Thanks Jeffro! Before your threads, I read enthusiastically Alans's articles about 1914/607 a few years ago. I'm sure your posts have been as well received! Wish you the best!
cyberguy
JoinedPosts by cyberguy
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607 website - part 6
by Jeffro inpart 6 in the series.
part 1:http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/12/118445/2082380/post.ashx#2082380.
part 2:http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/12/118507/2083398/post.ashx#2083398.
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Slight Differance, Big Change Ephesians 4:1-16 and the NWT
by drew sagan inthe discussion of this text is taken in reference to a discussion i had with a jw elder i know.
most of the time the discussion focused on things not even worth discussing, two things did come up i thought i would examine with more detail because something seemed wrong.
one of these things i discussed here.
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cyberguy
As you point out Drew, the NWT (incorrectly) associates the “gifts” as “men,” rather than with the abilities that such “men” were given, as implied in every translation that I looked at thus far. However, as others have mentioned, I don’t see any support for an “organization” in these verses regardless of translation.
Drew, as you know, JW’s attack non-JW beliefs such as the Trinity, by saying that since the word “Trinity” isn’t found in the Bible, the Bible doesn’t teach it! Well, by the same line of reasoning, where is an “Organization” in the Bible? How about “Governing Body?” I’m sure we could come up with a huge list of JW-expressions and jargon that isn’t in the Bible. How ironic!
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Comments You Will Not Hear at the 8-27-06 WT Study (FOCUS ORGANIZATION)
by blondie incomments you will not hear at the 08-27-06 wt study (july 15, 2006, pages 19-24 )(focus on organization).
review comments will be in red.
wt material from today's wt will be in black.
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cyberguy
Blondie,
Thanks again for a review of yet another WT diarrhea-inducing article! This is one of the absolute worst! I’m sorry that I could only review a few paragraphs, but I did talk to others who have read it. It is absolutely an abomination! It isn’t “funny” either! It’s abhorrent! Unfortunately, my fleshly brother probably conducted the WT-study for this hideous, demonic monstrosity! He no longer talks to me because I’m of a lesser class than he and his family, because I raise questions about his devotion to the WT and GB!
Anyway, thanks again for covering this, but I had to pass on most of it because just a few paragraphs were too unsettling! Thanks Blondie, for covering this once again. Peace to you and family! Love-you folks!
Say, I hope your garden is going great! Nice to hear about your “normal” life when you mention it. I’d like to meet you and husband sometime!
With loving regards and PEACE to you and yours,
Cyber
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my story
by jaberwalkie inthis is a difficult thing for me to do, i used to be a jehovahs witness 20 years service as a pioneer.. last thursday it was announced from the platform at my local kingdom hall that i was disfellowshiped.. it was a bit of a shock.
i still have a deep sence of anger at what happened to me and its so unfair.. it started 3 years ago when i began to feel ill and i missed a couple of meetings.
the elders were wonderful and came round and cheered me up.
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cyberguy
Sorry to hear of your problems, jaberwalkie. How’s your health now? Are you on medication? Also, for what reason were you disfellowshiped? (If you care to answer—no pressure here if you do not.) Of course, for missing meetings, elders visited me and told me if I needed to confess serious sins (implying of course that I did), they were available to listen to my confession! This ridiculous, since it is simply a tactic to impute guilt to get someone so disturbed that the return to attending meetings.
Anyway, if you need continued medical help, please seek it out. And work on making friends, which may not be easy. This has been hard for me, but I’m making an effort. Please keep your chin up! The WT has messed with my brain for so long, that at times I simply don’t know how a “normal” person should act. But as time passes, I’m finding it does get easier! Yes, there is life and more happiness outside the JW-system!
Take care, God bless, peace!
Warmest,
Cyber
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Daniel's 3 year training and the 2nd year of Nebuchadnezzar.
by thirdwitness inthe previous 607 thread was locked down where the 587 defenders could not overcome the clear reasoning of the bible about the 40 year desolation of egypt.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/117647/1.ashx
but before it was locked down norm brought up a lot of points.
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cyberguy
Thirdwitness,
Who is this Watchtower + GB god that you put so much faith in?
