MY CELIBACY VOW AND OTHER QUESTIONS!
Tresbella- I understand what you're saying in your last post. You're in a hard situation and you feel like you have to go through the motions until you're ready to go off on your own. But like Narkissos said in his post you should take some time to figure out what's best for you. What I'm saying is if you have to put up a front for now then do it but if you're heart isn't in it then you might want to try to somehow appease the people around you without getting enveloped in it. The further you get into it the harder it is to get out. As far as being young and not being able to get up and leave without risks being involved--I completely know where you're at. I think some people either forget what it was like having your whole life dictated and planned out. The transition into adulthood is always difficult but I would multiply that difficulty by 10 for JWs. The only clear suggetion I can come up with about this is, since you're in school you might be able to find a 5-10 hour a week job on the campus...if you haven't done this already. It may not help out greatly with financial independance but it'll start you in that direction. Look into all the possibilities (job, internship, volunteering) of building up job experience. And remember that when you finally leave your parents home, it's supposed to be a little scarey.
MY GOODNESS! I can't believe how almost everybody is hating on me for making a vow of celibacy? Not trying to sound like I'm preaching or anything but should we all ignore the fact that fornication isn't exactly on the top of God's list? MAN! You'd think I just confessed my plans to join Bethel or something the way everyone is jumping down my throat! Excuuuuuse me for wanting to not have to worry about crabs, preganancy and wasting money on pricey condoms for awhile. I made my vow and I did it for myself; not for anyone else. Just b/c I don't necessarily believe in the WT anymore does not mean I should just fly off the handle and tottally become this "ohhh, I can have sex, lie,cheat and steal and not have to worry about feeling guilty" mentality. I feel good about my decision. everyone who's hating can BURN. You've all seemed to pay no compassion for the ones who are still young and still stuck in 2 worlds. So much for no judging. -TRESBELLA
Tresbella - I understand your situation. When I was 18 and under, I lived with my parents. Then I moved into a dorm (they allowed me to, would yours allow you to do that?) and that helped me. Currently I do not live with them and feel really good about being able to be who I am. I also work....I work AND go to school...its really not as hard as you think. Your college MIGHT be able to get you labeled as an independant student if you explain that your parents will abandon you if you don't want to be a JW...which will get you more money. Maybe think about applying to live in a dorm the next time you fill out your FAFSA? Get loans and grants to continue school...you can do it, there is always a way!
Also, to remain celebate, good luck to you, that is a very hard thing to acomplish. Make sure you are doing it for the right reasons, to make you feel happy...not to please someone else, just keep your goal in mind. God knows what is in your heart, do you really think it matters to him if there is a legal contract from the US government? I am married to my S/O in my heart...just not officially and I do not think God thinks less of me, only my parents do. Plus remember that there were not always government contracts and marriage was about property at some point...so it is not as holy as one might think. Anyway good luck on getting married, its a great thing to find a nice partner to share the rest of your life with.
I hope you find the answers you need. And I hope my advice helped.
Nobody is hating on you..
1. When you feel tempted.....PRAY!!
3. Whether it's on your publisher's card or in a letter, you can betcha the elders in your new congregation will know everything suspicious or not "approved" that you've done in the past, whether you're on reproof or not. I know this from my own past experiences.
4. If you really wanna "suck it up," I suppose it won't hurt to try. At least, that way you'll know.
5. a. Depends on whether you believe God's written in a book or not. b. It's your personal belief...and that's between you and the God you put your faith in. c. You can be an ax murderer and/or a bank robber and have faith in God, but ppl will say you're a psycho anyway and no one will believe you're a follower of God, even though God speaks to you and tells you to kill those ppl and rob those banks.
6. That's "old light" and it would now be considered to be apostate to promote that idea. (shhhhhh)
7. a. Because some ppl are inherently evil and greedy sociopaths or probably bi-polar having many manic episodes. I seriously doubt that God felt the need to allow his sovereignty to be tested. b. That'd be terribly vicious and cruel if that's why so many have suffered and died from wars and diseases in the past and continue to do so today. And on a lighter note, it'd be like sitting down with someone to arm wrestle. After all....God supposedly only had angels to convince of his sovereignty.....I can see the angelic book right now...."God's Sovereignty for Dummie Angels"
1.)O.K So last night I made a vow of celibacy to God. An official promise in prayer to not fornicate so that maybe I too can have a special wedding night. (my boyfriend was surprisingly supportive) I remember reading a scripture that says a promise made to God should be taken very serious. Anyone have any suggestions in how I can keep it?here's something that may help:
2.) Last night at my theocratic meeting the bro. was giving a talk on main points from the district convention so nautrally everyone pulled out their notes. But I noticed that many people had all the same exact notebook with the same cover sheet and notes inside. I've realized that during WT studies and bookstudies many have all the ansewrs including additional ansewrs taken apparently from some type of website. I've heard rumors about websites that give out WT comments as if you're really saying them in your own words and even all ready written up talks. Anybody know of these websites?
my 2 guesses are 1) there is a large study group that meets to prepare for meeting or 2) they get their answers off a JW message board. the similarity in notebooks could be coincidental (like if everyone tends to go shopping while out in field service and stops at the same stationery......)
3.) Besides your field service history what else is on a publishers card? I heard that when you move to a new congregation (like I myself did 2 years ago but still haven't joined the school) all the problems you had, elder meetings and so on are all recorded on that card. Is that true?
