I'm not a Buddhist, but...............PART 2

by Dansk 69 Replies latest jw friends

  • Dansk
    Dansk

    As I can't post to the original thread started by Nicolaou, I'm doing so here:

    Hi Fleur,

    But the part that really, well, frankly creeped me out for lack of a better term, is that he left his wife and child, then starved himself nearly to death before he realized that this wasn't the way to go, and he lived as a homeless person, begging food as he went on his path to enlightenment.

    That's a rather simplified version of events. Today, to leave one's family in seach of the truth (REAL truth) just isn't acceptable, but in the Buddha's day, and particularly in that part of India almost 6000 years before Christ, it was not unusual. Also, when Gautama left his wife and child he didn't leave them destitute, he was a rich prince so, materially, they required nothing.

    If you read more you'll realise that Gautama's wife and son later also joined the Sangha (the order of monks and nuns).

    It is also worth realising that Gautama advised his followers not to believe a word he had spoken but to test everything out for oneself. 'Buddha' means 'enlightened' and there have been many other enlightened souls after him, though these were not not designated as a 'Buddha'. When he almost starved himself to death it was because the teachers he had aligned himself with taught that concentrating on the spiritual while ignoring the physical (the body) was the way to go (a simplified version from me) but after years of this the Buddha realised that this was NOT the way to enlightenment and renounced such practices for all time (it's interesting that those who advocated starving the body later joined the Buddha).

    A truly wonderful book that makes Buddhism simple to understand is Old Path White Clouds, by Thich Nhat Hanh, a Vietnamese Buddhist monk whom my friends have had the privilege of meeting. James Thomas, a wonderful friend here, writes from a Ramanaist perspective (I admire Ramana, also, and his photograph sits alongside the Buddha on my shrine), but Ramana wasn't a Buddha. There are many different levels of spirituality to traverse and Ramana was certainly enlightened with regard to the Presence. The next Buddha is to be called Maitreya - but he won't arrive until truth is lost (but that's another story!).

    As for Buddhism being a cult - that's way off track, but I understand your concern after being a JW. Admittedly, one has to be careful which school of Buddhism one aligns oneself to, i.e. the teacher NOT the school, so it is best to read up on all schools and accept what suits you. I was originally a Therevadin Buddhist, but Mahayana is certainly holding my attention at present.

    James is absolutely right when he says the truth lies within oneself - but that's easier said than done (too abstract for a beginner), which is why reading and finding a good teacher are essential. You can always dispense with teachers and books once you have found truth - but it can take more than this lifetime .

    Another really inspiring book is The Tibetan Book of Living and Dying by Sogyal Rinpoche.

    Buddhism brought me the only true happiness I have ever encountered. Ramana brought me to a better realisation of who I am and that death is nothing to fear. The best book written about Ramana, in my opinion, is Be As You Are - The Teachings of Sri Ramana Maharshi edited by David Godman. Ramana said that if we ask for his presence he will come. I asked and he came - right into my bedroom/shrine room. I love that man (he died in 1950)! I know, sounds cooky - but you're only just starting your journey. There's a lot to discover!

    BTW, beware of internet sites. It is far better to find a good teacher and read recommended books from people you can trust - yes, you can trust me!

    Happy reading and, most of all, welcome to the path!

    Ian

  • Winston Smith :>D
    Winston Smith :>D

    Dansk, thx for the "layman's" overview.

    Best,

    Paul

  • BlackSwan of Memphis
    BlackSwan of Memphis

    I have been reading a little bit about Buddhism and it is really intriguing. One of the things I noticed was that Buddha had not really taught anything specific about God. So, that being said, what is it that most Buddhists believe about death and the afterlife? I will definitely check out the book you suggested. I was just curious. Oh, and aren't Buddhists pacifists?

  • Dansk
    Dansk

    Hi BSofM,

    I have been reading a little bit about Buddhism and it is really intriguing. One of the things I noticed was that Buddha had not really taught anything specific about God. So, that being said, what is it that most Buddhists believe about death and the afterlife? I will definitely check out the book you suggested. I was just curious. Oh, and aren't Buddhists pacifists?
    One doesn't have to believe in God to be a Buddhist - but one can also believe in him if one wants to. I guess it all depends on one's perception of God. I believe in spirit but not an Almighty Creator.

    When we die we go to another bardo (plain of "existence") to await rebirth, which could be back to earth, in higher spiritual realms or, sadly, even lower realms. All these realms are impermanent and, providing one is well aware of what to expect at death, can determine which realm to enter. Read about the bardos in the Tibetan Book of Living and Dying. Buddhists are pacifists in the sense that disputes should be settled by peaceful means and that war and violence are unjustifiable. However, some people take this to mean that if they slap me across the face they can then do it again and again. Some Buddhists would, in fact, do nothing. Others would respond by restraining the attacker (i.e. stopping the blows without overly retaliating). If possible, it is always best to walk away from confrontation. Ian

  • BlackSwan of Memphis
    BlackSwan of Memphis

    Aha!!

