Bush Documents a Forgery

by Yizuman 40 Replies latest social current

  • czarofmischief
    czarofmischief

    Czar, you make a huge unfounded leap in going from "they are forged" to " I really think Kerry okayed this..." You are trying to shift the focus from being on "Bush's going AWOL" to "Kerry had documents forged to show that Bush went AWOL."

    Okay, so maybe Kerry didn't know what his campaign was up to. Maybe that's what the problem IS with his campaign. And I'm genuinely stepping outside my Bush supporter role and trying to be a dispassionate analyst of political strategy. Forget that I am a Bush supporter. That's not what I'm talking about. I'm not shifting ANY focus. That's the point - I don't HAVE to. Somebody had these documents forged. That is ALL that the public is going to remember. It doesn't matter what the real truth of Bush's service is: I don't think that anybody cares what Bush did at that time. But the beauty is that as long as Kerry, or his supporters, keep bringing up these documents, it is TOO EASY TO SHOOT DOWN by just saying, "They were forged. You guys are slimy forgers and liars."

    Face it, it was a bad move, a very bad move, one that has discredited not only a distinguished journalist but also Kerry's campaign. Too many soundbites can flow from this stuff. Just drop it. It's like going offsides in soccer - you can keep running around like the referee didn't blow his whistle, but the other team is going to grab the ball and score point after point unless you react to reality!

    I can understand your passionate desire for those documents to be vetted. If I hated somebody as much as you guys hate Bush I would love for something like this to be true, too. But they were forged. Your best strategy is to drop it, get the ball back, and then come out strong on issues that the Democrats can make hay on. This Vietnam stuff bogged down lots of Americans thirty years ago and it isn't going to do anybody any good now.

    If Kerry hadn't started the mudslinging by trying to present himself as a loyal soldier, then the swift boat would never have happened. If he had responded quickly and forecefully to the swift boat ads, maybe he could have pulled a draw on the issue. Every time he assaults Bush's military record he winds up getting slaughtered. A Democrat cannot win on a Vietnam issue. And the real mud hasn't even flown from our side yet! If you think the swift boat ad was bad, there are TONS more nasty things that could be said. He is so vulnerable, especially when it comes to his (admittedly "exaggerated") testimony before Congress when he came back from his four months, that it woudl be better to have ignored the issue completely.

    I'm not even actually attacking the man, but his campaign is a disaster. I don't know what the problem is, but Kerry is getting eaten alive. Even his own side, the liberal pundits and cartoonists, are mocking his indecision. See Ted Rall's cartoon where the slogan is "Kerry, Dare to Not Dream".

    What Johnny needed to do was come out strong with a plan for domestic policies -what he's done is bungle everything on a war that we lost thirty years ago. Like I said, it's painful to watch. Especially when there are so many good kids that I respect putting their hopes in him to pull something big out of his hat. I just don't think he can do it now.

    CZAR

  • myauntfanny
    myauntfanny
    It doesn't matter what the real truth of Bush's service is: I don't think that anybody cares what Bush did at that time.

    I think quite a lot of people do care. Maybe young people who think Viet Nam was just a movie might not care. But the people who went to Viet Nam and came back with missing parts and crippling psychiatric disorders, the people who lost brothers and fathers and best friends, the COs who spent time in jail, the people who watched themselves engage in atrocities they'd never have imagined, I bet they all care. Bush got a preferment into a cushy gig during wartime and didn't even bother to honour his comparatively trivial obligations. At any other time in US history this would be an enormous scandal. As it is, I think that in spite of the conservative media whitewashing this almost into oblivion, many people of both parties are conscious of it and deeply disturbed, even if their main preoccupation right now is fear of the outside world.

  • RevMalk
    RevMalk

    It's funny how the same people who didn't think Kerry's Vietnam fiasco was a big deal are now jumping on the band wagon regarding Bush's service.

    Same crap as usual. We take our sides in these things, and what the 'other' people do seems more important to us. It's human nature.

    However, the fact of this matter and this thread:

    The docs were forged. That doesn't say much for the Kerry side, which includes his supporters (at least most of them).

    Rev

  • RevMalk
  • RevMalk
    RevMalk
    CBS: We Were Duped
    Monday, September 20, 2004 By Liza Porteus

    The man who gave CBS (search) controversial documents that have fueled a firestorm of controversy over President Bush's Vietnam-era Texas Air National Guard ( search ) service has admitted that he deliberately misled the television network, CBS said Monday in a statement.

    Over the weekend, CBS' veteran news anchor Dan Rather ( search ) flew to Texas to interview Bill Burkett ( search ), a man who was believed by some to be the source of the memos.

    CBS said Monday that Burkett did in fact mislead a CBS News producer about the documents. The network acknowledged that, based upon subsequent reporting on questions about the documents, it cannot prove they are authentic and therefore, they should not have been used in its "60 Minutes" report on Sept. 8.

    Click Here to Read the CBS Documents

    "Burkett, a retired National Guard lieutenant colonel, also admits that he deliberately misled the CBS News producer working on the report, giving her a false account of the documents' origins to protect a promise of confidentiality to the actual source," network spokeswoman Kelli Edwards said in the statement.

    Burkett's full interview will be aired on Monday night's edition of "CBS Evening News with Dan Rather," from 6:30 p.m. to 7 p.m. EDT.

    "'60 Minutes Wednesday' had full confidence in the original report or it would not have aired," CBS News President Andrew Heyward said in a statement.