Regards,
Cyber
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Daniel's 3 year training and the 2nd year of Nebuchadnezzar.
by thirdwitness inthe previous 607 thread was locked down where the 587 defenders could not overcome the clear reasoning of the bible about the 40 year desolation of egypt.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/117647/1.ashx
but before it was locked down norm brought up a lot of points.
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cyberguy
Here’s a question I posed to a high official at WT some time ago. I received no reply of course. I believe you’ll need to reconcile this one:
In Pay Attention to Daniel's Prophecy, p. 46 par. 2, the passage in Dan. 2:1, the "second year of the kingship of Nebuchadnezzar," is explained to mean not that actual 2nd year of his reign, but the 2nd year of his reign as world ruler, 606/605 B.C.E., or 2 years after destroying Jerusalem and its temple in 605 B.C.C.. Is this correct?
There seams to be a technical problem here, because two different people in Nebuchadnezzar's ruling cabinet, both having the same office of oversight, but are in office at the same! In Daniel 2:14-15, Arioch is mentioned as being the "chief to the king's bodyguard" (see Insight, Vol. 1, p. 163, Arioch #2). However, at Jer. 39:9-11, 13; 40:1-2,10, 43:6, 52:14-15, 16, 19, 24, 26, 30, Nebuzaradan is also said to be Nebuchadnezzar's "chief of the bodyguard." He is mentioned as the one, who directed the Babylonian operation of destroying the city of Jerusalem in 607 B.C.E. (see Insight Vol. 2., p. 482, Nebuzaradan). Furthermore, and here's the key point, 5 years later, which is long past the 606/605 B.C.E. date, Jer. 52:30 states "Nebuzaradan, as the chief of he bodyguard," took other Jews into exile, apparently those who had fled to surrounding territories.
If WT chronology is correct for Dan 2:1, then just who was "chief of the bodyguard" at that time? Obviously, this is an important point, because this would call into question whether or not Nebuchadnezzar is being identified as world ruler after destroying Jerusalem, rather than in his actual 2nd or 3rd year of reign (i.e., assuming an ascension-method of reckoning).
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A reply from Carl Jonsson:
Dear xxx,
I think you have made an important observation here! I have checked the original texts as well as a number of commentaries and dictionaries, and it is obvious that the title of Nebuzaradan, "commander of the guards (rab tabbachim)" is the same as the one used of Arioch at Daniel 2:14. The title there is written in Aramaic, so it is a little different (rab tabbachayya), but it cannot be questioned that it is the very same title. It is also an interesting fact that the name and title of Nebuzaradan has been found on a cuneiform tablet, a Neo-Babylonian administrative document from the reign of Nebuchadnezzar, where the Akkadian title may be transliterated as rab nuhatimmu, which has the same meaning as the Hebrew title.
So this is clearly another evidence against the Society's redating of Daniel 2:1 to the 20th year of Nebuchadnezzar. Thank you fro sharing this observation with me!
Carl Olof Jonsson
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Comments You Will Not Hear at the 8-6-2006 WT Study (CHOSEN NATION)
by blondie in"it is you jehovah your god has chosen to become his people.
are jw children born into god's chosen nation?
after pentecost 33 c.e., every individual...had to make a personal dedication to god and be baptized.
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cyberguy
I think this is one of your better reviews Blondie! The scriptures you mention, Acts 2:38, Acts 10:47-48, Acts 19:5, do not say anything about making a dedication. Like Acts 2:38 "Repent, and let each one of YOU be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for forgiveness of YOUR sins, and YOU will receive the free gift of the holy spirit,” simply requires repentance and baptism in the name of Jesus Christ brought forgiveness of sins.
When I first started to examine the teachings of JW’s, I of course saw some major doctrinal problems, but thought that much of it was still true. Of course, now I can see that they have corruption in everything!
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Special Issue - September, 2006 Awake! - All 32 Pages Scanned
by daniel-p ini've wanted to scan this issue as soon as i could get my hands on it, so here it is.
some of the pictures are little screwed up because of the scan resolution, but it's all readable.
hope you enjoy.. .
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cyberguy
More WT crap! Regarding the whales, don’t some whales have tiny vestigial “legs?” Of course WT would argue that they are not vestigial but are used in some capacity. As regards new arguments, I see none here, same old stuff! And why is it that some Christian groups can accept evolution, but others like the WT cannot? In my opinion, you downgrade the God of the Bible by insisting that the opinions of Bible writers (who never make explicit claims that God gave them special, scientific insight) are in reality, facts!