    So, that being said, do Buddhists go to war??

  • Fleur
    Fleur

    Hi there Dansk,

    Wow, imagine you going to all the trouble to start a thread just to reply to me! I really appreciate it. I appreciate you setting me straight on so many things...I know what I read was the 'beginners' simplified version, maybe perhaps it could be called "Buddhism for Dummies" LOL.

    This comment that you made to Swan really appeals to me:

    One doesn't have to believe in God to be a Buddhist - but one can also believe in him if one wants to. I guess it all depends on one's perception of God. I believe in spirit but not an Almighty Creator. When we die we go to another bardo (plain of "existence") to await rebirth, which could be back to earth, in higher spiritual realms or, sadly, even lower realms. All these realms are impermanent and, providing one is well aware of what to expect at death, can determine which realm to enter. Read about the bardos in the Tibetan Book of Living and Dying.

    I haven't had my coffee yet so I have to let your post sink in, and read and re-read (will print out) but I want you to know that your insight and wisdom is much appreciated; and very welcomed. I look forward to discussing this! I'll be back in a bit with more thoughts.

    love and thanks,

    essie

  • Dansk
    Dansk

    BSofM,

    So, that being said, do Buddhists go to war??

    Buddhists do not go to war. Those who called themselves Buddhists and have fought in wars immediately ceased to be Buddhists.

    To give an example, China has occupied Tibet since 1950. Over 1.2 million Tibetans have died. Here's what the Dalai Lama said:

    'We are freedom fighters unique in our peaceful
    approach to liberation….....should this experiment
    prove successful it could have a revolutionary
    effect on future struggles for freedom.'

    Some Tibetans did take up arms. If you are a Buddhist and take up arms you must be prepared to face the consequences (karma) - rather like Jesus said: "He who lives by the sword shall perish by the sword." However, to take up arms immediately goes against Buddhist teaching. No wars have been fought in the name of Buddhism.

  • BlackSwan of Memphis
    BlackSwan of Memphis

    THANK YOU!

    You made a point that I have been trying to get figured out for so long.

    JW's believe that their's is the only group of people who do not get involved with war. However, I had read much of Buddhism for Dummies some months back and when I came to chapter 7 reverance for life it made me wonder how serious Buddhists take this.

    Are most Buddhists vegetarians?

    Where can I get the books you mentioned?

  • Fleur
    Fleur

    oh my, there is book called Buddhism for dummies? i should have known!

    No wars have been fought in the name of Buddhism.

    that right there puts them light years ahead of any other faith i can think of!

    i was thinking the same thing, swan, that most buddhists must be vegetarians. have considered it for so long anyway, am definitely drawn toward the concept.

    dansk i can't post or even read the original thread anymore either so thank you again for posting this. questions tumble round in my head faster than i can translate them to type. i don't want to bombard you or make you tired answering all the questions, but can you tell me what your take, as a Buddhist, is about the Tsunami? i am looking right now on the news at footage of a huge buddhist temple in sri lanka that is now an orphanage.

    the death toll is up over 100,000 now. what do you feel about that as a buddhist?

    thank you so much for taking the time to answer, whenever you are up to it. please know that if my questions come across as badly worded or short that i am really not well physically this week and should be in bed but the hunger my mind and heart have to make some sense of all of this going on is driving me onward.

    love,

    essie

    (of the 'can't promise i'll convert but a lot of this makes sense to me' class...) ;)

  • Dansk
    Dansk

    BSofM

    Are most Buddhists vegetarians?

    Where can I get the books you mentioned?

    Many Buddhists are not vegetarians - and I wouldn't like to say that most are because I genuinely don't know. I'm a vegan, but that came about through my illness and not through being a Buddhist.

    When a monk begs for alms and someone puts meat in his bowl he is allowed to eat it because the meat wasn't killed specifically for him. However, if, say, someone had a chicken and said "Wait there while I kill this chicken for you" the monk, and the general Buddhist, would refuse. However, there are Buddhist schools which advocate complete abstention from eating meat and fish. Like I said, you'd need to examine each school's teachings. As a general rule of thumb, one wouldn't expect an animal to be sacrificed so that one could eat if there are plenty of vegetables available.

    On the other hand, if a family was starving and there was only some livestock available they would not be frowned upon for sacrificing the animals to save the family. When you get into Buddhism proper you will realise that it is a religion/philosophy of common sense. Humans are the highest form of life - but they must respect all sentient beings equally. I know it would appear that there are some anomalies, but remember karma also comes into play.

    The books are available (generally) from http://www.abebooks.co.uk/ and Amazon.

    Interesting point about vegetarianism, because even as a vegetarian life is sacrificed - calves for the milk their mothers give, the lining of the cow's stomach to make cheese, eggs, etc. Also, kirlian photographs have shown even plants emit auras - and we kill thousands of living microbes just by breathing. As I said, one must be sensible and do the best one can to make good karma by being loving and caring to all life as far as is humanly possible.

    I wish you much happy reading. It's a truly fascinating journey you are embarking on!

    Ian

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