convincing anymore.

148

"Remember, nobody can REALLY love you unless they know and love Jehovah first."

by AllTimeJeff in

"unless they know and love jehovah first.

they love "jehovah".

they discuss how to make sure that though they are in charge, everyone doesn't see them, they see the great and powerful jehovah.... oh.

jabberwock

I think this is an attempt to label all relationships with non-Witnesses as illegitimate and inferior. Now parents and elders can tell other Witnesses who are involved with non-Witnesses that their girlfriend, boyfriend, or spouse doesn't really love them. Such a thing would be impossible unless they knew and loved Jehovah.

Can you imagine how hurt those Witnesses with unbelieving mates must have felt when it was announced at the District Convention that their husband or wife doesn't really love them? How awful.

77

TED JARACZ' stroke, latest from Bethel heavy.

by yesidid in

jw
friends

according to a bethel heavy i know rather well,.

ted is paralysed down his right side,.

however his mind and speech remain unaffected.. .

jabberwock

My money is on Lawrence Bowen to be the next GB

How do you think that might affect GB decisions? What is he like?

54

Is The WTS Getting Desperate for Males? KM Aug 2009

by Hopscotch in

just thought this article was interesting in view of what has been said in the last couple of years on the forum about the declining number of elders and servants and those reaching out.

add to that the large percentage of young teenage boys who leave 'the truth'.

i can't ever remember this much space in a km being devoted to converting men.. para 2 states: "when a family head accepts the truth, he often influences others in the family to join him in pure worship".

jabberwock

There's an article in the August 15 Watchtower entitled, Did You Once Serve? Can You Serve Again?

As you might guess it is all about former elders and ministerial servants "reaching out" to serve again. It mentions that some may have stepped down due to health reasons or for their families. A significant portion of the article is directed towards those who were removed from their position because of "unwise conduct" or wrongdoing. It also acknowledges that some may have disagreed with the decision to remove them and as a result are bitter.

I'll try to find a physical copy and post a scan of the article.

72

2009 Drama Synopsis and Comments

by jabberwock in

jw
friends

this year's drama was based on the parable of the prodigal son.

the theme was "your brother was dead and came to life".

as some have probably heard, it is a modern day story based on that parable, so there are no fancy costumes or fake beards.. .

jabberwock

My mum cried the whole way home in the car about what a bad parent she was. Sounds like a really encouraging experience, this drama. Designed to make those with non-practicing children feel like complete crap for being "bad parents" and to make their darling children feel, well, like the devil reincarnate.

Chatelaine, I'm sorry that your mother felt that she was a bad parent after having seen the drama, but I must say that the drama did not demonize parents with unbelieving children. Still, I understand why she might have felt so bad about herself after the drama since it ends with the wayward son returning home and continuing as a Witness whereas you and your brother have not returned.

Still, you are right that the drama made use of an "emotional presentation" and "extreme representations".

38

Breaking News - Russia Close to Banning JWs Entirely YouTube Video

by cognac in

jw
friends

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-qy14yqx-0 - i'm not sure if i attached this right.....

jabberwock

Excellent comment drew sagan.

Jehovah's Witnesses have the right to practice their faith (personal association), or at least, should have that right. The question then arises as to particulair forms of behavior that fall inside of that association which are possibly detrimental to society.

Personally, I belive that if a state wants to interfere with the practices of a faith, it has to deal with official policy and not overall status. Legislation that restricts the types of public punishments members of a group can inflict on children (like disfellowshipping) could be an avenue worth exploring.