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Car Fatalities and Congregation responsibilities - 9/15/06 QfromReaders
by Midget-Sasquatch in.
looks like the wt is trying to instill diligence/greater caution within the rank and file who drive.
http://i75.imagethrust.com/images/2azn/view-image/question-from-readers-sept-15%2c-2006-wt.html
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cyberguy
I’m with you minimus! This QFR is crazy! However, this might give an excuse for those doing the “fade-thing” in that they can now claim that driving to the hall or out in “service” in inclement weather, is not advised. Therefore staying at home is the wise choice if the weather is bad!
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How Does the WT Explain this verse
by XBEHERE in(john 2:18-22) 18 therefore, in answer, the jews said to him: "what sign have you to show us, since you are doing these things?
" 19 in answer jesus said to them: "break down this temple, and in three days i will raise it up.
" 20 therefore the jews said: "this temple was built in forty-six years, and will you raise it up in three days?
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cyberguy
*** w73 6/1 pp. 350-351 Questions from Readers ***
• Does not John 2:19 indicate that Jesus would resurrect himself?—U.S.A.
As evident from the context, John 2:19 pertains to the death and resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ. We read: “Jesus said to them: ‘Break down this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.’ Therefore the Jews said: ‘This temple was built in forty-six years, and will you raise it up in three days?’ But he was talking about the temple of his body. When, though, he was raised up from the dead, his disciples called to mind that he used to say this; and they believed the Scripture and the saying that Jesus said:”—John 2:19-22.
It should be noted that, in telling about the fulfillment of Jesus’ statement, the Bible does not say ‘he raised himself up from the dead,’ but “he was raised up from the dead.” Other scriptures clearly show that God was the One who resurrected his Son. The apostle Peter told Cornelius and his relatives and close friends: “God raised this One up on the third day.” (Acts 10:40) Hebrews 13:20 speaks of God as the One “who brought up from the dead the great shepherd of the sheep with the blood of an everlasting covenant, our Lord Jesus.” And, in his letter to the Romans, the apostle Paul wrote: “If, now, the spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwells in you, he that raised up Christ Jesus from the dead will also make your mortal bodies alive through his spirit that resides in you.” (Rom. 8:11) Accordingly, Jesus Christ simply could not have meant that he would raise himself up from the dead.
Jesus, however, did know that he was going to die and be resurrected. On another occasion he told unbelieving scribes and Pharisees: “A wicked and adulterous generation keeps on seeking for a sign, but no sign will be given it except the sign of Jonah the prophet. For just as Jonah was in the belly of the huge fish three days and three nights, so the Son of man will be in the heart of the earth three days and three nights.” (Matt. 12:39, 40) Having this advance knowledge about his death and resurrection, Jesus, in a predictive sense, could speak of ‘raising up the temple of his body.’ Since he foretold it, it was just as if he was going to do it. This might be illustrated with Ezekiel 43:3, where the prophet Ezekiel states: “I came to bring the city [Jerusalem] to ruin,” that is, by foretelling its destruction. Ezekiel as an exile in Babylon had no part in actually destroying Jerusalem; that was done by the Babylonians. But his prophecy, being divinely inspired, made it as good as done. (Compare also Jeremiah 1:10.) Similarly, Jehovah God resurrected his Son, but Jesus could speak of doing so in a prophetic sense.
Moreover, God’s will, charge or command respecting his Son was that he die and be restored to life. Jesus willingly surrendered his life in harmony with his Father’s purpose. Jesus could therefore raise up the temple of his body in the sense that he had the authority to receive life again.
On the third day God commanded Jesus to rise from the dead, and he did so by accepting or receiving life at his Father’s hand, by God’s authority. Along with life as a spirit Son, he received the right to perfect human life that, by dying in full innocence, he had not forfeited. This merit of his human sacrifice he thereafter presented to his Father in heaven. (Heb. 9:11-14, 24-28) This is in agreement with Jesus’ words at John 10:17, 18: “The Father loves me because I lay down my life, to receive it back again. No one has robbed me of it; I am laying it down of my own free will. I have the right to lay it down, and I have the right to receive it back again; this charge I have received from my Father.”—New English Bible.