Not love, not lust, but something in-between

by logansrun 26 Replies latest social relationships

  • Nosferatu
    but I don't believe she isn't going to want to pursue a relationship if she's already taking it to the sexual level.

    This is an excellent point. Women are very good at giving subtle hints, and men are pretty bad at picking up on them. She's probably crazy over this dude, and his disinterest in her is probably fueling her to do something as crazy as this. She's using sex - with a virgin - to lure him.

  • peggy

    I hope this friend of yours stands on his own! I hope that the decision he ultimately makes is his, and his alone! I hope he gives it time, and encourages his friend to do the same. It would be easy to say, "what a great opportunity" here we go! Reality of life is quite different! Emotions can't always be predicted!

    I was pressured by my married psychotherapist to let go of long held moral values. Whether those values came from religion, family, society, I needed to evaluate these long held values for myself! His belief was that man/woman was not meant for monogymy. I had desires for this man, I spent two years in therapy with him. I thought we had a deep connection. The emotional fallout from this experience cannot be fully conveyed! I won't even try.

    I wonder if this girl/woman was raised JW. I wonder her age. I wonder what is behind her decision. I ultimately wonder if one or both will be hurt by this seemingly "great opportunity".

  • Unfettered

    I agree with the thought that we have the capacity to love multiple people and things and also the fact that our love for each of those is different... as long as that love is one of giving rather than possessing. Possession or WANT FOR something for oneself is not love, it is desire. Love is when we feel a desire to give to, protect, help, shelter, make happy someone else without expecting anything in return. That being said, we can do that to many people men and women.

    What complicates matters is that our sexuality is intimately woven with both our physical and emotion selfish DESIRE, as well as our expression of GIVING love. Many times it's difficult to distinguish between the two.

    I think if both people are mature enough or of the same mind they could have a casual sexual encounter without adverse affect. However, this assumes both people are of the same mind and sense of responsibility.

    Let's face it, what's wrong would not the sex itself. What would be wrong is to engage in an activity that would either emotionally or physically cause injury to yourself or the other person... and that means that EVERY situation is unique and not really to be judged by others. The only ones able to judge are the people involved and whatever God they believe in (that is their conscience).

  • Euphemism

    I just wanted to say that I love the expression "hedonic treadmill."

    "Facticity", on the other hand, should be taken out back and shot.

  • Forscher

    I thought that I'd mention for those who are may not know it that the whole romantic love thingy that we worship is nothing more than an elevation of infatuation by medieval bards. It was something they did to get appeal to more clients.

    Before that romanticization, people married for family gain, and had sex to satisfy their sexual needs. The importance of giving one's virginity in marraige only really applied to women and only to insure that the women's family was not peddling damaged goods. Even then, it was alright for a woman who was not a virgin to marry if the groom's family knew what they were getting and the bride price reflected it. Love came to those who cultivated it after the marraige, and still does.

    In many other cultures, virginity is not nescessary or even desired. Among some poleneasian groups, a young women goes to a village deflowerer, a man trained to give a girl her first sexual experience when she reaches a certain age or developement. They think that it is important NOT to leave this first experience in the hands of a fumbling groom on a wedding night. Another culture in the region ENCOURAGES young ladies to lose their virginity and experiment with most of the unmarried males in their villages while they are still quite young. And amazingly enough, pregancies among these girls are very rare prior to marraige. Experts theorize that it may be due to something in the diet at that age that prevents it (my bet is on a lack of something in the young males' diet since they are segregated from the rest of the community and eat differently, and a lack of certain vitamins in a MAN's diet can cause a low enough sperm coutn to make one effectively sterile.). And I could go on and on.

    My point being that I agree that we place too much emphasis virginity at marraige. My first experience came when I got married to a divorcee who was also a mother several times over. IMHO there is much to be said for a first experience with one who knows what they are doing. Of course a beliver would still want to follow the Biblical standard for their position (whether they be virgin, or divorcee, or non-virgin convert) simply because they belive that is the right thing to do. As I said earlier, real love comes later if it is cultivated by both parties.

  • MM090503

    I'm not sure how many have ever been in "that" position. Let me tell you my own experience and story with a similar situation:

    When I was 16 (now 22), I had the hugest crush on one of my coworkers at the store I worked at. For the longest time we never really talked and eventually we did become friends. I flirted with him like crazy, but nothing ever came of it. After about 2 1/2 years of working there for me, he moved to another state for a job (he's 4yrs older than me). We kept in touch through emails and im's. Almost 2yrs ago now he slyly suggested when he came home to visit his parents that him and I should "make out". I was really shocked and thought he was joking, because this was the guy I had always had the hugest crush on and also thought if I were to lose my virginity, it would be to him. So he came home, we made out, no big deal right? Wrong. We continued talking over IM and he was now flirting back to me and making comments here and there. Well we made plans to get together the next time he came home and go a little farther. I confesed to him that I had wanted to lose my virginity to him. He was surprised and excited by this. Well as time went on he met someone he really liked. I hadn't realized it but, my feelings got invovled somewhere along the line (we both said anything we did was just as friends). I was completely jelous over all of this but did not tell him. I actually tried to give him advice as to how to get this girl.

    Well they didnt' work out so when he came home the next time we "got together". We went a little farther each time. We never ended up having sex though. I ended up meeting my bf that I'm with now (who I'm having problems with as a jw HE IS) Well my just as friends buddy, got pretty upset when I "cut him off". He never admitted feelings for me, but he said that if he were to move back here he'd want a chance with me. To this day I remain in contact with my friend and he still thinks one day him and I will have sex. I don't want to anymore because I have a bf and even if I didn't I wouldn't want to because I know old feelings would resurface.

    From being in a similar situation as the one that has been described, I say no don't do that sort of thing because no matter how hard you try, feelings will eventually become involved on someone's part.

    This is just my thoughts on the subject!!

  • SixofNine

    Just how did we all survive our various sexual experiences down to the present??!??

  • bisous

    funny i was having similar thoughts sixy!

    If they are both adults and want to have sex with each other ... and remain friends, have at it.

    have to say I am a bit repulsed by the comments regarding *the opportunity of EXPERIENCING a virgin* ....

    Frankly, it just ain't that BIG of a deal if you are a grownup.

  • SixofNine

    lol, I don't know about that, kissy lady; after all, the more "grown up" you get to be, the more your chances of "experiencing a virgin" deminish. I guess naive angst is the tradeoff for the priviledge of being first. I'd much rather be the "first good lover" than just "the first" anyday :-D

  • bisous

    smiles - I meant that virginity and friendly sex don't really become angst-filled matters if you are a grownup....and maybe not fresh out of a cult.

    the term "experience a virgin" gives me the creeps. And most people will agree that the sexual proclivities of virgin ain't really all that and a bag of chips, give me an experienced lover - thanks much... the appeal for some I think is some trip about teaching or being the first or something...


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