Posts by slimboyfat

41

How many JWs actually died in Nazi camps

by dogon in

the jws have tried to pad the number of jws in camps.

how many actually went and how many died?

can you site the source also?

slimboyfat

I agree with that totally. Many signed and you don't hear about that in the Watchtower. Motivations were complex and messy and you don't hear about that in the Watchtower either.

But when OC goes off on one, claiming it was little more than self-interest, for men to avoid serving on the front, and that JWs were better fed than other people in Europe. I think that's just bitter talk, to the point of being unhinged. It's patently ridiculous for example to say it was in August Dickmann's interest not to compromise. And considering JWs faced starvation on the death marches it is simply in bad taste. Which pains me to say, because I have enjoyed many of OC's posts.

The comment reminded me of Bill O'Reilly's recent comments that slaves were provided with good accommodation and food.

https://youtu.be/hq5tNXX7vY4

41

How many JWs actually died in Nazi camps

by dogon in

the jws have tried to pad the number of jws in camps.

how many actually went and how many died?

can you site the source also?

slimboyfat

Have you read the stories of August Dickmann, Horst Schmidt or Leopold Engleitner? Can you explain how it served their own selfish interests not to sign the declaration? They had every reason to believe not signing or not cooperating meant their death, and in Dickmann's case it did.

The facf that some signed the declaration doesn't detract from the fact many didn't.

The fact that many had complex motivations (peer pressure among JWs was another you didn't mention) doesn't detract from the many heroic acts of defiance against the Nazis.

29

Lying In Wait At a Bed & Breakfast

by Cold Steel in

a few years ago while traveling in the northeast, my wife and i stopped in new haven, connecticut, at a b&b we'd reserved for the night.

no sooner had we unpacked and moved into the living room for tea and treats, our hosts began to talk about religion, and we learned they were jehovah's witnesses.

i didn't mind so much, but my wife was outraged that our hosts would use their place of business as a launching point to do missionary work.

slimboyfat

I guess this was before trip advisor? They'd probably think twice before pulling a stunt like that nowadays.

41

How many JWs actually died in Nazi camps

by dogon in

the jws have tried to pad the number of jws in camps.

how many actually went and how many died?

can you site the source also?

slimboyfat

Some of the JWs who signed the declaration did so as a form of "theocratic warfare". And that others did so as a result of pressure... is hardly surprising given the circumstances.

41

How many JWs actually died in Nazi camps

by dogon in

the jws have tried to pad the number of jws in camps.

how many actually went and how many died?

can you site the source also?

slimboyfat

Wikipedia has the correct numbers from Detlef Garbe the leading expert on this topic. There were 20,000 JWs in Nazi Germany, 10,000 were imprisoned, 2000 of them in concentration camps, and around 1200 died in custody including 250 who were executed.

This is the book to read on the topic.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Between-Resistance-Martyrdom-Jehovahs-Witnesses/dp/0299207943

JWs opposed Nazism before the Nazis even took power.

21

Are the Elders harder on Women

by Steel in

i was having a discussion with an old friend last night.

her parents are divorced and his mother never became “one of jehovah witnesses “ .

long story short she claims elders are generally hardier on women than men.

slimboyfat

I think elders are harder on non-elders, and since women can never be elders if follows in general they're harder on women. Aren't there even rules in the elders book that says an elder should be removed for a sin that would merit DFing for a non-elder. There are double standards.

To show it's not just a women thing, consider any long term non-appointed males or perpetual MS in the congregation. They were generally treated as pretty useless or with general suspicion if they were not "good enough" to be made up to an elder. If they landed in any trouble or dispute, their non-elder status was definitely held against them.

41

David Splane on the "older members" of the GB

by Richard_I in

jw
friends

in the august broadcast, david splane is shown in a morning worship video.

i just wanted to focus on the end of the video, were he has this to say:.

the governing body loves to get together and discuss the bible.

slimboyfat

Jaracz was authoritarian and unfriendly. Barr was a yes man and very friendly. From what I gather from comments of people who knew them. So Splane is appealing to two very different kinds of nostalgia here. The nostalgia for firm leadership (from Jaracz) on the one hand, and the nostalgia for old fashioned humble anointed brothers (like Barr) on the other. None of which is in evidence in the current GB.

Plus I suspect it is no coincidence that there chages came after Jaracz died. It's easy to imagine him blocking cutting the book study or the magazines. The rumours that he held back change are probably well founded, the denials only tending to confirm the suspicion.

67

Recent mistakes of the Governing Body contributing to the decline of JWs

by slimboyfat in

they have made so many strategical mistakes it's hard to keep track.

some changes within the last decade or so that are contributing to declining numbers of jws:.

1. elimination of book study groups, the most informal, enjoyable and sociable of the jw meetings, contributed to loss of sense of community among jws.. 2. policy of consolidating kingdom halls.

slimboyfat

Yes very good point!

They used to quote Russell all the time: "if the God of heaven who owns all the gold in the world ever has to beg for money to keep this magazine in print it will be a sign to give up publication". (Very rough paraphrase)

It would be interesting to know when they last used that quote!

67

Recent mistakes of the Governing Body contributing to the decline of JWs

by slimboyfat in

they have made so many strategical mistakes it's hard to keep track.

some changes within the last decade or so that are contributing to declining numbers of jws:.

1. elimination of book study groups, the most informal, enjoyable and sociable of the jw meetings, contributed to loss of sense of community among jws.. 2. policy of consolidating kingdom halls.

slimboyfat

Actually JWs flourished at the height of modernity when reason reigned supreme. It's pluralism, relativism and postmodernism that are causing JWs and other exclusivist religions real problems.

41

David Splane on the "older members" of the GB

by Richard_I in

jw
friends

in the august broadcast, david splane is shown in a morning worship video.

i just wanted to focus on the end of the video, were he has this to say:.

the governing body loves to get together and discuss the bible.

slimboyfat

I think its funny to have to mention that the "Faithful Slave' liked to - you know - read the bible and discuss it and like it.
Does he think that the R&F dont think they GB reads it?
Like Mickey Mantle saying - you know I just like hitting playing baseball.

He may have in mind Raymond Franz's book Crisis of Conscience which states that while he was on the Governing Body the Bible was rarely referred to during discussions, which focused heavily on technical aspects of policy and discipline in the congregations.