4.) In my old congreagation the elders found out about my boyfriend at the time (I denied everything) and also I was accused of asking too many unnecessary questions and was in risk of "independant thinking" and not "conforming to Jehovah's standards" (this was due to my relentless research and the more I found out about like organ transplants, inconsistincies in the wt and failed prohecies; the more I wanted to speak up ) well it proved uselss but I am suspecting that all this is on my publishers card. The reason I say all this is b/c next week I plan to finally join the school to get my mom off my back. Can I be told that I cannot join b/c of what may be on my publishers card or can I just put on that stepford smile and pretend I'm that perfect angel that the elders want me to be?
if question #3 is yes, then you run the risk of not joining the school. The stepford smile is a winner though.
5.) Where do you draw the line between being a follower of God and not being one? Is it your actions or faith or both. Can you be an ax murderer and bank robber but at the same time have faith in God and still be considered a follower of God?
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You judge by human standards; I pass judgment on no one.
You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge the other, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things. Romans 14:1
Accept him whose faith is weak, without passing judgment on disputable matters.
You, then, why do you judge your brother? Or why do you look down on your brother? For we will all stand before God's judgment seat. 2 Corinthians 5:10
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that each one may receive what is due him for the things done while in the body, whether good or bad.
Just as man is destined to die once, and after that to face judgment,
because judgment without mercy will be shown to anyone who has not been merciful. Mercy triumphs over judgment!
6.) Am I still that generation that "may never get old" that I was always told when I was younger or has that changed? I don't hear that expression used anymore?I think you know the answer to that one
7.) So why is their crime, violence and everything else bad? Is it b/c God's sovereignty was tested like the WT teaching explains? What is your explanation.crime, violence and everything else bad has always existed. so this God person allegedly allows bad things to happen just so he can prove a point? and is it really that important to prove the "devil" wrong, a character that God himself created? the premise here is that people choose to serve god for selfish reasons. well, this same God gives laws that are so strict, so severe that if people dont follow them they shall be put to death. is it any wonder then that people are scared s***less of this God! it's self-preservation, nothing more.
Tres your 21... if you want to remain celibate till marriage then go for it. (i was 19 when i got married and virginity kinda ruined the romantic wedding night ) i'm almost 40 now.. and celibate not by choice.. my companion is unable to have sex.. so get married soon ( although, not just for sex) and use it before you lose it!
i dont think anyone here condemns you for your life choices..if attending meetings and stuff is what you want to do , then do it! Its just a lot of us have been there and done that and have hindsight. so dont take offense at some of the replies.. opinons are like assholes.. everyone has one.
I'll address your questions all in a general way, and I think the best thing I can point out is the emphasis on behavior control vs. what I would call real spirituality. Now mind you I don't say this in any critical way, but I think a lot of times people are basically torn in different directions, when the way to stick with anything is to have all parts of you integrated as a whole, like the scripture talking about worshipping God with the whole heart, whole soul, whole mind etc. Mind you, this has nothing to do with an idea of what you should do, and then a struggle to follow that - that would be (attempted) behavior control. But when every part of you is all 'on the same page' as they say, then there is no question of keeping vows or anything - it would be a given. Because even if you keep it, if you are split between yourself all you will have is a struggle on your hands, you only got one part of yourself to hold back the other part, so there would be a part of you that wants different even if you didn't actually have sex. In other words, I'm talking about making peace with yourself. You can see that really just makes sense for anything you want to do, otherwise you're going to be split.
As far as what this has to do with your other questions, it actually has to do with behavior control in a way. The mind basically wants to know things, but you can no doubt atleast see that some things you just don't know. So the reality is the mind doesn't have control over the behavior believed to be "knowing" - which is not to say you can't think about it, but you might save yourself some energy and struggle by a recognition of that on some level. In another way, with all the many questions you have it indicates the split nature of mind (which is not to say just you, but all minds) - and that relates to the idea of uniting yourself on all levels. So for that matter if you have a specific question that's really a burning issue for you, lets start with that - but there is a lot that you brought up and to really go into all of them would take a lot of time and discussion probably. Also the answer may require things to be put into a larger context, so it's also a matter of how far you really want to get into it.
I just wanted to know something Tres, is the reasoning behind your vow primarily because you think that premarital sex is a sin, or that you want to remain pure for your future husband? Just a thought, I think that's what billygoat did before she married Mozzer
In defense of Tres, if she wants to take this route, I'm all for it. There are, of course, all sorts of good reasons why people should sleep around a bit before they settle down but if a hot woman like Tresbella (which i believe she is) wants to remain a virgin, guys you have to respect her choice, just as you would anyone here who takes the plunge by freakin'. And if by remaining a virgin she's denying her perfectly hot body to the kind of guys who regard hot women's bodies as public amenities, well, In a way I understand. Heck, If I were a woman with a hot body and I was given a choice between virginity and sleeping with some of you guys who believe that women with hot bodies are obligated to sleep with them, I might choose virginity too. BTW, good luck Tres on the marriage, hope the wedding works out. Send pics!!
Wow!!!!! You do have a lot of questions, which in my opinion is a good thing. I haven't had time to read other peoples' replies but as I scanned the names, from my experience, they have likely given you some good advice.
If I may give some advice, don't commit to anything further until you have those questions answered. It will do you no good to pretend that they don't exist. You need them answered.