Posts by ellderwho

251

Is Jesus Christ and Michael the ArchAngel one and the same person?

by booker-t in

i must admit that as a jw i never really swallowed this belief maybe because i was so young when i was really a staunch jw.

i would have born-again christians tell me that it was impossible for jesus and michael to be the same person and that jw's invented this doctrine.

fast forward to 2004 while i was reading a book on jesus i noticed that some of the early church fathers thought michael was jesus christ i almost fell out of my chair.

ellderwho

"Jesus" is simply Michael's earthly name. Similarly, the names of other persons were changed. Abram was changed to Abraham. Sari (spelling ?) was changed to Sarah.
Was Michael raised from the dead or was it Jesus?
That's fairly obvious, isn't it, since they are one and the same person.

According to your logic then Michael was raised, because he was no longer in a earthly body and returned to the Father in heaven.

You still do not answer the question what happened to Michael in heaven?

Or better yet what came down from heaven?

73

New 607 info?

by startingover in

i just discovered something i have not seen anywhere before.

i was looking at my old "all scripture inspired" book, and i say old because it was the first edition from 1963 and i had used it for years.

according to the wt cd there were revisions in 1983 and 1990. i came across this little goodie under the book of daniel.

ellderwho

, after that ask yourself who else publishes bible literature in 400 languages in 235 lands. GOOD NEWS PREACHED TO ALL THE EARTH.

The WTBS is comes up small, compared to the Mormons. And theres 15 million of them, and there considered small.

251

Is Jesus Christ and Michael the ArchAngel one and the same person?

by booker-t in

i must admit that as a jw i never really swallowed this belief maybe because i was so young when i was really a staunch jw.

i would have born-again christians tell me that it was impossible for jesus and michael to be the same person and that jw's invented this doctrine.

fast forward to 2004 while i was reading a book on jesus i noticed that some of the early church fathers thought michael was jesus christ i almost fell out of my chair.

ellderwho

I have been enjoying this discussion, and in particular you're input. I too believe that Jesus and Michael are one and the same individual.

What happened to Michael while Jesus was on earth?

Was Michael raised from the dead or was it Jesus?

73

New 607 info?

by startingover in

i just discovered something i have not seen anywhere before.

i was looking at my old "all scripture inspired" book, and i say old because it was the first edition from 1963 and i had used it for years.

according to the wt cd there were revisions in 1983 and 1990. i came across this little goodie under the book of daniel.

Is Jesus Christ and Michael the ArchAngel one and the same person?

by booker-t in

i must admit that as a jw i never really swallowed this belief maybe because i was so young when i was really a staunch jw.

i would have born-again christians tell me that it was impossible for jesus and michael to be the same person and that jw's invented this doctrine.

fast forward to 2004 while i was reading a book on jesus i noticed that some of the early church fathers thought michael was jesus christ i almost fell out of my chair.

ellderwho

Sabrina: I think it is reasonable to believe that since Jesus had a pre-human existence and since he was God's firstborn son and loved his Father so very much that he would be the one taking the lead in fighting against his Father's enemies in heaven.

What then was Jesus' name in his pre-human existance?

And what happaned to that "pre-existance" form?

251

Is Jesus Christ and Michael the ArchAngel one and the same person?

by booker-t in

i must admit that as a jw i never really swallowed this belief maybe because i was so young when i was really a staunch jw.

i would have born-again christians tell me that it was impossible for jesus and michael to be the same person and that jw's invented this doctrine.

fast forward to 2004 while i was reading a book on jesus i noticed that some of the early church fathers thought michael was jesus christ i almost fell out of my chair.

ellderwho

Booker-t: I think JW's are right on this doctrine about Jesus being Michael. I still feel that the JW's are wrong on some other doctrinal matters but I feel they are right on the money with this one.

What happened to Michael in heaven while Jesus was on earth?

37

Good excuses for missing meetings and going out in service.

by frankiespeakin in

.

i know a lot of lurkers are probably looking for good excuses and would like a list they could refur to..

ellderwho

laters kaykay_mp

I love your avatar. I found it rather easy not to go. Work schedule.

13

NEW: Review of the circuit assembly. Darn!!!

by Doubtfully Yours in

so, not only do i have to greatly sacrifice mentally by going to the darn assemblies 3x yearly, but now they've made it so that you have to pay attention and take notes because there'll be a review with questions and answers at the following meetings.. gosh, the mind control never stops!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.

comments anyone?!.

dy

ellderwho

The assembly events were great!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I had the best naps!
I had the best clothes there!
And I got new shoes!
Wow I guess I wasn't there for the right reasons!
Brooke

ROFLMAO! Thats hilarious, Its never about spiritual food or any of that nonsense, its about checkin out whos best dressed and tryin to look like you havent worn that outfit before. But taking a nap is truely a golden nugget, and to get away with it, is the best, then act like nothing happened. What a room full of clowns.

64

James 4:5 -- A Quote From a Lost Apocryphal Scripture

by Leolaia in

in defense of its fundamentalist approach to the bible and especially its belief that the bible is the word of god and inerrent, the wts frequently quotes from 2 timothy 3:16: "all scripture is inspired of god and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness".

we must've heard this scripture thousands of times as witnesses.

the words from eldad and modad quoted in hermas, vis.

ellderwho

Nark: other books in your list are not concerned with history at all. Again, what does that prove? Historical accuracy is hardly a criterium to distinguish between "baby" and "bathwater" (as you said earlier).

Im just asking simple questions.

Actually 1 Maccabees is more reliable historically and chronologically

How about 4:26-35 which contradicts 2 Macc. 10:37-11:12, which would put Lsysia's defeat after the death of Timothy, 4:30-35 contradicts 2Macc. 11:6-15 which says it was a negotiated peace, 6:8-9 contradicts 2Macc. 9:5-12, which says that the king was struck with a replusive physical disease?

1Esdras has chronology listed, however doesnt 5:56 have 2nd year of Cyrus, should be 2nd year of Darius? ( Cyrus died 2 years before reign of Darius)

Leolaia, thanks for your patience.

64

James 4:5 -- A Quote From a Lost Apocryphal Scripture

by Leolaia in

in defense of its fundamentalist approach to the bible and especially its belief that the bible is the word of god and inerrent, the wts frequently quotes from 2 timothy 3:16: "all scripture is inspired of god and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness".

we must've heard this scripture thousands of times as witnesses.

the words from eldad and modad quoted in hermas, vis.

ellderwho

Thanks Leolaia.

Do you know if Philo ever quoted the apocrypha?

Also I cant find any church father who endorsed the apocrypha books.

......... pseudepigraphal books,

Are these just re-writes of books that were outside the OT canon?

2) Tobit's chronology is obviously fanciful; so is Daniel's; or Genesis'; or Luke's...

And 1 and 2 Maccabees, 1and 2 Esdras, Judith, Esther Additions, Sirach, Baruch, Epistle of Jeremiah, Bel and the Dragon.....