Who owns the Kingdom Halls?

No Apologies

On another thread ( http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/86931/2.ashx ) I saw these comments:

think again, the kingdom halls are paid for by the local witnesses, and when its paid off, its donated back to the WT Society, What an elaborate scheme!!!

When the construction is finished the congo finally has it's own KH, right? Wrong. They have to cede it to the WTS.

This seems to be a common perception, at least among xJWs. However what I want to know is, is there any truth to it? In my experience here in the U.S., each congregation forms a legal corporation for the main purpose of holding property, i.e. the local Kingdom Hall. Furthermore, each time I have heard about a Hall being sold, I have never anything said about involving the Society, which I would think would be the case if the Society did in fact own the Kingdom Hall.

Also, I would think the legal liability to the Society would far outweigh any financial advantage, especially when they are trying to distance themselves as far as they can legally from the individual congregations.

And yes, I have heard about the congregation in Texas back in the 80's that 'seceded' from the Borg and took the Hall with them. I think though, that their response to this was to make sure they were listed as lienholders on as many Kingdom Halls as possible.

So I think their real aim is to keep as many Halls in perpetual debt to the Society, owned by the local congregations, but not completely paid for.

No Apologies

fairchild

Wow, that's a really good question. I have never even wondered who owns the Kingdom halls. Can't wait until someone enlightens us here.

IP_SEC

If ther is a SKF loan, the local congregation owns the hall about as much as you own your house if you have a mortgage.

Once it is paid for the local congregation owns it, not the society. I've never heard of a hall being 'donated' back to the branch.

Here is the racket. The SKF loans you the money for the hall, and you pay that back (rather swiftly I might add) with interest. Now say you want to build a new hall 10 or 15 years down the road. You collect money, sell your hall and get a new loan. Now to pay the loan down the local congo WILL give the society the proceeds from the old hall's sale, any of the specific new hall donations, and eventually the loan the loan back to the society.

Pretty good deal huh? They dont need title to the hall, the resources are eventually at their disposal anyhow.

Marvin Shilmer

Hello, No Apologies

So long as a congregation remains solvent it has use of the Kingdom Hall. But should a congregation dissolve then the WTS has instructed that congregations take measures today to ensure that the Kingdom Hall property assets go to the WTS. Under the subheading ARTICLES OF INCORPORATION, in a directive dated March 1, 2000 the WTS writes:

?Please note that the following two paragraphs are to be included in your charter or articles of incorporation (this may require an amendment to your existing charter or articles of incorporation):
....
?Upon the winding up and dissolution of this Corporation, after paying or adequately providing for debts and obligations of the Corporation, the remaining assets shall be distributed to the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of New York, Inc?.?

Above I have quoted the relevant portion of the document. Of the two paragraphs mentioned in the outset, I have omitted the first paragraph and included the opening sentence of the second paragraph. The information omitted is typical language and does not alter or modify the portion quoted above.

Each year since the March 1, 2000 directive was issued COs have been instructed to inquire that the indicated provision has been amended into the congregations charter or articles of incorporation, whichever is applicable.

There is truth to what you have heard.

Marvin Shilmer

IP_SEC

Old hall sale $50,000.00
Collections $10,000.00
Loan $120,000.00 7 years at 2%
Total interest $8695.00
_____________________
Net profit to the Society $78,695.00

15 years later the congregations decide to build again

Old hall sale $400,000.00
Collections $15,000.00
loan amount $80,000.00 7 years at 3%
Total interest $8793.00
______________________
Net profit to the Society $423793.00

Total profit to the society for financing 200,000.00 in loan amount over 15 years

$502,488.00

Yes the numbers are speculative and not based on a real transaction, but I believe they are an accurate representation of the
SKF racket

IP_SEC

Marvin is that in a BOE letter? Or CO only letter?

Thanks

hillary_step

Marvin,

Yes, thanks for that.

If you recall a couple of years ago or so, the WTS sent a directive to all its congregations around the world encouraging them to upgrade ( at the publishers expense ) and enlarge if the capability existed ( at the publishers expense ), the Kingom Hall's which in every practical way belong to the WTS. The trusteeship granted to the local elders is just that and nothing else.

Try to imagine if you can, the value in assets that the WTS would need to declare if they had to report the values of each Kingdom Hall which they to all intents and purposes own. It is about time the Governments which tolerate the WTS within its borders realized just what a monstrously wealthy organization it really is.

Of course, if the governments do decide to tax the WTS property as a corporation rather than a religion, the burden for the taxes of the local KH's will be borne by the hapless publishers.

Best regards - HS

Marvin Shilmer

Hello, IP SEC

The information I presented is a directive dated March 1, 2000 that was sent as an enclose with a BOE letter dated April 1, 2000. According to the April 1, 2000 letter COs and DOs were copied with both.

Though I do not currently have the copy in my library, COs were given a letter of instruction to check that congregations acted on the March 1, 2000 directive. This is also evidenced by a small change to the S-303 forms used by COs to report to the WTS on a congregation?s activity. The change is the addition of a single sentence in the line-item of reminders on page two. The added reminder reads:

Are the congregations property documents up-to-date, and has the annual safety inspection been performed?

The two items indicated in the above line-item reminder are the subjects of the April 1, 2000 BOE letter. The updating was the charter/article of incorporation changes.

Marvin Shilmer

Elsewhere

I just did a quick search for any KH here in the Dallas TX area and the first one I found was:

Address: 1231 STEVENS RIDGE DR
Market Area: 1DSK06
Mapsco: 43-Y (DALLAS)

Legal Desc

1:	STEVENS PARK CHRISTIAN CHURCH ADD
2:	BLK 2/6166 LT 11 AC 1.2023 (CALC)
3:
4:	VOL86124/1100 CO-DALLAS
5:	6166 002 011 2006166 002
	Deed Transfer Date: 6/13/1986

Value

2004 Certified Values
Improvement: Land: Market Value:	$5,170 + $26,190 = $31,360
Revaluation Year:	2003
Previous Revaluation Year:	2000

Year

Owner

Legal Description

2004

BACAK ALBERT ET AL TR OF
BEVERLY HLLS CNGR OF J W
1401 STAFFORD ST
DALLAS, TEXAS 75208-1436

1:	STEVENS PARK CHRISTIAN CHURCH ADD
2:	BLK 2/6166 LT 11 AC 1.2023 (CALC)
3:
4:	VOL86124/1100 CO-DALLAS
5:	6166 002 011 2006166 002

Euphemism

My dad (a true blue dub) tells this story; apparently he doesn't feel that it reflects at all badly on the WTS.

Back in the 80's, Assembly Hall ownership was handled similarily to how KHs are handled now. A large group of elders acted as voting members of a non-profit corporation which owned the property.

Sometime in the mid 80's, the WTS decided that they wanted to take over ownership of the Assembly Halls. So, at a corporation meeting, papers were passed around for all the elders to sign, transferring the property to the WTS. My dad and his fellow elders laughed at the shallowness of their role as trustees, but they still signed the papers.

So it's true that the local congregations technically own the hall. But unless a whole congregation breaks away from the WTS at once, the Society can have the property any time it wants.

Who owns the Kingdom Halls?

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