What's your take on morality?

by Narkissos 42 Replies latest jw friends

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  Narkissos

  As former JWs we were part of a highly moralising religion. We have experienced the disastrous consequences of it in terms of hypocrisy, judgementalism or pathologic guilt. Most of us have changed our "moral parameters" drastically, but how far have we gone in questioning morality itself?

  Do you still believe in some (personal or social) "ethical code," even if it's worlds apart from the JW system? Do the categories of "good" and "bad," "right" and "wrong," play an important part in your life and/or talk? Or do you tend to see morals as basically pointless, even though perhaps socially unavoidable? Do you feel the need to teach some "moral values" to your children, for instance?

  My question is not about what you think is "good" or "bad," nor even what the distinction is "based on"; it's rather whether you believe in such "absolute values" or not, beyond the simple logic of causes and consequences. And that is not about religion: there might be amoral believers and moral unbelievers...

  Just thought it might be an interesting discussion with such a nice bunch of apostates.
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  Pole

  I only have one absolute criterion of morality. The criterion of harm. If doing harm cannot be avoided in making a moral choice, I try to go for the lesser harm.
  
  So much for theory.
  
  Pole
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  Euphemism

  Theoretically, no, I don't believe in any sort of absolute morality. Morality is a human feeling, which evolved because of its usefulness in promoting cooperative (non-zero-sum) behaviors and discouraging destructive ones.

  In practice, however, we have to live with a lot of evolutionary illusions (love, morality, reason, etc). Like most people, my personal morality is based more on intuition than philosophy. I think that my cardinal priinciples are: respect personal autonomy (including your own), be compassionate, consider consequences (even indirect or far-reaching ones), and avoid extremes.

  As far as theoretical ethical frameworks, consequentialist utilitarianism makes the most sense to me. Its usefulness for day-to-day ethical decisions, however, is rather limited.
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  minimus

  i prefer immorality.
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  talesin

  what Euph said.

  t

  *anarchist class*
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  Abaddon

  Me too; do what thou wilt but do no harm.

  Of course, 'harm' is a semantic mindfield, but then so is 'nice' and 'set'. If we are all sensible we know in our bellies what harm is.

  Sometimes we have to choose the lesser harm though...

  Of course, with that what I try to get over to my kids is a respect for others, a belief in reason, a belief in one's rights and potential.

  It's not really codified do's and don'ts beyond what's reasonable for their safety at that age.

  With law codes come the reduction of personal responsibility, the sanction of doing something because it is legal - albeit harmful. Yes we do need them; murder, violence, theft, public safety (i.e. traffic laws etc.). I think if you learn the principles one should follow then you take responsibility for your actions in a far more powerful way than if you follow some 'law'.

  Put it this way; a gay sadomasochist (as in consensual BDSM) is no less likely to be a 'good person' than a heterosexual carpenter.

  On the whole I find concepts like Dharma - 'right living' I think it means - interesting. Life in balance. I don't believe in Karma I I see no evidence to convince me that this is anything other than a single performance, but I do believe in 'what comes around goes around'.
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  purplesofa

  but how far have we gone in questioning morality itself

  Well, I think those that have broke away from the JW's have a much higher sense of morality. Morality in principle, not so much law. We are moral to our conscience. We might be more prone to watch a questionable movie or swear ........you get what I mean, but on issues of greater importance the morals are very high. Adultry, truth, loving your neighbor uncondionally etc. Exposing lies and deceit, manupulation and then warning others.

  We are going higher if that makes sense than the simplicity of what the witness teaching is.

  I'm not very smart .....someone will understand what I am saying and say it better (I HOPE)
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  Honesty

  Well, I think those that have broke away from the JW's have a much higher sense of morality. Morality in principle, not so much law. We are moral to our conscience. We might be more prone to watch a questionable movie or swear ........you get what I mean, but on issues of greater importance the morals are very high. Adultry, truth, loving your neighbor uncondionally etc. Exposing lies and deceit, manupulation and then warning others.

  Purplesofa

  These are exactly my thoughts and feelings on the priciples of love that are shown by an individual's morality.
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  AlmostAtheist

  Since I've been out, I've been working under the beneficial/detrimental rule. If an action will benefit me overall and doesn't bring trouble for anybody else, I go for it. I guess "do no harm" pretty well sums it up. That correlates largely with "morality", but not entirely. I doubt "South Park" would be the moral choice of choice for most JW's. I dig it, I watch it. I think it would be detrimental for my 6-year-old to watch it, so I only watch it alone. (Needless to say, I don't watch it much! :-( )

  Dave
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  Elsewhere

  "Morality" is something I find very interesting. Basically it is something that is good for a given species or community. What I find very interesting is that every species on this planet has different needs for survival, and as a result their "moralities" are different from other species.

  What a human finds to be "moral" is "evil" for a spider.