Just had my first ever study with a JW

by jaffacake 15 Replies latest jw friends

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  jaffacake

  I wanted to ask questions about the organisation, but he looked me in the eye & ignored my questions to pursue his agenda.

  He listed about 15 topics for us to study, to prove only JWs are based on 1st century Christianity. I got him to agree not to attack other religions, (proving them false does not prove JWs true) He agreed with this but then went on to criticise other religions! Next week I'll be firmer on this point!

  He said all Christians had to preach, but he did not preach the gospel to me, just doctrine based on the Bible, to prove only JWs were right. When he left, I noticed what was missing: -

  ie The good news about the Christ, and that He died for all sinners, so whoever believes in Him & repents is forgiven, and has eternal life. Isn't this what they preached in the first century? And weren't people converted very quickly without much study?

  Instead of following the Scriptural example & preaching the good news to convert first, and only then preach to the converted eg advice on how to maintain standards etc, he seemed to approach these detailed lesser topics first - very strange!

  I'll try to get him to discuss this true gospel message next week! Thanks for moral support of this group, I couldn't do this without you all.
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  trevor

  Jaffacake

  I see from your profile that you want to find out what your JW friends are thinking. Click on my profile and read my biography - for information on offer.
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  BrendaCloutier

  Good job Jaffe. Interesting to see how robitic bible study has become. It wasn't like that when I was out there..... and that was many many years ago.
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  EvilForce

  Keep holding him to not talking bad about other religions....they will invariably have a hard time not to. The smugness of "we're right they're wrong will continue to come thru".
  
  Also, really dig into the 1914 math. Have him explain the "time, time, and half a time" issue. Really try to comprehend how it works, not just accept it. Don't accept "a day for a year" in an unrelated book of the bible to figure out the end of the Gentile Times. Also, if you challenge him/her to show you in other books about 607 BCE and Babylon. This is one of the witnesses FUNDAMENTAL reasons for existence. They preach these are the last days and Jesus returned invisibly to heaven in 1914, thus the great seperating work. If the 1914 thing doesn't jive to you, the whole reason for being as a religion falls apart.
  
  Or at least it fell apart for me there. If the main foundation of the belief structure is flawed how can the religion be anything but a house built on sand.
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  bebu

  Hi Jaffa,

  It is very hard not to have a long period of discussion with JWs, once you know all their achilles heels.

  I've had some good discussions; I figure that with the majority of them, whom I will probably never meet again, it will be enough to give them some news flashes about troubles in their org. Thanks to the internet, most will have opportunity to investigate about my challenges, and this will make a difference--if any difference could be made.

  I do recommend that you not let him lead. Let them know that after they answer some of the burning questions you've come up with, that you would consider going on to the other things they want to teach/discuss. In other words, let it be known that you've researched into 607 BC, and found a whole lot of problems with it. Give him website links. Tell him that you've heard that the WTS believes the UN is the scarlet beast... but that you've found on the UN website a notice for enquirers that they were secretly NGOs under the UN for 10 years! After he gets back with his "defense", bring another problem into the ring... Rand Cam, whether Jesus is their mediator, etc. don't do it all at once, though, or he'll write you off as not really interested.

  Without going to these things first, they will NEVER be answered, for if they feel sure that they have neatly proven themselves as the "true" religion, then they will insist on your having faith for your answers! That is, after they have shown you their cardboard tailoring certificates, they will insist that you must now take the emperor's clothes by faith.

  Don't be afraid to be firm! I don't mean nasty, but firm. Plant your feet firmly by stating that you think God will not expect us to be satisfied with shabby logic and shabby answers; that you are sure that God expects us to be careful and thorough, and you will not be rushed. You can claim the high moral ground here, for it is absolutely yours.

  bebu
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  Freedom Fighter

  Well done Jaffa - you're doing a great job. What you are doing for your friend is truly amazing.

  FF
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  adelmaal

  jaff:

  if he's the typical jw then he'll give you the whole "you must first take milk before solid food" spiel. he will want to cover all the basics with you in order right in the book so he can methodically brainwash you by having a bookstudy as opposed to a bible study. he will make sure to try to keep you on topic and explain that this is so you will not get confused or sidetracked. he will try to convince you that all your questions will be answered methodically as your study develops.

  you are quite daring to undertake this. you're friend must be very important to you.

  hang in there!

  -aryn
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  love11

  Hi Jaffa-

  I'm not sure why you have to go through all of this mental mind games they play. I honestly don't mean to sound rude, but is your friend this important to you that you feel you need to talk to people like this to try and understand him better? Just be careful- Fanatical people are not to be messed with, they're too unstable.

  The reason he keeps darting the subject is because brainwashing happens slowly and it sounds like you are trying to get right to the heart of the matter. They don't like that. IMHO

  ps. You did a great job handling yourself and hopefully next time he will be more open to listen to you.

  love11
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  Valis

  hi jaff...I hope you went and watched some porn or an R rated movie afterwards...*LOL*

  ie The good news about the Christ, and that He died for all sinners, so whoever believes in Him & repents is forgiven, and has eternal life.

  Anyway your statement here is probably the simplest way for Christians to live and also a question that can stop any dub in their tracks. if that is all that required then there is no proof that other Christian religions cannot help one achieve such a simple goal. So, if you are a good person, believe in jesus, go to church, pray, love your neighbor and do charitable works, who are the dubs to say you can't be saved at the Biblical Armageddon? They are the classic case of faith hijacking works big time. Have fun with them!

  Sincerely,

  District Overbeer
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  barry

  Gday Jaffa,

  I remember you saying you are SDA or exSDA. Im an SDA. There are some articals on this site you could use from where the JWs quote SDA writers such as George McCready Price, Robert Gentry and Edwin Theile and are often quoted out of context.

  You could use the material here by Alanf and others and you JW teacher wouldnt suspect you getting information from any apostate site but would haveing a hard time answering baggage you have from being an SDA.

  You started with youre teacher the best and ony way with the gospel.