    "However, in the wake of serious and disturbing questions that came up after the broadcast, CBS News has done extensive additional reporting in an effort to confirm the documents' authenticity ? Based on what we now know, CBS News cannot prove that the documents are authentic, which is the only acceptable journalistic standard to justify using them in the report. We should not have used them. That was a mistake, which we deeply regret. Nothing is more important to us than our credibility and keeping faith with the millions of people who count on us for fair, accurate, reliable, and independent reporting. We will continue to work tirelessly to be worthy of that trust."

    The Tiffany network and its management are commissioning an independent review.

    Rather himself also issued a statement, saying, "I no longer have the confidence in these documents that would allow us to continue vouching for them journalistically," adding that airing the documents was an "error in judgment."

    "I find we have been misled on the key question of how our source for the documents came into possession of these papers," Rather continued. "That, combined with some of the questions that have been raised in public and in the press, leads me to a point where ? if I knew then what I know now ? I would not have gone ahead with the story as it was aired, and I certainly would not have used the documents in question."

    "It's about time. I think CBS is the last group in America that doesn't understand these are forgeries ? and really abusive forgeries," former Republican National Committee Chairman Bill Brock told FOX News after the statement was released. "Hallelujah they are finally admitted they were wrong and I hope they will be very forthcoming about their source and that they were duped."

    Since the imbroglio began three weeks ago, the network has expressed confidence in the unidentified sources of the documents and the memos themselves, which suggest that Bush received special treatment to get into the Texas Air National Guard and may not have fulfilled his obligations to the Guard.

    After a myriad of document experts and others came forward questioning the authenticity of the papers, CBS said last week it would further investigate the authenticity of the memos.

    "We've said we are trying very hard to get to the bottom of these questions," Heyward said over the weekend.

    Top network executives huddled throughout the weekend and refined the wording of its correction and apology throughout Monday morning.

    CBS went into a "defensive crouch" and should have acknowledged sooner the possibility they were duped, Richard Cohen, a syndicated columnist for The Washington Post, told FOX News on Monday.

    But "I essentially think it's a tempest in the teapot ? it was a mistake ? all news organizations make mistakes ? if they're aggressive and really care about covering the news ? it's part of the business."

    Burkett has urged Democratic activists to wage "war" against Republican "dirty tricks."

    Adding more fuel to the fire, Burkett, who lives in Abilene, Texas, has now also said that he passed the documents on to former Sen. Max Cleland, a Georgia Democrat and triple amputee from Vietnam, who is working with the Kerry campaign.

    Burkett's had a long-running feud with Bush over health benefits and the Texas National Guard. Bob Hunter, a Republican legislator who investigated Burkett's charges, told FOX News he found them to be groundless.

    Over the weekend, Bush commented publicly on the issue for the first time.

    "There are a lot of questions about the documents, and they need to be answered," he told The Union Leader of Manchester, N.H. The president has continued to maintain that he is proud to have served in the Guard.

    The original CBS report mainly relied on four memos purportedly written by the deceased Lt. Jerry B. Killian. Dated in the early 1970s, the papers say that Killian was pressured to "sugarcoat" the young Lt. Bush's record and that he ignored a direct order to take a physical.

    But many experts have come forth to say that the typeface and other features of the memos most likely were written on a personal computer using Microsoft Word instead of typewriters common 30 years ago. Others who were familiar with Killian have come forth ? including his own family members ? and have said there is no way Killian would have written such memos.

    The Bush-Cheney campaign has maintained that campaign staffers of Democratic presidential nominee John Kerry are behind the memo snafu.

    FOX News' Major Garrett and Kelly Wright contributed to this report.

  • Farkel
    Farkel

    RevMalk,

    For some strange reason, the naysayers on this thread are conspicuously silent. Even Dan Blather issued a retraction and an apology.

    Farkel

  • teejay
    teejay

    As I posted elsewhere...

    What did or didn't happen 30yrs ago in Alabama or Cambodia (or not) doesn't merit the national/global attention it's getting. Let folks at the periphery of the campaign battle out the superfluous nonsense. We're living in some serious times -- America is at war and I'm not talking about the quagmire in Iraq -- so the candidates should stop playing these stupid kiddy games and focus on the here and now.

  • outoftheorg
    outoftheorg

    GOOD OLD DAN RATHER. OR AS FARKEL SAYS IT, DAN BLATHER.

    BACK IN 1979 I MANAGED AND IH MOTOR TRUCK DIV. SERVICE CENTER IN ROCK SPRINGS WYO.

    THE OIL FIELDS, THE TRONA MINES, THE COAL MINES, AND THE URANIUM MINES WERE AT FULL PRODUCTION AND DISCOVERY EFFORTS.

    GOOD OLD DAN COMES TO TOWN AND DOES A NATION WIDE NEWS SEGMENT ON THE HORRIBLE PROSTITUTION PROBLEM IN LITTLE OLD ROCK SPRINGS WYO.

    LIKE THIS IS UNHEARD OF IN NEW YORK, WHERE HE LIVES AND PONTIFICATES.

    THE NEWS SEGMENT AND GOOD OLD BLATHER WAS IN ITS OWN WAY SO PATHETIC, THE LOCAL POLITICAL LEADERS ALMOST CHANGED THE NAME OF THE SMALL TOWNS MAIN STREET TO "DAN RATHER AVENUE".

    I THINK THEY ACTUALLY VOTED ON IT. WHAT A PATHETIC SELF IMPORTANT GOOF BALL.

    Outoftheorg

  • RevMalk
    RevMalk
    RevMalk,

    For some strange reason, the naysayers on this thread are conspicuously silent. Even Dan Blather issued a retraction and an apology.

    Farkel

    Ya, I noticed that....

  • RunningMan
    RunningMan
    Uh, no. Do a tiny bit of research before you write something as fatuous as "end of story". Jesus.

    Ahem.

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