Jesus last statements

nowuask

I was thinking what were Jesus last seven statements, & what were there meanings? It would be after his cruification & before his official death. Any thoughts?

Neo

These were his seven last sayings according to the Gospels, in canonical sequence:

(1) ?Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?? (Matthew 27:46; Mark 15:34).

(2) ?Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do.? (Luke 23:34).

(3) ?And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise? (Luke 23:43).

(4) ?Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit? (Luke 23:46).

(5) ?When Jesus therefore saw his mother, and the disciple standing by, whom he loved, he saith unto his mother, Woman, behold thy son! Then saith he to the disciple, Behold thy mother! And from that hour that disciple took her unto his own home? (John 19:26-27).

(6) ?I thirst? (John 19:28).

(7) ?When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, ?It is finished!? and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost? (John 19:30).

They are arranged in the typical 4+3 division of seven: 4 in the Synoptics and 3 in John. Was it a deliberate choice so that they'd all add up to seven, the Bible's premier number?

Robert K Stock

When Jesus said "My God my God why have you forsaken me?" He finally realized he was not the Messiah, just a deluded human being who was going to die and stay dead.

I doubt that he said anything more then that one sentence.

Narkissos

Only by a harmonising reading do we find seven statements.

Mark and Matthew have one, which is rejected by the other two.

Luke has two (23:43, inventing a "repentent evildoer" in plain opposition to Mark, and 46); the third one is added later (23:34) as manuscript evidence shows.

John has three.

Neo

Only by a harmonising reading do we find seven statements.

Exactly. That's why I asked myself the above question about deliberation. Have you ever thought if an editor, being familiar with the pervasiveness of the number seven in Jewish/Christian literature (including not-as-explicit sevenfold counts; e.g., the seven blessings in Revelation) arranged them so that they would add up to seven, because of its literary and religious appeal? (say, for example, the Lk 23:34 addition)

Narkissos

Neo,

Interesting idea: adding (or maintaining) Luke 23:34 to reach the "right number"... the "seven words" are a fairly frequent subject of meditation in the Western Middle Ages and in later Protestant pietism, but they were still not generally recognised as "seven" in the 5th century as the manuscript evidence shows.

Pleasuredome

"at least i dont have to wear those bloody sandals anymore"

peacefulpete

The Diatessaron includes the Luke 23:34 phrase. Does this mean the phrase ought to be regarded as part of Luke's work or that it krept intp Luke from the Diatessaron or other source?

Narkissos

The Diatessaron includes the Luke 23:34 phrase

The Arabic version does, but how ancient is it in the Diatessaron history? Does Ephrem or other witnesses mention it?

startingover

Robert:

When Jesus said "My God my God why have you forsaken me?" He finally realized he was not the Messiah, just a deluded human being who was going to die and stay dead.
I doubt that he said anything more then that one sentence.

For some time now I have seriously doubted the very existence of Jesus, and at the very most thought he may have existed but only as some charismatic man who had a few people looking up to him, not unlike Jim Jones or David Koresh. Your above statement is something I never thought about, but fits perfectly with the scenario I imagine, a "deluded" man with followers that could not accept the fact their leader was not what he claimed and created a fantasy.

Thanks for the post.

Jesus last statements

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